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Old 17th November 2005, 11:39   #1
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Default two questions for automobile engrs.

just out of curiousity.

1. (inspired by @thief's post) when a power steering (EPS or HPS)fails, does the vehicle automatically shifts to manual steering?

2. air bags, do they take speed into acount? i won't want airbags to deploy if a cart hits my front while i am stationary.

thanks.
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Old 17th November 2005, 11:54   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vivekiny2k
just out of curiousity.

1. (inspired by @thief's post) when a power steering (EPS or HPS)fails, does the vehicle automatically shifts to manual steering?

.
It does but is is very heavy - try turning the wheels of a power steered car with the engine off


Quote:
Originally Posted by vivekiny2k
2. air bags, do they take speed into acount? i won't want airbags to deploy if a cart hits my front while i am stationary.

It does and also g forces

thanks.
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Old 17th November 2005, 12:01   #3
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Actually at speed it is not really noticable, but at low speeds its like driving the non power steering version of the car.(Based on expirience with Indigo LS)
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Old 17th November 2005, 12:02   #4
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Hi vivekiny2k,
Usually when an electronic power steering system fails,YES is feel like a manaul one,But thats not that it shifts to the manaul mode,its default.


For the air bags to deploy,u would need to trigger of 3 sensors(most cars)
1) 2 sensors just behind the front bumper
2) 1 sensor in the gear box tunnel or near the hand brake.
And of course u need to be wearing ur seat belt!

But i have heard of some skoda accident in where the car was not very badly damaged but still the bags went off

Karan Shah
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Old 17th November 2005, 13:32   #5
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Hi,

I have questions regd air bags & ABS.

When someone hit my car from behind, will airbag system work on that time ?

ABS is for all four wheels or only front two wheels. I heard only front wheels so far. As they operate, is it good for indian city driving ? (30 times in a second)
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Old 17th November 2005, 13:55   #6
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just a thought ?

When air bags go off (example someone banging from behind) do they simply fit in again or air bags has to be replaced ?
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Old 17th November 2005, 14:09   #7
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Quote:
But i have heard of some skoda accident in where the car was not very badly damaged but still the bags went off
I know that car, and the owner is not too happy with the airbags bill that he has received!

@KS - How much does an airbag replacement in the Octavia cost?

GTO
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Old 17th November 2005, 14:52   #8
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does insurance cover the replacement of the airbags?
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Old 17th November 2005, 15:37   #9
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One more critical thing about the airbags is that there is a risk of injury due to the rapid deployment of airbag itself if the person is positioned forward towards the dashboard/Steering Wheel at the time of impact. Shorter persons and children can be at a higher risk due to their relative proximity than the taller ppl.

What if there are any sharp objects that immideately after the impact rupture the airbags. Are the gases that come out of the airbags safe for the human lungs/body. Am sure they would have ensured that.

Chk this link for useful information

http://www.chemistry.wustl.edu/~edud...s/airbags.html

What concerns me is although its a gud sign that India is getting its fair share of safety features a bit late during the day and gradually, the people who sell them are not educating the customers as to how these safety features function and the mechanics of the same.

Are there any regular service checkups required to ensure that the sensors work properly on impact. Are we informed about this...NO!

Am sure, there are a lot of people who would not be aware of how an ABS with EBD works and what is the best way to brake if you have an ABS braking system in a potential situation.

Insurance does cover the airbags.

Are the Manufacturers doing something about this?

Am afraid NO!

Last edited by muni : 17th November 2005 at 15:50.
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Old 17th November 2005, 16:39   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO
I know that car, and the owner is not too happy with the airbags bill that he has received!

@KS - How much does an airbag replacement in the Octavia cost?

GTO

May be 1.8 lak.And u have to change the whole dashboard!
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Old 17th November 2005, 17:02   #11
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Nuts I tell ya. These auto makers and dealers are taking the public for a royal ride here. Not to mention the insurance companies with the ridiculous "only 50% coverage for plastic parts". I mean, almost everything aside from the actual body, suspension and engine is made from plastic these days. Why the heck shouldn't they cover the full cost.
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Old 17th November 2005, 18:00   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rtech
Nuts I tell ya. These auto makers and dealers are taking the public for a royal ride here. Not to mention the insurance companies with the ridiculous "only 50% coverage for plastic parts". I mean, almost everything aside from the actual body, suspension and engine is made from plastic these days. Why the heck shouldn't they cover the full cost.
Actually,the manufacturers and their dealers have nothing to do with depreciation.This was decided by the association of insurance companies back in 2000-2001.True,the manufacturers can do their bit by reducing the price of plastic items.But parts like airbags are expensive to make (I think they're all imported) and will continue to be, unless they become mandatory and is made available on all cars sold in India, making mass local production viable.

With regard to EPS/HPS,I guess you already have the answer.And in case of airbags,the number of sensors and positioning differ from car to manufacturer.Some have passenger sensors,seat belt sensors and the like to calculate deployment.
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Old 17th November 2005, 18:18   #13
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You are partly right coloneljasi, but depreciation is a seperate issue which is applied only to metal parts. All plastic parts, whether they are 1 month old or 2 years old suffer the same fate i.e. insurance companies only cover you for 50% of the value of those parts.

I presume this is passed down from decades ago when plastic first started making their appearance on cars. At that time the quality used was not very good and used to crack/fade/get damaged easily. however over time, plastics have evolved just like everything else, and in todays cars, plastic is used for almost everything, from the interiors to bumpers to the headlights and even radiators. Unfortunately for us, insurance co's have happily turned ablind eye to that and for obvious reasons choose to continue the old policy. I don't think there are many other countries in the world that follow this rule.

However, being the latent society that we are, we choose to grumble and forget about it because the powers that be are all in the game together, each one taking their pound of flesh from us.

Just like the toll at Vashi which was originally put up to pay for the new thane creak bridge. However why would the Govt. stop a good money making revenue, so till this day, they continue with it, raising the toll every few months. But strangely, our roads seem to be getting worse instead of better.
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Old 17th November 2005, 19:50   #14
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If insurance companies decide that airbags are 'consumables' then you may not get anything. But luckily its not so.
Anyways talking about manufacturors and dealers, both of them have equal hand in fleecing the consumer. Try assembling your RS by buying indivdual parts. The cost will come to 30 lakh+.
An alternator which costs 18K in open market costs 43K when bought from the dealer.
ITs a daylight robbery racket in which manufacturor ensures good profits for dealers in case of part replacement. Why do you think that whenver you have a dent the first thing they try to do is convice the owner and the insurance surveyer that the part cannot be repaired and has be replaced.

Due to this practice of very expensive parts insurance may become costly soon
Look at this thread

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7787 (Insurers vs manufacturers: Deregulation of the Insurance sector)

Last edited by tsk1979 : 17th November 2005 at 19:53.
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Old 17th November 2005, 20:02   #15
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Good reading on ABS
[size=2][/size][size=2][color=#0000ff]http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/Equipment/absbrakes.html[/color][/size]

Air bags should inflate even if you're stuck while you are stationary. As long as electronic sensors detect collision, it should act.
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