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Old 6th April 2011, 22:18   #91
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Default Re: Coil Spring Adjusters : VFM Fix for the Honda Civic's (lousy) soft rear suspensio

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Originally Posted by moralfibre View Post
He has D2's. Yes, ride was the only reason for reverting to stock. We were running it on the softest available option. Ask him now, if he enjoyed the "ride". Handling is superb with coilovers but you have to slow down at every rough road for the fear of flying off. Coilovers make the car bounce around too much to even have good road contact. We have driven that car extensively on the expressway and you had to go slow at every small bridge on the road fearing a flying Civic.

On the other hand, Amey got Koni's. Not even the FSD's. The normal Yellow ones. You should sit in that car and compare the compromise in ride or the lack of it vis-a-vis the upgraded handling it offers. I bet you'll opt for Koni's.
Thats weird. The other member, m4ugr8 used Konis and then switched to TEINs and found the coilovers much better. Now again im quite consfused, since I need something for my Accord asap, and im going to the U.S next week and want to pick up something.

Your talking about Ameys lancer? Isn't that running on stock size rims?
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Old 6th April 2011, 23:00   #92
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Default Re: Coil Spring Adjusters : VFM Fix for the Honda Civic's (lousy) soft rear suspensio

This is a very interesting thing. Sounds perfect for my OHC whose suspension has gone soft now.
Where can i get these installed in Bangalore ? Any Dealers here in Bangalore ?
Will the 1 inch adjuster be enough for the OHC?
Hope this will be the perfect solution to counter bottoming out on the backbreaking humps in Bangalore.

Last edited by _raviShankar_ : 6th April 2011 at 23:07.
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Old 7th April 2011, 00:05   #93
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Default Re: Coil Spring Adjusters : VFM Fix for the Honda Civic's (lousy) soft rear suspensio

Hello GTO,

Thank you for trying this out on your vehicle

I would want to get this done on my Dzire. Everytime there are 5 people in the car and luggage the vehicle seems to be unstable.

There was an interesting thread on Team BHP sometime back http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/modifi...ded-sedan.html (Restoring the ride height for a loaded Sedan) which also achieved the same purpose you went in for mod (if I may say so)

I was planning to order one for the dzire and was at 86$ on Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/LIFT-60702-100...2115043&sr=1-1). The product is from Airliftcompany.com . Now considering that there is something that can be done here in India, I am more than eager to try this solution.

I will call up Daryl to check on the possible solution for the rear end in the morning. I am meanwhile attaching the pictures of the rear suspension.

@dinu2506, please PM me your number. I am willing to get it done too in Bangalore.

Thanks
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Coil Spring Adjusters : VFM Fix for the Honda Civic's (lousy) soft rear suspension?-24112010.jpg  

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Last edited by deepakchiniwal : 7th April 2011 at 00:08. Reason: Added Link for Airlift
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Old 7th April 2011, 07:55   #94
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Default Re: Coil Spring Adjusters : VFM Fix for the Honda Civic's (lousy) soft rear suspensio

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Originally Posted by akshay1234 View Post
Your talking about Ameys lancer? Isn't that running on stock size rims?
He is running on 15" alloys with 195/60 tyres.
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Old 7th April 2011, 10:39   #95
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Default Re: Coil Spring Adjusters : VFM Fix for the Honda Civic's (lousy) soft rear suspensio

Great thread for older Civic owners.

I want to get it done to my 2006 Civic. Darryl offered it to me for Rs.2,200/- (rear only) including shipping to Gurgaon.

Can anyone help, where can I get it installed in Gurgaon (or Delhi) ?
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Old 7th April 2011, 10:55   #96
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Default Re: Coil Spring Adjusters : VFM Fix for the Honda Civic's (lousy) soft rear suspensio

Team,

I am slightly worried looking at the way everyone is asking if this would work on their cars. Please remember,that this is no alternative to a worn out rear suspension. Any car would have its back end go down with 5 on board. Altering the ride height and stiffening the suspension will alter handling and braking drastically!
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Old 7th April 2011, 11:00   #97
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Default Re: Coil Spring Adjusters : VFM Fix for the Honda Civic's (lousy) soft rear suspensio

Will keep a close eye for updates on this thread based on perhaps 3000 - 5000 kms usage. If this works, I'd be interested in considering this for my own civic, pending a more elaborate suspension upgrade for the car.
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Old 7th April 2011, 12:24   #98
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Default Re: Coil Spring Adjusters : VFM Fix for the Honda Civic's (lousy) soft rear suspensio

Quote:
Originally Posted by roy_libran View Post
Lately (around 70K kms on the ODO, out of which about 15K has happened on bad roads, and a recent replacement of the front shocks and arms), I am detecting a slightly increased vertical travel at the rear, which is a bit unsettling.
Hi Roy,

I think you need a new rear suspension (dampers et al), and not a quick, cheap fix.

Please note this product is not a solution for worn out suspensions. It's only for those cars that sag, or have an ultra-soft tune, even with a brand new suspension.

Let me put it another way:

- If your car rides too low, rear bounces around / bottoms out with a new suspension, AutoRunner may help (e.g. Civic & Verna)

- If your car started suffering from these problems ONLY after a couple of years / thousands of kms (thus wear & tear), then you need a new suspension.

Quote:
Originally Posted by speedsatya View Post
Please remember,that this is no alternative to a worn out rear suspension.


Quote:
Originally Posted by moralfibre View Post
What size did you require for your car?
1 inch.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Psycho View Post
Yes it stiffens the suspension but also raises the car.
Psycho, could you please share:

- Pictures of the product
- Pictures of it installed
- Price

Quote:
Originally Posted by _raviShankar_ View Post
Will the 1 inch adjuster be enough for the OHC?
Seems likely.

