Go Back   Team-BHP > Under the Hood > Technical Stuff


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 29th December 2010, 08:35   #1
BHPian
 
whatcanthisbe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: http://www.wandering-online.com
Posts: 501
Thanked: 3 Times
Default Tata Safari 2.2 stolen this morning (DL3C A Y 4878) [immobilizer beaten?!]

Tata safari 2.2 dicor 2008 with factory fitted immobilizer(which works) stolen from outside my house in south Delhi, pearl white front bumper all scratched up, dl3cay 4878, if seen please contact. Also don't rely on the immobilizer. I know mine worked since I have been locked out a couple of times when the battery in the remote died. Also I have the keys and the remotes with me. Please be cautious. Mods, am not sure where this goes so move if needed
whatcanthisbe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th December 2010, 08:52   #2
Distinguished - BHPian
 
jkdas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Thiruvananthapu
Posts: 9,661
Thanked: 1,389 Times
Default Re: Scary crap...car stolen this morning

What the *. I would have bet $$ on the immobilizer !

Hope this was reported to police.
jkdas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th December 2010, 08:55   #3
BHPian
 
whatcanthisbe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: http://www.wandering-online.com
Posts: 501
Thanked: 3 Times
Default Re: Scary crap...car stolen this morning

Same here.... Reported within 5 mins of this happening
whatcanthisbe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th December 2010, 09:05   #4
BHPian
 
nijelj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Bangalore-Ktym
Posts: 368
Thanked: 362 Times
Default Re: Scary crap...car stolen this morning

Sorry to hear this.The immobilizer for the Safari is on the remote keychain isn't it? If the thief picked up the IR signal....?
nijelj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th December 2010, 09:12   #5
BHPian
 
gshanky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Coimbatore / Bangalore / New York
Posts: 718
Thanked: 13 Times
Default Re: Scary crap...car stolen this morning

Sorry to hear about the truck. Does insurance cover anything?
gshanky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th December 2010, 10:15   #6
BHPian
 
kanuj's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Noida
Posts: 83
Thanked: 9 Times
Default Re: Scary crap...car stolen this morning

Sad to hear. I read somewhere on the forum that an attempt was made at a Safari, but the owner had changed the immobilizer personal keycode to something other than the default '0000', so the burglar could not steal the vehicle. The thief did disable the anti-theft systems by short circuiting the wires in the turn indicator. Is this possible?
kanuj is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 29th December 2010, 10:29   #7
Senior - BHPian
 
prince_pervez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Redwood shores, CA, USA
Posts: 4,205
Thanked: 30 Times
Default re: Tata Safari 2.2 stolen this morning (DL3C A Y 4878)

Sorry to hear this bro. Hope you get your truck back. Immobilizer is a reliable thing but ofcourse the thieves have got a way to hack that as well. This is scary.
prince_pervez is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th December 2010, 10:33   #8
BHPian
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 131
Thanked: 31 Times
Default Re: Scary crap...car stolen this morning

Dear Whatcanthisbe,

The Immobilizer is not related to the remote. The remote which you with your keys is known as RKE: Remote keyless entry. This means that you can enter the car with this device. The immobiliser is a different unit near the steering colomn that interacts with your key and the EMS of the car.

The key in your hand has a small chip inside the plastic cladding that is known as 'transponder'. Every transponder has a unique ID that is stored in the EMS. If you have 2 keys, both the IDs would be stored in the EMS allowing you to start the car with either of the key.

In your case, I can see 2 possibilities:
1. Somebody just towed your car without starting the car. (check for tyre marks in the place where you parked..if possible).

2. The thief has cloned your mechanical key and the transponder chip in it. This is possible only if you have given the key to some stranger in the past for whatever reason.

Cutting the wires and shorting them somehow and making the car start..is the thing of the past, with any immobilizer in place, this is impossible.
vidyasagar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th December 2010, 11:18   #9
BHPian
 
f1fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 693
Thanked: 41 Times
Default Re: Scary crap...car stolen this morning

Quote:
Originally Posted by vidyasagar View Post
Dear Whatcanthisbe,

The Immobilizer is not related to the remote. The remote which you with your keys is known as RKE: Remote keyless entry. This means that you can enter the car with this device. The immobiliser is a different unit near the steering colomn that interacts with your key and the EMS of the car.

The key in your hand has a small chip inside the plastic cladding that is known as 'transponder'. Every transponder has a unique ID that is stored in the EMS. If you have 2 keys, both the IDs would be stored in the EMS allowing you to start the car with either of the key.

In your case, I can see 2 possibilities:
1. Somebody just towed your car without starting the car. (check for tyre marks in the place where you parked..if possible).

2. The thief has cloned your mechanical key and the transponder chip in it. This is possible only if you have given the key to some stranger in the past for whatever reason.

Cutting the wires and shorting them somehow and making the car start..is the thing of the past, with any immobilizer in place, this is impossible.
To add to this, there was a case in Mumbai where the driver replaced the backup original key with a duplicate ( i.e. absolutely same looking key but no chip inside) and gave it to the owner. The owner all along thought that he had two original keys with him but one of them was fake.

