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Old 9th November 2012, 11:32   #16
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Default re: Tata Aria Pride 4x4: Owner's pain & frustration. EDIT: Saves 3 lives in an accident!

Hi Bravo,

Sorry to read your story,

Infact thought that your vehicle is running fine now.

Call me when possible we can discuss the details,I'll help you to get things rectified & this time it would be done for sure.

Thanks & Regards
Anupam
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Old 9th November 2012, 11:40   #17
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Default re: Tata Aria Pride 4x4: Owner's pain & frustration. EDIT: Saves 3 lives in an accident!

bravo @bravo82in!!! I really mean it. Hats off to your patience and the level of maturity that you have shown. I am not quite sure how I would've reacted if I were to be treated (rather mistreated) like this.

Heck you payed quite a sizable chunk of your hard earned money and they expect you to run from pillar to post for no fault of yours. I'm not sure if this goes against the forum rules, but that "sales manager" ought to be punched in the face. His so called team could not even guarantee 10 days of trouble free performance and he's asking you to wait till everything goes downhill - again??!!! Don't we customers atleast deserve some respect??

Like someone has already pointed out, this clearly seems to be a lemon. Carefully track everything they do to your car and document every communication that you have with them. I don't think you should let them run R&D at your expense - not money but time and patience. I would suggest that you start looking for a capable lawyer and prepare to approach the consumer forum - if you see that this is not getting anywhere.
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Old 9th November 2012, 12:57   #18
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Default re: Tata Aria Pride 4x4: Owner's pain & frustration. EDIT: Saves 3 lives in an accident!

Such incidents do mar our experience of a new vehicle and honestly speaking, kill the joy of 20L spent on the new car.

Looking at your pains and frustrations, there are few observations on our end:

1. The engine issue is totally a case of negligence on part of TASC rather than a vehicle defect. Rapid loss of engine oil is a sure shot sign of brewing trouble in vehicle's engine department and is usually a minor issue which takes a much fatal turn for engine life when left unnoticed.

2. For issues with Front tyre misalignment and steering misalignment, TML has already brought a change in steering setup involving a very small Rs. 21 part update provided FREE OF COST to all vehicles manufactured prior to Jan 2012. All vehicles manufactured post this date are already updated.

3. Bluetooth clarity is actually not a defect but really a case of quality. Different systems have different quality parameters. While a BMW or Audi would provide a crisp and loud hands-free conversation, all vehicles in sub 20L range have varying quality of Bluetooth communication. You can surely tinker with the settings in system menu to achieve a more comfortable function.

4. Please provide more details on ABS failure as you have not elaborated on the incident anywhere despite your having gotten the vehicle towed. ABS malfunctions usually do not require tow service since vehicle functionality is usually not hampered.

5. It seems that TML engineers have actually taken proactive steps in your case barring the regional sales manager whose words simply fail me.

6. Can you please share your vehicle chassis no. to provide more details on the issue.

I am yet to experience any broken plastic parts and rattling in my Aria also bought around 11 months back so I am not the most competent person to comment.

Also, the Footmats and Mudflaps provided to you are dealer procured in most cases and are not provided by TML. I know for sure, since I did not receive any such freebies with my vehicle. Instead, my dealer provided me with Sunfilm which was again not TML accessory but rather locally procured 3M product.

It is to be also noted that Safari comes pre-fitted with Sidesteps while Aria does not. So, anything the saleswoman said is untrue. Aria does not require Sidesteps in most cases and TML provides retractable Sidesteps which can be folded up so as to avoid any loss of ground clearance.

Quote:
Lemon alert!!! I wonder why once in a while Tata produces a major lemon and then sells it to an unsuspecting customer. I mean engine failing at 7k kms is plain shocking!!!
I have already mentioned that Engine issue too is due to negligence on the part of service centre and the issue could have been rectified much earlier.

Quote:
Storme and Aria (after the recent price cut for the lowest end version) just went OUT OF THE WINDOW as a replacement candidate for my Logan for next year, after reading this thread. I was also looking for a spacious 6/7 seater fit for touring with family.
We all have read enough in the past over Tata's wretched product and service quality, but I thought that maybe the product part had become better over the years.
I'm not sure, it might have become a bit better for some of you, but thanks, I am in no mood to be a guinea pig.
Please don't get disheartened here. We need to understand vehicle issues before writing off very competent products. I too have owned an Aria now for over 11 months and have a totally different story to tell altogether.

There are numerous other very successful products with 100s of pages of technical issues thread and yet they sell in numbers and provide satisfactory and enjoyable ownership tenure.

Please be rest assured that both the Storme and Aria and all other vehicles in this price range from any manufacturer are not LEMONS! Try and test the vehicles in person and then decide on the quality of vehicle.
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Old 9th November 2012, 14:01   #19
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Default re: Tata Aria Pride 4x4: Owner's pain & frustration. EDIT: Saves 3 lives in an accident!

