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Old 13th March 2011, 21:49   #1
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Exclamation Figo TDCi: Dies occasionally while downshifting! Solved: Updated firmware by Ford

Hi guys, I just got a pretty nasty scare today evening. I was driving my Figo TDCi, and being a Sunday evening, the roads were clear of any major traffic. The car was doing 60 KMPH in 4th gear in a straight stretch and then I reached a roundabout where I should be turning right. I pressed the brake, tried to immediately downshift to 3rd and then it took 2 seconds for me to realize what exactly was happening. Instead of turning right, the car held it's straight line. The steering was so tight, and that's when I realized that the car had died in the downshifting process (hence the power steering was cut out). By God's grace the road ahead was empty, or else I would have certainly T-boned some vehicles and caused a major havoc there. I traveled for some 10 meters, stopped the car, then turned it back on. It worked fine then and also started in the first crank itself.

Now for some more additional info on the same. This is the 3rd time this is happening. The last 2 times too the engine died while decelerating. On both occasions, the car was doing a straight line and hence not much of an issue and I ignored it (though I believe I should not have), but this time, I was in for a shocker of a response. All the 3 happened recently. The previous one took place last week. Lately I have been getting a feeling that the engine is a bit jerky as well. At times while doing low speeds, once I lift the leg off the throttle, the car feels a bit jerky (slight!) for a few seconds and then settles down.

We have a trip planned to Bangalore in 2 weeks time and what happened today has raised serious doubts in my mind. Could you guys share your thoughts on the issue and any particular thing that I should be looking for or telling the service center folks when I take my car there? The main problem is I would not be able to reproduce the issue in front of them since it only happens once in a while

Would appreciate some advice/suggestions here.
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Old 13th March 2011, 21:59   #2
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Default re: Figo TDCi: Dies occasionally while downshifting! Solved: Updated firmware by Ford

Please do get it checked with ***. Few pointers to look for unless there is lack of fuel supply, the engine can't die out, specially the diesel one

1. Quality of the fuel
2. Air in the fuel system, which can be blocking the fuel reaching engine.

regards,
-manju
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Old 13th March 2011, 22:10   #3
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Default re: Figo TDCi: Dies occasionally while downshifting! Solved: Updated firmware by Ford

Is this happening after a recent fuelling session? If so, you know what to do.

Check if the engine oil is upto the required level. Also, does this happen even after the engine reaches optimum temperature or only when it's cold?

Get the car to the service centre and get the engine checked thoroughly.

Last edited by DRIV3R : 13th March 2011 at 22:13.
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Old 13th March 2011, 22:18   #4
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Default re: Figo TDCi: Dies occasionally while downshifting! Solved: Updated firmware by Ford

I have experienced the very same thing twice. On both occasions i was changing a gear and the car just died down. Once it was just after taking off from a hump and upshifting after that. The second time i was at a curve and had just changed gear. On both occasions i was running with 1/4 th of the fuel tank and hence dismissed it as something to do with the lower fuel in the tank.

Now seeing that others are experiencing the same. I would surely want to keep an eye on your developments. Do Keep us updated.
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Old 13th March 2011, 22:40   #5
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Default re: Figo TDCi: Dies occasionally while downshifting! Solved: Updated firmware by Ford

Quote:
Originally Posted by jayded View Post
This is the 3rd time this is happening.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gemithomas View Post
I have experienced the very same thing twice.
Can you guys replicate the problem? I mean you know the conditions under which it happens and it might just be some bug that Ford is not aware of.

I would suggest you guys not to ignore the problem and do get in touch with Ford A.S.S.
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Old 13th March 2011, 23:20   #6
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Default re: Figo TDCi: Dies occasionally while downshifting! Solved: Updated firmware by Ford

Quote:
Originally Posted by manjubp View Post
Please do get it checked with ***. Few pointers to look for unless there is lack of fuel supply, the engine can't die out, specially the diesel one

1. Quality of the fuel
2. Air in the fuel system, which can be blocking the fuel reaching engine.

regards,
-manju
Quote:
Originally Posted by DRIV3R View Post
Is this happening after a recent fuelling session? If so, you know what to do.