A couple of days later, the driver drove the car away with the second original key.
Kindly check if someone has swapped one of the keys of your truck.

Hope that you get your truck back asap without any harm.

Last edited by f1fan : 29th December 2010 at 11:20.
f1fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th December 2010, 11:30   #10
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 3,652
Thanked: 244 Times
Default re: Tata Safari 2.2 stolen this morning (DL3C A Y 4878)

Too bad, was this an OEM Immobilizer as in EX, GX and VX version ??, if yes, you should also inform TATA Custoemr Care and involve the Delhi CS Manager to provide this feedback to Minda, they are also in the NCR.
dadu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th December 2010, 11:40   #11
BHPian
 
rohan_iitr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 992
Thanked: 401 Times
Default Re: Scary crap...car stolen this morning

Had you reprogrammed the default code of the immobiliser ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by kanuj View Post
Sad to hear. I read somewhere on the forum that an attempt was made at a Safari, but the owner had changed the immobilizer personal keycode to something other than the default '0000', so the burglar could not steal the vehicle. The thief did disable the anti-theft systems by short circuiting the wires in the turn indicator. Is this possible?
IIRC, that was Raj's Scorpio, not Safari.
Quote:
Originally Posted by vidyasagar View Post
The Immobilizer is not related to the remote. The remote which you with your keys is known as RKE: Remote keyless entry. This means that you can enter the car with this device. The immobiliser is a different unit near the steering colomn that interacts with your key and the EMS of the car.
Immobiliser may be independent or integrated with the remote locking system, varies from car to car.

In any case, if the default code has not been reprogrammed, the immobiliser is of no use because a tech-savvy thief can always override the security system with the default code.

Rohan
rohan_iitr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th December 2010, 11:42   #12
Senior - BHPian
 
mercedised's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Indore
Posts: 1,070
Thanked: 160 Times
Default re: Tata Safari 2.2 stolen this morning (DL3C A Y 4878)

I donot know if this is totally true, but there are FREQUENCY tracking devices, which track the frequencies used by the car to communicate with the transponder inside the key, and with the help of these frequencies they design new keys easily. No tough job for them.

This is the way in which the FOREIGN country thieves steal the most secured cars there.
mercedised is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th December 2010, 11:46   #13
Senior - BHPian
 
anilisanil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Pune
Posts: 1,435
Thanked: 288 Times
Default re: Tata Safari 2.2 stolen this morning (DL3C A Y 4878)

Really sorry to hear about the theft. Hope you get your posession back asap. All the best!
anilisanil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th December 2010, 11:53   #14
Newbie
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Chennai
Posts: 15
Thanked: 0 Times
Default Re: Scary crap...car stolen this morning

Really sorry for the miss fortune. Hope you have done the police complaint also kept the insurance agency informed.



Quote:
Originally Posted by vidyasagar View Post
Dear Whatcanthisbe,

2. The thief has cloned your mechanical key and the transponder chip in it. This is possible only if you have given the key to some stranger in the past for whatever reason.
Thanks vidyasagar for this info. If you think about this, sounds scary with all those strangers who gets access to the keys - temp call drivers, service station guys ....
mukundsb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th December 2010, 11:56   #15
BHPian
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 131
Thanked: 31 Times
Default Re: Scary crap...car stolen this morning

Quote:
Originally Posted by rohan_iitr View Post
immobiliser is of no use because a tech-savvy thief can always override the security system with the default code.

Rohan
There is no concept of default code in Immobilizer.

Regarding an Immobilizer or shortly Immo,
There are basically 2 things : Key Registration and Key Authentication.

Key Registration:
This is done one time only at the OEM End of Line (EOL).
This is a process where in the car EMS learns the Unique ID of the Transponder present in the Key. Once learnt, this is stored in the EEPROM of the EMS. Reading / Erasing this needs additional security codes etc..of which only the OEM has the information and is strictly controlled.

Key Authentication:
This process is done every time the Ignition is switched on. This is one of the first things usually done by the EMS of the car. This process is basically the EMS talking with the transponder chip in the key in a ciphered language and verifying if the transponder is valid. On top of this, the Unique ID of the transponder is also read and checked if this was already registered in the EEPROM of the EMS. Only if both the above conditions are met, the Fuel pump and starter motor are enabled.

Without Key Authentication, Its not possible to start the car.

The immobilizer is not just a product, but a system which has the EMS, Mechanical key and Transponder chip as system components.

I strongly suspect your car being towed away. Hope you get back your baby soon and safe.
vidyasagar is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Engine Immobilizer for Safari 2.2 VTT Lx amitk26 Modifications & Accessories 7 5th December 2016 16:01
Delhi - Goa - Delhi 4878 KMs! shelleve Travelogues 21 11th June 2015 22:17
8 Scorpio mHawks stolen-immobilizer codes cracked!!! ramkya1 Technical Stuff 126 31st March 2012 13:05
urgent!! driver beaten and car stolen at panvel. EDIT: Legal Opinion Needed amit_mechengg Street Experiences 190 25th February 2011 22:46
My car got stolen this morning!! GTO The Indian Car Scene 44 18th October 2004 23:19


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 14:44.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks