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Old 16th November 2011, 20:17   #91
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Default Re: Tata Aria Pride - Zero Pride in Ownership

Come on guys, there were two major incidents albiet serious in nature but then niggles are a part of life, take a look at threads with discuss clutch issue with the scorpio or brake issue with the new swift. So long as TML is owning upto the problem and resolving it satisfactorily i see a ray of hope. Do refer to my earlier post, as per the service record none of the problems have "re-surfaced" after a fix and the fact that the vehicles have been plying quite a bit is testimony to the fact that the vehicles are not lemons. Hence to deamonise to such an extent in my humble opinion is incorrect.

Something happened within a few days of the first service, and that may hold the key to this mystery.
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Old 16th November 2011, 20:43   #92
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Default Re: Tata Aria Pride - Zero Pride in Ownership

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Originally Posted by cyberwhizs View Post
Come on guys, there were two major incidents albiet serious in nature but then niggles are a part of life, take a look at threads with discuss clutch issue with the scorpio or brake issue with the new swift. So long as TML is owning upto the problem and resolving it satisfactorily i see a ray of hope. Do refer to my earlier post, as per the service record none of the problems have "re-surfaced" after a fix and the fact that the vehicles have been plying quite a bit is testimony to the fact that the vehicles are not lemons. Hence to deamonise to such an extent in my humble opinion is incorrect.

Something happened within a few days of the first service, and that may hold the key to this mystery.
I would like to compare Mahindra's attitude to tata's attitude,both being indian manufacturers, When Kedarwalke's XUV's door did not close, Kedar called up Mahindra's point of coantact and immediately Goa's M&M technicians were arranged to be on the spot. We must note here that M&M Goa dealers have not even seen the XUV prbably, forget knowing the mechanicals. the attitude taht M&M shows must be appreciated, where the Mumbai team, would telephonically tell the Goa team on what repairs to be carried out.

Look at Tata's attitude, as mentioned in this thread, the car is lying in the workshop for a considerable amount of time, eventhough Tata factory is just 5 kms away. cant tata send someone with decision making power to resolve this ?

Turn around time is also very important. if the vehicle is in the workshop for too much time, people who are dependent on the vehicle daily are impacted.

What i am trying to say is that even when XUV developed major problems like door not closing, it was not attempted by Kedar(example) to sell off his xuv and look at toyota / honda. Mistakes to happen, but effectively and quickly it is resolved is what matters.

Toyota is offering 60 minutes service and Tata is offering 60 day service

Last edited by scopriobharath : 16th November 2011 at 20:47.
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Old 16th November 2011, 20:54   #93
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Default Re: Tata Aria Pride - Zero Pride in Ownership

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Originally Posted by indian21r View Post
Dear Mr.Reddy,

We have noted your concerns. Our team will take up the pending concern of Extended Warranty on priority. Territory Sales Manager –UV will speak to you w.r.t status updates in the next 3 working days.

In addition to this we once again apologize for the inconvenience caused to you and the user of the Aria vehicle bearing registration number MH12. We would request to share the details of the workshop where the vehicle has been towed to, as the same cannot be traced in our system as of now. We will prioritize to address each and every concern of said vehicle. Our Customer support team (handling the particular workshop) will personally supervise the necessary work to be done.

Rest assured all the concerns will be addressed to your satisfaction. Thanking you for your patience and patronage.

Regards,
Ravi Nair

Respone from Tata. But till now I am yet to receive the call or the extended warranty.
If I had been in Mr. Ravi Nair's shoes, I would have sent my best diagnostic mechanic over to see the cars. And then personally asked for an appointment with indian21r.

And R&D and production people should have been swarming over these two vehicles. I don't see that happening.

I don't think the marketing/ service department understand the seriousness of this situation. Fobbing off a person who has voted with his wallet for not one but two of TMLs premium products with a form letter!

@indian21r, did you get a loan vehicle?

