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Old 21st September 2011, 17:48   #76
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Default Re: Hyundai Verna Fluidic Disappointment. And SOLD!

@phenomonstar

Excellent write up.

I share your thoughts and completely agree with you about the handling characteristics of Verna. It is difficult to own a Verna after having experienced the pleasure of driving a good handling car.

Incidentally, i own a Fusion too and i had test drove the Verna twice (one short and the second a very long one). The car is highly unpredictable when it comes to the handling department.

A very bold decision to sell of what you did not like and prioritize your requirements. Even with the below par interiors and high price, i have booked the New Fiesta. I typically drive around 2500-3000 kms and most of these are highways. I would strongly suggest you to test drive the New Fiesta as it is the best handling car i have ever driven. It just digs into the road. I fell for its handling and the power is adequate.

Completely agree with what CRtorquefan says

Quote:
Originally Posted by CRtorquefan View Post
@Phenomonstar;
More than a Investment or to a choice, your story reflects your true enthusiasm towards the Driving, which is refined by the Auto Maestros(Germans & Americans) like Fords, Fiats, etc.
But before you take the delivery of your Magnum, I'd advice you to have a Spin of New Fiesta.
Though its having lesser Horses as compared to its competition but what its having is really unmatched by others, like;
-Its Superb Corner-carving Handling.
-Super-effective Power Steering.
-Taut & Robust bodyshell.
Its worth the penny spend & the Beige Interiors is a very small issue infront of its pros, what she offers.

Last edited by MAS : 21st September 2011 at 18:16.
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Old 21st September 2011, 20:08   #77
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Default Re: Hyundai Verna Fluidic Disappointment. And SOLD!

At the risk of sounding like a broken record, let me quote from Zappo's official T-BHP review of the Fluidic Verna:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zappo View Post
The Hyundai Verna has been launched in India at a price of 7.03 - 10.64 lakhs (ex-Delhi).

What you'll like:

A great looking Hyundai sedan
Well-packaged; sufficient room front & back
Competent 1.6L powerplants, especially torquey diesel. Wide range of engines & transmissions on offer
Ride quality & behaviour in the city
Several segment-first features (reversing camera, keyless entry & go, electric folding mirrors and more)
Top notch safety equipment including 6 airbags, ABS + EBD, all wheel disc brakes etc.

What you won't:

Dynamics & high speed handling capability. Softly tuned suspension
High speed ride quality isn't flat. Suspension, especially on uneven roads, gets wallowy
4 speed Automatic gearboxes. This segment calls for a 5 speed
Under-thigh support of the low rear seat not as good as that of competition
and:
Quote:

The suspension is softly-tuned by Hyundai engineers. Hence, ride quality is excellent within the city. Even potholes are dismissed off without complaint. On rough urban roads where the Honda City would fumble, the Hyundai Verna breezes through. The soft suspension raises its ugly head at high speeds though, both in ride as well as handling. Dynamically, the Verna is just like most other C segment sedans upto 130 kph. Over that limit, you get the feeling that you are floating. One does not feel very confident to go beyond, as even a small undulation on the road surface causes the new Verna to pitch and roll. Every time I reached 120 - 140, it rocked like a boat at the smallest of unevenness on the road. The twitchy behaviour at high speed is not confidence inspiring & the ride doesn't stay flat either. At this point, the diesel engine wants to go further, but the handling remains a limitation. The diesel Verna felt a little better at high speeds; it's probably the additional weight of the engine at play here. As mentioned earlier, Hyundai has reverted back to the 4 discs arrangement with ABS & EBD. No problems with the brakes on a straight road, the car stops without a fuss. However, it is on the twisties that the Verna gets nervous; brake real hard and the tail shows a tendency to step out of line.
(emphases mine)

This seems to broadly tie in with my Accent Gen 1 experience- please note I have not TDed the Fluidic Verna.

I think it's pretty clear that one size does NOT fit all and there are difference things people look for in a car. A former Ford owner with ride & handling as a primary requirement opting for this car known from history and by popular opinion to be a poor-to-average handler is rather inexplicable.

Anyway, phenomenonstar seems happy with his decision and the Optra Magnum sure has its share of fanboys on the forum , so good luck to you. Do post an ownership review of your new baby!
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Old 21st September 2011, 23:35   #78
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Default Re: Hyundai Verna Fluidic Disappointment. And SOLD!

