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Old 4th October 2005, 16:48   #1
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Default tata safari suspension issue?

Hi guys,

I went for a spin to mercara from bangalore over the weekend with my dog and we enjoyed the trip. But i had an observation that i wanted to verify with you guys while i was driving my vehicle over the fantastically pot-holed roads enroute!

Every time i tried to slow myself down, i felt the vehicle shift to the left a little bit. This only used to happen over some really lumpy roads and only when i tended to brake a little suddenly. I thought of 3 different reasons for this behaviour:
1. the shock absorbers are too stiff and the vehicle does not yield gracefully and hence it slides sideways
2. the tyres (bridgestone dueller 255R15s) are too hard and dont sink down into the obstructions
3. maybe improper driving with a little much clutch while braking causing a little freewheeling of the vehicle combined with an alignment issue

Either way, i was a little puzzled with the behaviour. It did not bother me and i still did mysore-mercara in 2 hours 20 mins which was reasonably quick but it made me a little more careful on the curves and the really bad sections of the road. If you guys think that this is an issue only with safaris or the style of driving then let me know.

thanks for your help
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Old 4th October 2005, 17:29   #2
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This is surely an issue with the alignement of the tyres! The wheels are not popularly aligned so will tend to go left or right on braking depending on current toe, caster and camber settings!
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Old 4th October 2005, 17:57   #3
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The Safari does not have a Camber adjustment, Only Toe which can be adjusted.

The Camber can be adjusted by inserting Shim's between the Top Plate housing.
Might be the 255's have had some affect on the Camber as well.

From My Experience The Bridgestones dont perform on a Safari and tend to have these issues. I wonder why though ... could never figure out ... .i had them i my earlier Safari and did have them in the current one (Read New) as well ( now am running Yokohama Geolander AT+II :-) handles like a dream).
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Old 4th October 2005, 18:17   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SUV
The Safari does not have a Camber adjustment....

The Camber can be adjusted by inserting Shim's between the Top Plate housing.

First you say it can't, then you say it can....
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Old 4th October 2005, 19:13   #5
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I remember hearing / reading somewhere that the New Safari has a problem of getting sideways (well not in the sporty means ) under little exploitation. I guess some magzine posted it in their Safari DICOR test coverage.
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Old 4th October 2005, 19:16   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stratos
I remember hearing / reading somewhere that the New Safari has a problem of getting sideways (well not in the sporty means ) under little exploitation. I guess some magzine posted it in their Safari DICOR test coverage.
that explains their advertisement
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Old 4th October 2005, 19:21   #7
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Quote:
Every time i tried to slow myself down, i felt the vehicle shift to the left a little bit.
Its to do with the brakes - Autocarindia pointed this out in their testdrive. Probably a brake bias issue, but scary nevertheless.

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Old 4th October 2005, 19:33   #8
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Quote:
Its to do with the brakes
yup, i think so too. in fact, my safari used to have the same problem for a few months, and then after i checked out the car myself, i found that the LSPV (load-sensing proportioning valve) at the rear wasn't working properly, due to which the rear braked prematurely (never locked-up, though)....try checking it out; change it, if necessary....
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Old 5th October 2005, 00:51   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by veyron1
yup, i think so too. in fact, my safari used to have the same problem for a few months, and then after i checked out the car myself, i found that the LSPV (load-sensing proportioning valve) at the rear wasn't working properly, due to which the rear braked prematurely (never locked-up, though)....try checking it out; change it, if necessary....
Hey when I mentioned the overheating rear brakes (while going downhill) issue to the service manager, he mentioned this valve - I didnt quite get what he said because my mind was on my ticket for the next days flight, but he did say that this valve should take care of any such issue...

By the way, Ive never had this sideways movement under braking that Autocar mentioned. Its always stopped in a straight line - even on some very drenched and slippery roads, though ABS should've been standard.

Last edited by Steeroid : 5th October 2005 at 00:53.
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Old 5th October 2005, 10:42   #10
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Hi,
This is does not seem like a brake issue. I did speak at length to the service guys and the answer that i came away with is that the EBD + ABS + LSD is supposed to correct all of this. Somehow i cannot believe that answer so easily because the earlier vehicle i used to have (2001 EXi) never used to do this. Anyhow i think Tata does not stability control which keeps the vehicle in the right angle while moving but they definitely do have EBD/ABS in the higher end dicor. If the functionality works then you guys should not be seeing this problem in the newer vehicles. I will keep you guys posted if i come up with anything new. thanks!
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Old 5th October 2005, 12:16   #11
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Funny part is that the Tata Service engineers wont even listen to your request if you ask them to put the ABS/EBD on the non-ABS/EBD models. I told them cost is NOT a consideration, yet they wont even think along those lines.
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Old 6th October 2005, 01:34   #12
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Quote:
Hey when I mentioned the overheating rear brakes (while going downhill) issue to the service manager, he mentioned this valve - I didnt quite get what he said because my mind was on my ticket for the next days flight, but he did say that this valve should take care of any such issue...
what it actually does is, it reduces the pressure of the hydraulic fluid going to the rear wheel cylinders as it senses a decrease in load, and vice versa. basically, it should prevent the wheels from locking up under no-load or full-load situations, but if it's faulty, it doesn't regulate the pressure, resulting in skittish braking, differentiated handling, etc. & also heated drums, as the shoes are always in contact with the inner surface....

Quote:
This is does not seem like a brake issue. I did speak at length to the service guys and the answer that i came away with is that the EBD + ABS + LSD is supposed to correct all of this.
LSD's are O.E on all safari 4x4's, and they do not affect the handling or braking characteristics of the SUV.... the LSD only comes into play when either of your rear wheels are spinning out of control, since only the rear has LSD. the front has a live axle, with sun and star type geared differential (normal ones found in sumo's or scorpio's rear)...
but even the DICOR vx that i drove, had not-so-effective brakes and handling; damn, tata shouldn't have touched the suspension and steering dynamics- it was so good before...now they are gonna have to improve upon the DICOR, which would disappoint the initial customers....

Quote:
Funny part is that the Tata Service engineers wont even listen to your request if you ask them to put the ABS/EBD on the non-ABS/EBD models. I told them cost is NOT a consideration, yet they wont even think along those lines.
he..he...yeah, they hesitate to do any sort of "upgrade" mods, because of these 2 reasons (i think).. a) they do not have the expertise, and b) they do not do anything that tries to foul the warranty...
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