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Old 16th November 2011, 21:29   #94
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Default Re: Tata Aria Pride - Zero Pride in Ownership

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Originally Posted by scopriobharath View Post
I would like to compare Mahindra's attitude to tata's attitude,both being indian manufacturers, When Kedarwalke's XUV's door did not close, Kedar called up Mahindra's point of coantact and immediately Goa's M&M technicians were arranged to be on the spot. We must note here that M&M Goa dealers have not even seen the XUV prbably, forget knowing the mechanicals. the attitude taht M&M shows must be appreciated, where the Mumbai team, would telephonically tell the Goa team on what repairs to be carried out.

Look at Tata's attitude, as mentioned in this thread, the car is lying in the workshop for a considerable amount of time, eventhough Tata factory is just 5 kms away. cant tata send someone with decision making power to resolve this ?

Turn around time is also very important. if the vehicle is in the workshop for too much time, people who are dependent on the vehicle daily are impacted.

What i am trying to say is that even when XUV developed major problems like door not closing, it was not attempted by Kedar(example) to sell off his xuv and look at toyota / honda. Mistakes to happen, but effectively and quickly it is resolved is what matters.

Toyota is offering 60 minutes service and Tata is offering 60 day service
TASC does leave a lot to be desired, no one is debating that anyway.

However, this does bring one interesting point , TML does offer emergency breakdown assistance, including free towings, on its smaller cars through a tieup with MyTVS not sure if it offered with ARIA and they do attend to issues with alacrity.

ACM's Aria review http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-d...-place-13.html does seem to indicate that there are some issues with the clutch/gearbox parts which is being addressed by TML.

Probably the ASC messed something up during the first service as part of proactive fixes, but the fact at this point in time is that we really dont know what happened then.

60 day service: That was a good one, TML has the company of quite few german/european manufacturers too
PS: jokes apart is the vehicle at the ASC for 60 days? i thought he had a issue on 11/11

Last edited by cyberwhizs : 16th November 2011 at 21:42.
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Old 16th November 2011, 22:04   #95
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Default Re: Tata Aria Pride - Zero Pride in Ownership

^^^ yes but a taxi owner will be very particular when he has spent 12 lacs by taking a loan.

he didnt face any breakdown or similar problems

and its not that tata doesnt go that extra hand like mahindra.

one of our forum members safari was taken directly to the assembly line and most of the components were changed when he was not satisfied.

we will wait for indian21r s case to be closed. lets not become jumping jacks and turn this thread too into mahindra vs tata etc.

Last edited by amit_mechengg : 16th November 2011 at 22:09.
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Old 17th November 2011, 14:18   #96
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Originally Posted by Reinhard View Post
1. How are the other vehicles in the fleet doing when handled by the same drivers that had the ARIAs?
As long as they run no problem.

2. Are there any MODs done in the electrical fronts of the ARIAs? Like a simple horn upgrade? If the job is not done properly, even a simple earthing miss has the capability to make the whole electronics go bonkers.
None. Why would I want mods after getting everything with the car. Top end

3. These ARIAs have run a hell lot in a short span. Which places did they go? If they were taken to places with roads washed away with rain, and were driven carelessly off road / in rural areas, any damage is possible.
The running is infact too less for a car which has to travel a minimum of 120kms distances /day. My own innova does close to 40,000kms a year without any issues. The car is designed as 4x4 to be driven off raod. But we have Mahindra Thars to do that job. So all Arias do is NH4, Golden Quadilateral, for 100kms and 20kms of SH. If the car cannot do this also then what is its purpose???