Quote:
Originally Posted by swiftnfurious View Post
for common people, stock Verna is much more than enough.
Not exactly. Imo, a common man WILL NOT do a suspension overhaul, MAY NOT do a tyre upgrade, but will definitely try a speed of 100-120 on times (not always) on highways, and the boat-like handling will definitely scare him.
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Old 22nd September 2011, 00:15   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noopster
I would stop short of calling the Fluidic Verna bullsh*t (assuming that's what you typed). 4,000 buyers amonth will surely not fall for it consistently. For regular city use, it seems to be a popular car these days.
I intentionally did not type it because its definately not bad. It was more in context to the fact that it's good on so many other levels that an average joe would easily be sold on it! Ride and handling come into the picture only later, that too in case of a certain few.
Honestly, it's not the best option if your 2 top priorities are handling and space. The latter is a deal breaker in my case.
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Old 22nd September 2011, 00:39   #80
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Default Re: Hyundai Verna Fluidic Disappointment. And SOLD!

Quote:
Originally Posted by noopster View Post

A former Ford owner with ride & handling as a primary requirement opting for this car known from history and by popular opinion to be a poor-to-average handler is rather inexplicable.
I agree - Hyundai has a very poor reputation for ride and handling, even among novices.

As an owner of Ford and Hyundai cars, I have experienced a HUGE world of a difference between the ride and handling of the two.

When it comes to ride and handling, I believe Fiat and Ford decimate the competition in the sub-10 lac segment ! Even the otherwise-formidable Honda cars cant compare with either.
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Old 22nd September 2011, 01:15   #81
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Default Re: Hyundai Verna Fluidic Disappointment. And SOLD!

Quote:
Originally Posted by romeomidhun View Post
Not exactly. Imo, a common man WILL NOT do a suspension overhaul, MAY NOT do a tyre upgrade, but will definitely try a speed of 100-120 on times (not always) on highways, and the boat-like handling will definitely scare him.
Completely agree. Also, the "Common man" will not know the limits of poor handling and i am worried if this would end in an accident.

Infact, most of them think it is normal for a car to behave like a boat at high speeds. Unfortunately, the truth is that these "common men" have never driven a good handling car.
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Old 22nd September 2011, 15:56   #82
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Default Re: Hyundai Verna Fluidic Disappointment. And SOLD!

Going through all the posts in this 6-page thread (hitherto), I will add my own 2-pence, again! It is alarming to know that so many people here actually go ahead and comment with confidence on a car they have never driven, leave alone driven for long. People go on to the extent to say that the car cannot be driven beyond 100 kmph, and there is a strong disconnect between the driver and the ride and... wow!

So, for the average 150 kms that I have been driving the fluidic verna everyday, I stay below 80 kmph for the most part? Hell, no! Of course, the OP was strongly disappointed with the ride and handling, and he has no one but himself to blame to go for a car without a test-drive, when he is an enthusiast! Next, each car has its own forte - and ruling it out, or calling it cr*p, just because it lacks driver feedback, is misleading. I am no HMIL fanboy, and I have a Toyota, two Tatas, a Chevy in addition to the fluidic Verna in my stable.

My point is simple - to each, his own. I understand that not all people in India are enthusiasts or aware about technicalities of automobiles, but 4000 customers a month cannot be all stupid, can they? These 'laymen' actually know more than we think they do. It is just the terminology that they are not fluent with - but most of them know their stuff, and their requirements.

A good 20% of all the cars sold IMHO are through strong word of mouth. By now, the hype should have ideally died down over the new Verna, had it been such a 'bad' product. I don't see it dying, and I am talking numbers here.

Thanks.
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Old 22nd September 2011, 16:10   #83
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Default Re: Hyundai Verna Fluidic Disappointment. And SOLD!

Quote:
Originally Posted by mathranik View Post
Going through all the posts in this 6-page thread (hitherto), I will add my own 2-pence, again! It is alarming to know that so many people here actually go ahead and comment with confidence on a car they have never driven, leave alone driven for long. People go on to the extent to say that the car cannot be driven beyond 100 kmph, and there is a strong disconnect between the driver and the ride and... wow!

So, for the average 150 kms that I have been driving the fluidic verna everyday, I stay below 80 kmph for the most part? Hell, no! Of course, the OP was strongly disappointed with the ride and handling, and he has no one but himself to blame to go for a car without a test-drive, when he is an enthusiast! Next, each car has its own forte - and ruling it out, or calling it cr*p, just because it lacks driver feedback, is misleading. I am no HMIL fanboy, and I have a Toyota, two Tatas, a Chevy in addition to the fluidic Verna in my stable.

My point is simple - to each, his own. I understand that not all people in India are enthusiasts or aware about technicalities of automobiles, but 4000 customers a month cannot be all stupid, can they? These 'laymen' actually know more than we think they do. It is just the terminology that they are not fluent with - but most of them know their stuff, and their requirements.

A good 20% of all the cars sold IMHO are through strong word of mouth. By now, the hype should have ideally died down over the new Verna, had it been such a 'bad' product. I don't see it dying, and I am talking numbers here.