Check if the engine oil is upto the required level. Also, does this happen even after the engine reaches optimum temperature or only when it's cold?

Get the car to the service centre and get the engine checked thoroughly.
Thanks for the pointers there, will surely ask the A.S.S guys about it.

Oil levels are fine, I checked it as soon as I got back home. 2/3 instances happened after the last refueling session. I use the same pump almost all the time and it's a fairly trusted pump in town. And the car had run at least 3-4 kilometers in 2 of the 3 instances and more than 6 in the other. Figo does not have a temp gauge on the cluster but I believe it takes around 3-4 Kms to reach the optimum temperature



Quote:
Originally Posted by gemithomas View Post
I have experienced the very same thing twice. On both occasions i was changing a gear and the car just died down. Once it was just after taking off from a hump and upshifting after that. The second time i was at a curve and had just changed gear. On both occasions i was running with 1/4 th of the fuel tank and hence dismissed it as something to do with the lower fuel in the tank.

Now seeing that others are experiencing the same. I would surely want to keep an eye on your developments. Do Keep us updated.
For me all 3 instances where during downshifting/braking and more importantly while disengaging the clutch. Never happened to me while upshifting. DTE while this happened today was around 130

Quote:
Originally Posted by HammerHead View Post
Can you guys replicate the problem? I mean you know the conditions under which it happens and it might just be some bug that Ford is not aware of.

I would suggest you guys not to ignore the problem and do get in touch with Ford A.S.S.
It's too much to ignore after today's shock, will surely take the car to A.S.S tomorrow. The problem, as I had already mentioned, is that the issue cannot be reproduced as such since the frequency of occurrence is very very low. Happened just 3 times in the last 6435 Kms for me, though all 3 cropped up within the last 1.5 months.
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Old 13th March 2011, 23:28   #7
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Default re: Figo TDCi: Dies occasionally while downshifting! Solved: Updated firmware by Ford

How much have you driven since the last fuel filter change ?
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Old 13th March 2011, 23:31   #8
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Post re: Figo TDCi: Dies occasionally while downshifting! Solved: Updated firmware by Ford

The core areas I would look at are

1. Bad Fuel quality and blocked fuel filter
2. Fuel Pump Adjustment
3. Blocked Air Filter

If you check all these and if the solution still can't be found , then there might be something that needs a much deeper investigation. A F.A.S.S will also probably check the engine ECU for any signs of malfunction.
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Old 14th March 2011, 08:30   #9
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Default re: Figo TDCi: Dies occasionally while downshifting! Solved: Updated firmware by Ford

Quote:
Originally Posted by gemithomas View Post
I have experienced the very same thing twice. On both occasions i was changing a gear and the car just died down. Once it was just after taking off from a hump and upshifting after that. The second time i was at a curve and had just changed gear. On both occasions i was running with 1/4 th of the fuel tank and hence dismissed it as something to do with the lower fuel in the tank.

Now seeing that others are experiencing the same. I would surely want to keep an eye on your developments. Do Keep us updated.

I have exp the same with about 1/4th of fuel left in the tank, but the car didnt die on me, its just that there was a dead spot somewhere while shifting gears.
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Old 14th March 2011, 09:35   #10
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Default re: Figo TDCi: Dies occasionally while downshifting! Solved: Updated firmware by Ford

If your gear shifting, usage of clutch, and rpm are correct then this shouldnt happen under normal circumstances. As others suggested, bad fuel could be the culprit. It could also point out to fuel filter, fuel pump, fuel pump relays, fuel lines etc.

I would say try out fuel additives for once - System G (petrol) System D (Diesel). They are available on select fuel pumps and cost few 100 Rs. Pls check out Team BHP Fuel Additives Thread for more info.

Thanks,
narayanang76
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Old 14th March 2011, 09:59   #11
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Default re: Figo TDCi: Dies occasionally while downshifting! Solved: Updated firmware by Ford

Quote:
Originally Posted by gemithomas View Post
I have experienced the very same thing twice. On both occasions i was changing a gear and the car just died down. Once it was just after taking off from a hump and upshifting after that. The second time i was at a curve and had just changed gear. On both occasions i was running with 1/4 th of the fuel tank and hence dismissed it as something to do with the lower fuel in the tank.