4. These are being used for long journeys with driver in ownership for most of the time. How documented are the movements? Who knows if there is some misuse being done? Some parts being sold off for cheap replacements using connections in workshops? Leave no stones unturned.
Wow man where will they even get replacement parts when Tata itself is not having spares for damaged parts. They do not even change oil during the initial service

5. Rational thinking opens up the question, that why 100% ARIAs in this particular co.'s ownership are going bad when we don't have too many such reports? I have met tens of ARIA owners (if not hundreds) at the same Pandit Auto workshop and ALL of them have been completely happy always, without a niggle.The dealer is not Pandit neither the service center. Where will get reports for Cars with so few owners. Further Many a times repair is done by team from Tata Motors. But they do not seem to know where the problem lies

6. Service guys have definitely been below par in your case. You need to escalate that further. Contrary to your experiences, I've ALWAYS had a prompt response and prompt service whenever I contacted TATA instead of the dealership. Not even the CMD or CEO levels. Just the cac@tatamotors email ID. (Not sure if its still the same. Been more than an year since I last wrote to them.)all my mails are marked to customercare as well.

Team BHP is a unique forum which always stays unbiased and rational. Lets do it that way here also. This case needs advises to get the 2 cars back on road for long run. Not our views about how bad Tata is. Those won't help much fellows...
2 cars out of 2000 sold is a really bad.

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Originally Posted by extreme_torque View Post
Not Tata but Tata Motors and I hope you realize the difference. Your argument is based on the premise that we are going overboard with bashing Tata when its Tata Motors actually. And its not as if we are making a mountain out of a mole hill, there are real problems and we are pointing them out and even suggesting solutions on a number of threads on tbhp. Thats consultation for free because we know what Tata brand stands for and stories like this and numerous others don't do it any favor.
Agree with you 100% man. I personally respect Mr. Tata a lot but that does not mean I have to accept trash from the group companies.

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Originally Posted by Reinhard View Post
Indeed...That's the main reason why I said we should not jump to a conclusion that the cars are bad, and Tata Motors. Those are the things that could kill any vehicle and we don't know about them. I agree that Indian is a trusted BHPian, but note that he is not the person who looks after those ARIAs or drives them to remote places. He may not be in a position to see the full picture due to obvious business situations.
Infact I informed Mr. Desai of Tata Motors that I will wait until the cars have the third breakdown before I will post in Team Bhp. I had long discussions with the technical team as well. They accept the faults but what use is it if it keeps repeating. I am not here to kill the product. But making fools out of people is not acceptable.

I used to travel in them on a daily basis. Always the cars have senior managers so drivers never get the opportunity to be careless. It is our policy to drive at less than 80 kmph.

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Originally Posted by amit_mechengg View Post
very sad to hear about these problems with ARIA. i heard that your case has become a hot topic @ meetings in TATA Motors. I am sure these will be resolved to your satisfaction.

the bad part of the story was- both the cars faced problem.

Yesterday i happened to meet a tourist driver who had come to drop a TCS manager in our society in Maroon ARIA with yellow number plate.

The driver was the owner of the car shocked to hear this and i was suddenly very much humble with him, he spoke good english too.

He said apart from air escaping continuously from front right tyre he never faced any problem. he has done 18200 kms already.

he also mentioned that Pandit auto gives him a preferential treatment and all the SA have become his good friends.

After getting some money out of this car he said he will buy a pearl white ARIA next time, as this time he took whatever was available immediately.

He loves the innova too which he has and covered 1.4 lacs already but he said that that ARIA is way better to drive and is " Raje " king on highways
Aria drives better true but somehow the seating is not as comfortable as Innova. It is good just for 4 adults. As a taxi it will be an uphill task for it to succeed. Even my friend who works in Tata Motors informed me the same. Half the time they wonder why the car never sells as much as the competition.

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Originally Posted by Reinhard View Post
I've also met quite a lot of satisfied ARIA customers crunching miles like hell. Its not Pandit auto that gives the preference. I believe its Tata's policy to offer preferential service to their Premium ARIA customers.

Its a fact that Tata still has a some way to go to be in the best when it comes to build etc. But these issues faced by Indian are not what all TML cars offer as a free gift package. This definitely is an unlucky one-off (or I should say Two-off) or someone is surely jinxing those cars somewhere somehow.