Thanks.
I back you up 100%.

Everytime I see a comment that says this car is not fun over 80, I just smile to myself. I drive 40km a day to and from work, have done several highway trips and still can't understand what the hue and cry is all about. My car has gone upto 160 on the salem stretch and I didn't find it to be wallowy or boat like or anything else. It wasn't the best I agree, but it certainly wasn't the worst either. Anyways, I don't think the intended target audience of this car will push it to the limits everyday, to be honest does anyone push their cars to the limit so often? I'm willing to trade in sports car stability at 140+ for super comfort at everyday speeds. But I guess to each his own.

I'm happy that phenomonstar has found a car he's happy with. In the end that's what matters. But that doesn't make the Verna a bad car. It just means that it wasn't the right car for him.
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Old 22nd September 2011, 16:23   #84
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Default Re: Hyundai Verna Fluidic Disappointment. And SOLD!

Quote:
Originally Posted by smartcat View Post
Is that all it takes to improve Verna's handling?
Quote:
Originally Posted by akhilesh View Post
All things equal, aftermarket suspension would help but your post makes it sound as if suspension is all one needs for a good handling car.
Obviously, an after-market suspension will not make it an "Octavia". Still, it will very well change the handling from "poor" to "good" or "acceptable". It could improve the handling so much that the OP wouldn't want to sell a brand new Verna off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NoRules View Post
If Optra - which now sells in the range of 10.50 to 10.75 lakhs OTR - looses 4 - 5 lakhs in resale in the first year itself, I will quit my business and get into pre-owned car market.
Oh well, looks like you will indeed have to get into the pre-owned car market

The Optra, along with the Cedia, lose 40+% (in some dealers, very close to 50%) in their first year of ownership. Reason? Both are market duds and no one wants them (as is evident from the monthly sales reports). The Optra has also been around for awfully long (8 years now) and is perceived as an outdated car. The 1st gen Honda City was still on sale in 2003 (when the Optra was launched). Since then, Honda has launched two more, entirely different generations of the City. And the 4th yet will make it's debut in another 2 years. Few 10 lakh rupee customers want to buy a car that's gotten long in the tooth.

I've made some people buy 1 - 2 year old Optras / Cedias in the recent past and insist that these cars make sense only as used buys. Having witnessed these deals first hand, as a pre-worshipped car fanatic, I do know a thing or two of how they do in the used market. There's just one word = Disaster.

Last edited by GTO : 22nd September 2011 at 16:24.
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Old 22nd September 2011, 16:44   #85
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Default Re: Hyundai Verna Fluidic Disappointment. And SOLD!

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO
The Optra, along with the Cedia, lose 40+% (in some dealers, very close to 50%) in their first year of ownership. Reason? Both are market duds and no one wants them (as is evident from the monthly sales reports). The Optra has also been around for awfully long (8 years now) and is perceived as an outdated car. The 1st gen Honda City was still on sale in 2003 (when the Optra was launched). Since then, Honda has launched two more, entirely different generations of the City. And the 4th yet will make it's debut in another 2 years. Few 10 lakh rupee customers want to buy a car that's gotten long in the tooth.

I've made some people buy 1 - 2 year old Optras / Cedias in the recent past and insist that these cars make sense only as used buys. Having witnessed these deals first hand, as a pre-worshipped car fanatic, I do know a thing or two of how they do in the used market. There's just one word = Disaster.
GTO -

1) The Verna on Road is costing 12L odd, the Optra LS is retailing @ 9L odd. One saves 3L straight, do you think this initial difference can be made up for in a space of 3 years of ownership, in the pre - owned market that is? I don't think so.

2) The monthly sales graph does suggest that the Optra is not setting the charts on fire, but does it goes to show that the product is BAD?

3) The TCDi Optra has been around since 2007.

4) Not just City there have many manufacturers who have brought in the nth generation here, this actually is a very good pointer on the part of GM, that they DO NOT DISCARD their vehicles that easily. Look at what FIAT has done in the past, Petra, Uno, Siena, there are loads....

The Optra, Aveo not being discarded even after poor sales show indicates that GM does not let away their products that easily and are ready to live with it (low sales figures).

5) Perceptions, there would be people who love the pre owned cars and who do not (I for one don't), this has been repeated over and over again: it depends how long you would want to keep the car should be the deciding factor that should make you think of the perceived losses.

Happy Motoring !!

Last edited by Torquedo : 22nd September 2011 at 17:05.
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Old 22nd September 2011, 17:19   #86
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Default Re: Hyundai Verna Fluidic Disappointment. And SOLD!

