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Old 19th November 2016, 13:18   #91
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Default Re: Santro doesnt start when HOT

Can I ask you, why you repeatedly overhaul the starter motor instead of just replacing it with a brand new one which has warranty etc.
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Old 19th November 2016, 14:31   #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sujithsidhardha View Post
Apologies for digging out an old thread, But its a real time problem i am facing now.



Flashback:



I was facing the same issue with my Santro Zip Plus 2002 for quite a long time. Car starts without any issues in the morning. During those days, i was visiting ASC's only and they overhauled the starter and issues got resolved. This happened around 3 times in the life span. One time, they advised to change the battery. When i visited the battery shop, they told me that there is no problem with the battery. But i insisted them to replace it and got it replaced. Anyway the problem got resolved some how after battery replacement. (Must be a weak battery that needs charging, which i didn't cared to recheck or don't want to take any chances)



Present Scenario:



For the last 1 and a half years, i am facing the same issue very often. Since i had a relocation i had to visit another ASC. They overhauled the starter motor twice, chance the solenoid once during my 3 visits one by one. On last visit, they advised me to change the battery, which i didn't do, instead, i charged the battery myself. Anyway after that, issue got resolved. All these visits were happened at least every 6 months.



Now the problem started again. I want to get it sorted out with a permanant solution and want peace of mind. I got held up twice in a week. After a long journey, stopped at the petrol pump for refill and car failed to start. Another time at a traffic signal. Starter motor starts and within a second, cranking stops completely with difficulty in cranking.



When i faced the problem, i placed the battery on another santro. It started more than 10 times one after another without any issues. So the starter motor was overhauled again and the brushes got changed at a local workshop. Still after running for sometime, problem returns. Mechanic is suspecting the armature of the starter motor. But, from the reply from "tanwaramit", changing the armature didn't worked for him. So i kept the car with him and instructed him to check with another starter motor.



Meanwhile, requesting advice and suggestions from fellow bhpians who got the similar issues resolved.

What worked for me was a battery change. I have the same thing documented in one of the threads , maybe this one but after suffering for a while, changing the starter motor, alternator included, that's what helped me. Instead of putting your battery in another car, do it the other way exchange it with someone for a couple of days .
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Old 19th November 2016, 15:50   #93
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Default Re: Santro doesnt start when HOT

I had this problem in my Santro AT. What it turned out to be was a battery on the way out. As a hot engine due to its compression may require more juice to turn over, a marginal battery can lead to this. I always thought it was a cold engine which needed more juice. I changed the battery and then ran the car well for over a year, with no trouble.
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Old 19th November 2016, 16:51   #94
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Default Re: Santro doesnt start when HOT

But is this a Santro AT, the poster hasn't mentioned anywhere that he has an AT.
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Old 20th November 2016, 09:49   #95
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Default Re: Santro doesnt start when HOT

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Originally Posted by lurker View Post
But is this a Santro AT, the poster hasn't mentioned anywhere that he has an AT.
The issue is the same. AT or MT matters only when the beastie fires up. Only with an AT push starting is out, so the problem becomes more acute. I keep jumpers in both my cars for this reason.
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Old 21st November 2016, 09:40   #96
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Default Re: Santro doesnt start when HOT

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Originally Posted by lurker View Post
Can I ask you, why you repeatedly overhaul the starter motor instead of just replacing it with a brand new one which has warranty etc.
Overhaul from ASC is opening the starter motor, clean it and put it back and costs somewhere around 450/-. A new starter motor costs somewhere around 5000/-. More over, they haven't even identified what the issue was. Along with that hey didn't asked my permission before overhauling. I had to create an issue during the last overhauling (during solenoid change), as the same service center had done an overhauling a month ago.