I really wish TML reads this thread and takes quick actions to repair and hopefully REPLACE those two cars. The damage this thread can do to the already suffering ARIA is unimaginable .

Indian, I hope you have sent the link to this thread in your mails. Don't just share on twitter. Send it in every email you drop. Leverage the collective opinion to get those cars back in order.
I will try to contact my college alumni and see if any of them are in decision making roles. I cannot comment on the preferential service part. My plan was if there is a third breakdown we will park both the cars infront of their Gate and call the media. This also I have informed them

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cesc View Post
A few members are referring to the cars being driven a lot in short span of time. I do not see how driving around 2k kms in a month is 'too much'. 2k kms in a month is around 70 kms a day - roughly 2-3 hours on road. Hardly qualifies as too much driving in my opinion. A lot of people do that kind of driving every day. 3 of the cars in my family notch up close to 3k kms in a month. There are hundreds of people in my office who drive down from Delhi everyday - on an average a 70-80km round trip. I would consider 2k kms as very normal given what I see on a day to day basis.
2k Kms is not even much travel for us I would say. My boses keep doing Mumbai - Pune regularly and more than 4k kms a month. I have seen swifts done more than 50k kms in year.
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Old 17th November 2011, 16:07   #97
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Originally Posted by scopriobharath View Post
Secondly - i would beg to differ in opinion of a taxi driver on the performance of a car. For a taxi driver, if a car gets him from point a to point b it is a niggle free car, even if basic electricals / mechanicals dont work and the whole car vibrates like hell. Secondly, I have never heard any taxi driver telling that his car is bad. Indica drivers praise indica like anything. Sumo cabbies tell there is nothing to beat a Sumo etc. I have travelled by Indica umpteen number of times (Office Cabs) and most of them shudder, vibrate and there is nothing more that can fall out. Oh yes i forgot to mention that most of the dashboard light is gloomy at 1,00,000 kms.

How many cabbies are TBHP members and how many cabbies care about quality, fit and finish ?

I have heard Alto owners say that Alto is the best highway car. In my experience, i have not come across one owner, who will say that his car is not so good on the highway. So, i am not sure how much to value a cabbie's statement.

If i hear a trouble free / niggle free private ownership review from a BHPian at 20,000 kms, i would rate the product as acceptable.
Interesting perspective man. Makes logical sense. As a user of Tata Aria I tried to justify the car to others and would have succeed if there was a trouble free experience

Quote:
Originally Posted by cyberwhizs View Post
Come on guys, there were two major incidents albiet serious in nature but then niggles are a part of life, take a look at threads with discuss clutch issue with the scorpio or brake issue with the new swift. So long as TML is owning upto the problem and resolving it satisfactorily i see a ray of hope. Do refer to my earlier post, as per the service record none of the problems have "re-surfaced" after a fix and the fact that the vehicles have been plying quite a bit is testimony to the fact that the vehicles are not lemons. Hence to deamonise to such an extent in my humble opinion is incorrect.

Something happened within a few days of the first service, and that may hold the key to this mystery.
No man same parts failed over and over. BMS module took them more than 5 days to rectify, each time a more technical team worked on it. Failure of 15 different parts is not acceptable. Now they are changing both clutch plates and pressure plates, awaiting delivery of them from Tata Motors.

The car is yet to be delivered

Quote:
Originally Posted by scopriobharath View Post
cant tata send someone with decision making power to resolve this ? Turn around time is also very important. if the vehicle is in the workshop for too much time, people who are dependent on the vehicle daily are impacted.
Turnaround time is something that we Indians do not seem to give importance. It is what makes the service experience pleasant in my books.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sutripta View Post
@indian21r, did you get a loan vehicle?
I got it last time when both cars were out of service. Not Now though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cyberwhizs View Post
However, this does bring one interesting point , TML does offer emergency breakdown assistance, including free towings, on its smaller cars through a tieup with MyTVS not sure if it offered with ARIA and they do attend to issues with alacrity.

i thought he had a issue on 11/11
This time I guess they are bearing the towing cost. Can confirm only after I see the bill. 11/11/11 good day
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Old 17th November 2011, 17:07   #98
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Originally Posted by indian21r View Post
2 cars out of 2000 sold is a really bad.
Make that a 3, will ya?