Adding my 2 cents here.Last evening I took a test drive of the 1.6 CRDi SX variant of the Verna for a stretch of around 6 kms.And that included speeds of 120+ over some stretches.I own an Octavia vRS(which is arguably the sweetest handling car my generation has seen sub-20 L) and have driven other cars like the Fiesta 1.6/Linea D which are famed for their steering feedback/handling.

Now coming to the point right away.For someone who is accustomed to driving flat out in the vRS(and in phenomstar's case i presume some other euro brands too) I must say, the composure of the Verna over sudden undulations/irregularities on the road/relatively fast turns isn't confidence inspiring at all.The steering too is on the lighter side and gives the impression of the car being a li'l fidgety over those speeds.To put it in a better way AFTER A CERTAIN POINT (SAY 110 KMPH+) I was always conscious of the speeds the car was doing and was getting a feeling that I should'nt be stretching it any further after say another 20-30 odd clicks.Which is in stark contrast to an Octy or say a Fiesta.

What I mean to say here is that although "scary" is a relative term for describing the handling limits of a car, someone who's come to expect a certain level of composure/stability/finesse in the department of handling after experiencing the Octys/Lineas/Fiesta, and is accustomed to the way these handle, it would'nt exactly be the first choice.And there's a lot more to handling than jus suspension mods.Steering feedback/behaviour also goes a long way.As people before me have said, it all boils down to the priorities one gives to different parameters like handling/performance/looks/feartures/resale that go in making a choice.

The Verna isnt definitely an enthusiast's choice if one considers the handling & performance of the car as a package.Capable Engine.Impressive to be honest.Questionable handling at high speeds.It almost certainly will require considerably more caution at anything above 120 than say an Octy/Fiesta/Linea (coming from brands which the OP is accustomed to).Sorry for the long post.Hope I could put my observation across.
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Old 22nd September 2011, 17:39   #87
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Default Re: Hyundai Verna Fluidic Disappointment. And SOLD!

I think the culprit must be the EPS units the new cars come with and their levels of assistance and how they "don't" weigh up with increase in speed and and add to it the softly sprung setup must have given the scare. The difference between the Optra and Verna would be better steering feel in the Optra due to the old hydraulic unit.

Last edited by Durango Dude : 22nd September 2011 at 17:40.
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Old 22nd September 2011, 18:16   #88
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Default Re: Hyundai Verna Fluidic Disappointment. And SOLD!

Quote:
Originally Posted by RoadTiger View Post
I agree - Hyundai has a very poor reputation for ride and handling, even among novices.

As an owner of Ford and Hyundai cars, I have experienced a HUGE world of a difference between the ride and handling of the two.

When it comes to ride and handling, I believe Fiat and Ford decimate the competition in the sub-10 lac segment ! Even the otherwise-formidable Honda cars cant compare with either.
RoadTiger,

You have hit the nail on the head. I have owned an Ikon 1.6 & now owns a Palio SDX and talk about handling and poise at high speeds the Fiats takes the cake closely followed by the Fords.

In my Palio I regulary drive between 120-140 on 4 laned highways and its stability coupled with great feedback from the steering inspires confidence to take curves at 100 kmph on stock tires.

I've not driven the Fluidic Verna but I have driven the old one & Getz CRDI and those cars never inspired confidence at high speeds.

I think that Hyundai missed a great chance to catch the competition by the scruff off the neck with the Fluidic Verna by not improving on it's traditional weakness. The Car ticks almost all the boxes and I feel that it is the best looker after Linea in the segment.
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Old 22nd September 2011, 18:41   #89
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Default Re: Hyundai Verna Fluidic Disappointment. And SOLD!

So most of us including me agree that fords and fiats are better handlers than Hyundai's.

to the OP: instead of something costly like a suspension change and stuff like that, why not just go to a good leather shop like stanley's and get the dash in whatever shade of leather that you like? I have been to leathermen here and they say that it is possible, only thing is that you have to make the arrangements to remove the dash. You can get a good handling car with whatever colour of interiors that you like.

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Old 22nd September 2011, 18:55   #90
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Default Re: Hyundai Verna Fluidic Disappointment. And SOLD!

A few threads I have read in recent times have made me think again about whether or not to go ahead with the decision of buying a Fluidic Verna. I had booked the car 3 and half months ago and I am promised delivery in October by my dealer.

I was initially considering getting a less used Cruze. But Hyundai looked to be a much more practical choice for a city car. Most of the reviews that I have read online complain about handling above a speed of 100 or 120. To be honest, if you are person who drives in the city and do occasional highway runs Verna should be a good choice compared to a lot of other cars in the same segment.

It might not be excellent in handling, but Verna is a car that does a lot of things well. Looks really good, is loaded with features, has a good engine, has one of the best fuel economy figures, has great A.S.S and should give high resale value. It is a great family car and as a package it is a great choice in that segment.
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