Quote:
Originally Posted by deepakchiniwal View Post
Now considering that there is something that can be done here in India, I am more than eager to try this solution.
Would you want to wait until I submit a longer-term report on its effectiveness?
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Old 7th April 2011, 12:42   #99
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Default Re: Coil Spring Adjusters : VFM Fix for the Honda Civic's (lousy) soft rear suspensio

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Originally Posted by Sutripta View Post
Hi,
Should we think of these as spacers or as helper springs?
Helper springs naturally, if they were spacers then the ride height would have changed.
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Old 7th April 2011, 16:53   #100
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Default Re: Coil Spring Adjusters : VFM Fix for the Honda Civic's (lousy) soft rear suspensio

Quote:
Originally Posted by speedsatya View Post
Team,

I am slightly worried looking at the way everyone is asking if this would work on their cars. Please remember,that this is no alternative to a worn out rear suspension. Any car would have its back end go down with 5 on board. Altering the ride height and stiffening the suspension will alter handling and braking drastically!
Well said, a sagging suspension typically not only points to weak springs but also weakened dampers hence this is not a fix for a bad suspension.
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Old 7th April 2011, 17:07   #101
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Default Re: Coil Spring Adjusters : VFM Fix for the Honda Civic's (lousy) soft rear suspensio

Other cars i feel could find this modification useful are Verna(Front and Rear) and Dzire(Rear). Both these cars have excessively soft suspension(Only Rear for Dzire), which not only means excessive pitching at load but also bottom out and adverse effect on handling. What do you say experts?
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Old 7th April 2011, 17:29   #102
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Default Re: Coil Spring Adjusters : VFM Fix for the Honda Civic's (lousy) soft rear suspensio

Now this thread has got me on to T-Bhp after a long time
I feel one superb example of having a raised rear is the Hyundai Verna .I have had very scary experiences trying to drive Vernas on ghat roads with no one in the rear.
It feels more planted with 5 on board.

I have seen a couple of vernas having close calls with their rear ends losing traction on curves.

Maybe ,Verna owners can highlight more on this.

The reason I brought this up here is because this car looks like having a more than needed stiff rear which could mean similar results on some cars with the mods that GTO is talking about
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Old 7th April 2011, 19:59   #103
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Default Re: Coil Spring Adjusters : VFM Fix for the Honda Civic's (lousy) soft rear suspensio

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Getting the wheel alignment done on Wednesday; will update.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
...cancelled alignment appointment.
Looking forward to those numbers, both ideal and post-install.
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Old 8th April 2011, 03:51   #104
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Default Re: Coil Spring Adjusters : VFM Fix for the Honda Civic's (lousy) soft rear suspensio

I would like to caution everyone who is using this piece of kit to drive conservatively at first and get used to the handling of the car, because that WILL change, probably pretty dramatically when the car is not fully loaded. The reasons are outlined below in simple terms.

The rubber donut that GTO has installed is basically an elastomer (probably polyurethane). Installing this basically makes the rear act as two springs in series, which in theory should actually reduce the total stiffness at the rear. However, in practice, since the method of installation involves reducing the number of active coils on the coil spring, the stiffness increases quite a bit, which is why the rear sags less when there is heavy load in the car.

From looking at GTO's pics, the fact that the number of active coils on the spring has reduced from 5 to 3 means that the spring stiffness has gone up by about 66% worst case [spring stiffness is inversely proportional to number of active coils, so the percentage change is 100* ( (1/3) - (1/5) ) / (1/5).]

This, guys, is a HUGE change. When a car is tuned before it is released for sale to the public, the front to rear stiffness distribution is very carefully determined because that has a massive impact on the balance of the car. In general, the more the rear stiffness, the less the understeer.

In all probability, this mod reduces the understeer quite heavily when the car is lightly loaded, so you guys who install this need to be VERY careful when driving spiritedly or in slippery conditions cause the rear end can break away in such a manner that a normal (non-expert) driver cannot catch it soon enough. The consequences are left for your imagination.

The correct way to achieve the same effect is to make the springs in parallel, and have one of the springs contact only when the suspension starts compressing heavily under load. This is known as a bumpstop in common parlance, but technically it is called a jounce bumper, the black rubber part shown inside the coil spring below:

Coil Spring Adjusters : VFM Fix for the Honda Civic's (lousy) soft rear suspension?-27485d1270928566advicesaggingrearwhentowingimg_0060.jpg

This part accomplishes two things:

1) Does not affect the stiffness when the car is unloaded, thereby not having any effect on handling.

2) Increases the stiffness when the car is heavily loaded so that the suspension does not bottom out and cause snap oversteer due to the stiffness increasing to almost infinity (in theory).

Most of the time this part is installed on the shock shaft, so the Honda probably has it inside the shock, but unfortunately it is not sufficient when the car is heavily loaded, so the customer has to resort to poorly designed but partially effective measures such as GTO has done.

So, in parting, please use caution!!
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Old 8th April 2011, 04:04   #105
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Default Re: Coil Spring Adjusters : VFM Fix for the Honda Civic's (lousy) soft rear suspensio

Adding this as a separate post for emphasis so that it doesn't get lost in the text of the previous one.

I'd like to add to my previous post that the effect on handling will be much less dramatic if one were to install this at both the front and the rear. It may however make the front stiffer, but at least the car will be safe to drive.

Also, the reason that the manufacturer recommends an alignment is because the ride height of the car may be affected slightly when this part is installed, so the alignment also changes along with that and it has to be basically corrected to where it was.
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