There are many many more people I have met/spoken with; who are facing issues with their Aria's, Including a few others from our forum itself! Thankfully enough my car has not given me any serious failures and the mechanicals do seem to be all right.

Out of my 5-6 month ownership my car has at least spent close to a month at the TASC.

So my friend you are not alone, The customer care shows that they really care but when it comes to the TASC things get worse.

If you have observed, my thread does not have any service reports as such because I was waiting for things to straighten out.

That is definitely far away from happening, currently my car is at the service center since the past few days AGAIN but this time for the 15k service and issues that I have been facing.

They till date have NO solution!

I repeat that I have experienced ZERO preferential treatment at the TASC. Even the appointments I get are more than 15-25 days away!

Eg: Just a few days back when I had dropped off my car, Even after having a prior appointment I was asked to wait for about 2.5 hours!

I will update about my experience and the issues once I get my car back as I am in no haste to do the same.

But Tata needs to improve!

A great product is getting ruined by its own company.

More issues are observed every time my car arrives from the TASC, not to forget the scratches, stains and dents they give out free with every visit.

I too got my car around the same time as you got yours from the very same dealership in the very same condition you described!

Does that mean something? Well, having spoken to other owners I can definitely say that owning an Aria is not EASY!

A good product ruined by the TASC/Attitude of the company!

After all I have been through and I am still going through,

I love the Aria but when issues cant be rectified by the TASC themselves and when I am treated like I have purchased a cursed vehicle!

Trust me when I say this people;

A reliable vehicle is far more of a luxury than an electronic blunder!

PS: I also own not one but two Innova's !

Last edited by Zappex : 17th November 2011 at 17:35.
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Old 17th November 2011, 17:35   #99
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Default Re: Tata Aria Pride - Zero Pride in Ownership

Sad to hear this story , Probably they should have packed some less features and payed more attention to QA.

Driving test mules for millions of KM do not necessarily mean that they can produce niggle free cars because the loose ends seem to be in the Quality of the components procured in mass manufacturing. I suspect their vendors provide high quality parts for test mule and then drive down the costs and quality later.

Just one word being a Tata vehicle owner myself, do you see a pattern that major breakdown happens after a service visit ? If yes then probably changing the service station may help. I have heard (hearsay) some service stations are crooked and make money by unethical practices.
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Old 17th November 2011, 17:44   #100
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Originally Posted by indian21r View Post
Turnaround time is something that we Indians do not seem to give importance. It is what makes the service experience pleasant in my books.
Makes total sense. In fact i am suprised with Tata's turnaround time here. Tata's favorite audience(Taxi segment) needs a quick turnarond time, since if a taxi vehicle does not run for a single day, loses will be huge for the owner. In fact theoritically, Tata should have the fastest and best turnaround time for service as most of tata's customers are sumos and indica cabbies.
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Old 17th November 2011, 18:01   #101
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Default Re: Tata Aria Pride - Zero Pride in Ownership

Quote:
Originally Posted by scopriobharath View Post
Makes total sense. In fact i am suprised with Tata's turnaround time here. Tata's favorite audience(Taxi segment) needs a quick turnarond time, since if a taxi vehicle does not run for a single day, loses will be huge for the owner. In fact theoritically, Tata should have the fastest and best turnaround time for service as most of tata's customers are sumos and indica cabbies.
Infact taxi guys mostly never visit the A.S.S., they have their preferred local mechanics who give them preferential treatment.
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Old 17th November 2011, 18:12   #102
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Make that a 3, will ya? Sad to hear that Man. As a firm we will book losses but for an individual it must hurt real bad.

Out of my 5-6 month ownership my car has at least spent close to a month at the TASC.Why does Tata like to keep the vehicles they sold with them??