Seems Hyundai ASC's ultimate aim now is to create maximum revenue. Now a days their professionalism and quality has been degraded a lot. I can really feel that during these years of ownership.
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Old 21st November 2016, 13:18   #97
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Default Re: Santro doesnt start when HOT

Update: Mechanic opened the starter and replaced the brushes initially and put everything back in place. Drove the car for some time and the problem exists. Now the suspect is armature. Solenoid is already ruled out, as the replacement was recent and they didn't find any issues while checking it. They tried to rewind the armature and later concluded that there is some issue with the armature. A replacement is better than repairing it. So replaced the armature and its working fine now. No more issue when engine is hot. Drove around 50 Kms, stopped around 10 times during the drive. Waited for 2 to 3 minutes before starting and now the car starts without any issues.

Seems, its concluded that the issue was with the starter motor itself. Any way, let me see how long it goes with the replaced armature. Had to pay 2K for all the work and parts. Anyway, i am glad that the issue is clearly identified now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sgiitk View Post
I had this problem in my Santro AT. What it turned out to be was a battery on the way out. As a hot engine due to its compression may require more juice to turn over, a marginal battery can lead to this. I always thought it was a cold engine which needed more juice. I changed the battery and then ran the car well for over a year, with no trouble.
Mine is MT. was also confused with the strange behavior. Until i had the opportunity to swap the battery, i suspected the battery. I was even planning to buy another battery. But my previous experiences along with my testing pulled me back. I had to identify the actual issue, before spending anything.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sammyboy View Post
What worked for me was a battery change. I have the same thing documented in one of the threads , maybe this one but after suffering for a while, changing the starter motor, alternator included, that's what helped me. Instead of putting your battery in another car, do it the other way exchange it with someone for a couple of days .
Tried both ways. Recreated the situation by driving for some time. When i faced the issue in cranking, connected my battery in another santro and it started without any issues as mentioned in my original port. At the same time, connected the other battery (Its a new battery) on my santro and i was facing the same issue. So ruled out the issue with battery. Battery is working fine. Checked the negative terminal connectivity as well.
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Old 22nd November 2016, 20:24   #98
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Default Re: Santro doesnt start when HOT

Was the current drawn by the starter ever measured?
Armature put on a growler?

Regards
Sutripta
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Old 23rd November 2016, 09:35   #99
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Default Re: Santro doesnt start when HOT

Quote:
Originally Posted by sujithsidhardha View Post
Seems, its concluded that the issue was with the starter motor itself. Any way, let me see how long it goes with the replaced armature. Had to pay 2K for all the work and parts. Anyway, i am glad that the issue is clearly identified now.

Mine is MT. was also confused with the strange behavior. Until i had the opportunity to swap the battery, i suspected the battery. I was even planning to buy another battery. But my previous experiences along with my testing pulled me back. I had to identify the actual issue, before spending anything.

Tried both ways. Recreated the situation by driving for some time. When i faced the issue in cranking, connected my battery in another santro and it started without any issues as mentioned in my original port. At the same time, connected the other battery (Its a new battery) on my santro and i was facing the same issue. So ruled out the issue with battery. Battery is working fine. Checked the negative terminal connectivity as well.
Good to learn that starter issues still exist, and you are back in business. You took the right approach to find the problem.

The last time I had a starter needing work was during my Maruti Esteem days.

Ten years ago I would have picked up the starter as the prime suspect, no more. As for MT or AT it matters only when the engine fires up. Only as I said earlier with an AT push starting is out.
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Old 24th November 2016, 17:12   #100
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Default Re: Santro doesnt start when HOT

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sutripta View Post
Was the current drawn by the starter ever measured?
Armature put on a growler?

Regards
Sutripta
I am not sure, whether the current drawn by the starter was measured.

But the drop in voltage at the time of ignition was measured by me, battery shop technician and the mechanic. During cold starts, it never went less than 10 volt. But when the engine is hot, i saw the multi meter reading went to less than 2 volt on both the batteries i tried. I suspected both the batteries and at the same time, thought about an internal short in starter motor as well.
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