Now seeing that others are experiencing the same. I would surely want to keep an eye on your developments. Do Keep us updated.
Seems like you and Jayded fill diesel from the same pump.
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Old 14th March 2011, 10:32   #12
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Default re: Figo TDCi: Dies occasionally while downshifting! Solved: Updated firmware by Ford

@Jayded - when did you purchase the vehicle? and when was the first issue seen?

Based on what you reply to the first two questions. I would say that it could be due to fuel deposits on the injectors that would cause a situation of fuel spraying being erratic. Especially if your trying to increase RPM, which would mean more fuel to be sprayed, could be something that could compromise this that could cause your vehicle to stall.

Check it out and have them clean the injectors (using some flushing operation through a pressurised solvent) or unclog anything at the injector tip. Usually fuel injectors are quite expensive.

The other issue could be the clutch plate (probably friction material is showing some issue?) am not sure about this, could be something you need to check.

The biggest one is the gearbox itself, there could be numerous ones to this. We can try eliminating all three based on your input.
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Old 14th March 2011, 10:45   #13
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Default re: Figo TDCi: Dies occasionally while downshifting! Solved: Updated firmware by Ford

There are a lot of probable causes to your concern, including the ones already stated by our co-members. Rather than speculate, I suggest that you get the car over to the dealership asap. They might not need you to replicate the conditions, just tell them how and when the anomaly was noted and let them worry about narrowing things down. No offense intended.
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Old 14th March 2011, 11:11   #14
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Default re: Figo TDCi: Dies occasionally while downshifting! Solved: Updated firmware by Ford

Quote:
Originally Posted by HammerHead View Post
Can you guys replicate the problem? I mean you know the conditions under which it happens and it might just be some bug that Ford is not aware of.

I would suggest you guys not to ignore the problem and do get in touch with Ford A.S.S.
okay people. i thought i was the only one who had this issue. my car also had such problems. its happened to me twice. and it was a wierd coincidence, that it happened at the same spot (traffic signal) when i go to work in the morning.

the way it happed was, i was in 4th, and saw the signal turning red. so just touched the brakes and pressed the clutch pedal for a downshift. and the engine just died! i was like ****!
coasted to a standstill at the signal (straight line path) but realized the steering is going to be extremely heavy. so was prepared for it. keyed off and started the car again with no issues that day.

have tried to replicate the error with no success.

i have seen this error state before while working on a CRDI engine and it was called injector bank error. in that case, the engine would cut off fuel while accelerating. this could be a similar case.

@ diesel9999:
1. Bad Fuel quality and blocked fuel filter
2. Fuel Pump Adjustment
3. Blocked Air Filter

these are probable for mechanical pump engines. not for common rail. the engine is 'supposed' to take the above factors into consideration.

i am not sure what to do about the ford A.S.S. as i wonder if they'll sort it out.

this is one thread i will keep a very keen eye on.

thanks for initiating it!

Nitro

Last edited by nitrogary : 14th March 2011 at 11:13.
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Old 14th March 2011, 12:01   #15
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Default re: Figo TDCi: Dies occasionally while downshifting! Solved: Updated firmware by Ford

Quote:
Originally Posted by kpzen View Post
How much have you driven since the last fuel filter change ?
Ford changes the Fuel Filter only during the 30K service

I really dont know how they manage to do that with the kind of diesel we get in our country.


@ Jayded: I strongly recommend you ignore such things till it becomes something that can be replicated or where you can really put in a pattern of occurance. Otherwise the A.S.S guys would just fiddle with all the factory settings / fitments without any idea of what they are really doing. This could eventually lead you experiencing worser things from the car and Ford would call it "within tolerable limits"

Even in my case the DTE was just around 100km. So it could surely be one of those "irregular behaviour", that ford claims in the manual, when you are low on fuel. If nitrogary could confirm his DTE reading when it occured we could probably find a pattern.


PS: Just my thoughts after owning a FIAT for many years. My Motto is to "Run it till it Runs".

Last edited by gemithomas : 14th March 2011 at 12:03.
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