They till date have NO solution!That is my biggest worry. As supposed developers of the car they are clueless a lot of times. This happens not just with TASC guys , even Tata Motors team cannot identify nor rectify the problem immediately

I too got my car around the same time as you got yours from the very same dealership in the very same condition you described! Hmm That is sad man. Wasan looks like a cheap fella

Does that mean something? Well, having spoken to other owners I can definitely say that owning an Aria is not EASY! We pride in owning the white elephants.

A reliable vehicle is far more of a luxury than an electronic blunder! 100% agreed. A car is a mechanical wonder
Quote:
Originally Posted by scopriobharath View Post
Makes total sense. In fact i am suprised with Tata's turnaround time here. Tata's favorite audience(Taxi segment) needs a quick turnarond time, since if a taxi vehicle does not run for a single day, loses will be huge for the owner. In fact theoritically, Tata should have the fastest and best turnaround time for service as most of tata's customers are sumos and indica cabbies.
Our Indigo in Hyderabad never had such long visits. But theory is not practical
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Old 17th November 2011, 18:17   #103
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Default Re: Tata Aria Pride - Zero Pride in Ownership

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Originally Posted by Zappex View Post
Make that a 3, will ya?

A reliable vehicle is far more of a luxury than an electronic blunder
Another one bites the dust. So much for the best car built by Tata till date. I remember we the dents they gave us while servicing the car. Really sad.
Another thing, has the navigation and USB problem been sorted out yet?

Last edited by DeKay : 17th November 2011 at 18:25.
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Old 17th November 2011, 18:31   #104
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Sad to hear that Man. As a firm we will book losses but for an individual it must hurt real bad.
IMO, Booking losses isn't the most practical way to go around this. I fully agree that having a breakdown is more than taxing but still.

I have not faced issues nearly as severe as yours but lets just wait and watch if they can rectify even the minutest of them.

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Originally Posted by indian21r View Post
Why does Tata like to keep the vehicles they sold with them??

They have no choice, It is unacceptable for a customer to take his new car back with defects!

Quote:
Originally Posted by indian21r View Post
That is my biggest worry. As supposed developers of the car they are clueless a lot of times. This happens not just with TASC guys , even Tata Motors team cannot identify nor rectify the problem immediately

I really don't understand, is it that difficult to assign a proper person to look into our problems and solve them?

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Originally Posted by indian21r View Post
Hmm That is sad man. Wasan looks like a cheap fella

If you must know my dealership experience, head over to my thread and surprise yourself!

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Originally Posted by indian21r View Post
We pride in owning the white elephants.

I still love the pride but others admiring my ride don't know whats going on the inside!

Quote:
Originally Posted by indian21r View Post
100% agreed. A car is a mechanical wonder

More like a blunder in Tata's case.

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Originally Posted by DeKay View Post
Another one bites the dust. So much for the best car built by Tata till date. I remember we the dents they gave us while servicing the car. Really sad.
True, it is really sad.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeKay View Post
Another thing, has the navigation and USB problem been sorted out yet?
All in good time, The problems are WIP. Just waiting for the car to come back.

Last edited by Zappex : 17th November 2011 at 18:42.
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Old 17th November 2011, 18:58   #105
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Indian21r, there's really no point in wasting any more time with the Aria. Follow up with the Tata folks to get it fixed up and in running condition, and then sell it off. Its gonna cost you a lot, but from the way they've been handling ur case, its obvious that they dont care.

Move onto a Toyota, Im sure you'll be a lot happier.

I'm really surprised how people can keep asking about the quality of roads the Aria has been run on, the type of driving, the no of kms run, the fact that its an advanced car with electronic features never seen before, etc....

Come on, its not rocket science, clutch failure, brake failure, and on 2 vehicles which basically ply on the Bombay Pune expressway, and forget about the failures, look at the service standards, and this for a premium vehicle. Really sad.
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