Sorry to hear about your ordeal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mayankjha1806 View Post
the way it looks to me is Tata is trying to help the customer out, by replacing parts free of cost...
+1, that's what my experience's been. The quality of service is below par but they do listen and try to help.

Last edited by ~~h : 9th November 2012 at 14:01. Reason: fixing typo
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Old 9th November 2012, 14:07   #20
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Default re: Tata Aria Pride 4x4: Owner's pain & frustration. EDIT: Saves 3 lives in an accident!

Quote:
Originally Posted by bravo82in View Post
Before I begin let me first summarize my ownership experience till date
Really shocking. All sub-systems seem to have gone kaput in a single vehicle - engine/drivetrain, electricals, suspension, braking, embellishments etc. How much have you spent till date in the 60 days that the vehicle has spent at the service center? Mind sharing some job cards/ bills to understand how did they treat this during warranty period?

Last edited by bblost : 9th November 2012 at 22:51. Reason: Please avoid quoting a large post in full. Thanks.
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Old 9th November 2012, 14:27   #21
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Default re: Tata Aria Pride 4x4: Owner's pain & frustration. EDIT: Saves 3 lives in an accident!

Quote:
Originally Posted by akhilesh51 View Post
Please don't get disheartened here. We need to understand vehicle issues before writing off very competent products. I too have owned an Aria now for over 11 months and have a totally different story to tell altogether.

There are numerous other very successful products with 100s of pages of technical issues thread and yet they sell in numbers and provide satisfactory and enjoyable ownership tenure.

Please be rest assured that both the Storme and Aria and all other vehicles in this price range from any manufacturer are not LEMONS! Try and test the vehicles in person and then decide on the quality of vehicle.
I don't disagree with you or your experience with Tata Akhilesh, and I have myself said in my previous post, that some folks may have had relatively pleasant experiences with Tata products. For example my tenant bought a Manza about a year and a half back and he hasn't reported anything amiss or unusual so far. There are many more similar examples within my friend circle.
However, after reading this and a few other threads on Tata products, I would be too scared to place my money on the same. As I said, I can't be a Guinea Pig here.
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Old 9th November 2012, 14:43   #22
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Default re: Tata Aria Pride 4x4: Owner's pain & frustration. EDIT: Saves 3 lives in an accident!

Scary !! every now and then i makeup my mind to think about Tata as my upgrade and then read such articles.

We here about Tata planning to become No.2 and with stories like this, its going to be pretty tough task for Tata to clean their image

All manufacturers have issues. We all know about Skoda. i have seen my friends having issues with Hyundai as well. But Tata vehicles are typically targetted towards rural hence should be more rugged but what we hear is totally opposite. more probability of getting stranded !!!
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Old 9th November 2012, 14:52   #23
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Default re: Tata Aria Pride 4x4: Owner's pain & frustration. EDIT: Saves 3 lives in an accident!

I agree with Akhilesh that this seems to be triggered by the dealer's sloppiness end and does not look like a manufacturing defect.

Ofcouse it is easy to pile it on Tata. But my humble advice to you is to negotiate with Tata on friendly terms explaining your helplessness. Also, (don't get me wrong), please don't believe whatever the dealer says.
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Old 9th November 2012, 15:32   #24
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Default re: Tata Aria Pride 4x4: Owner's pain & frustration. EDIT: Saves 3 lives in an accident!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trapezio View Post
Ofcouse it is easy to pile it on Tata. But my humble advice to you is to negotiate with Tata on friendly terms explaining your helplessness. Also, (don't get me wrong), please don't believe whatever the dealer says.
Spot On! Personally, Tata is improving by leaps and bounds with every new product and the dealer network too is improving but the pace may be mismatched.

Many a times, the product is perfectly fine but negligence on the part of customer or dealer can make it go wrong and picture itself as LEMON. In this case too, I have felt much of the issues are dealer related and rest assured TML too will take the case of the dealer if it is so.
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Old 9th November 2012, 16:29   #25
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Default re: Tata Aria Pride 4x4: Owner's pain & frustration. EDIT: Saves 3 lives in an accident!

Is it time for Tata fans to come on board this thread and start blaming the Service Center, The Vendors, the neighbours dog, etc. Basically everyone except Tata Motors is to blame. Tata Motors is a poor victim of this whole episode.

Jokes apart, this is absolutely unacceptable. As much as I like Tata vehicles, they really need to get their act together. They tend to take more interest in their low budget/high volume vehicles like Indica/Sumo etc than their premium offerings. Basically, I have come to realize that anything you drive out of a Tata or Mahindra show room should cost less than 8 lakhs on the road. Neither manufacturer is ready to sell premium products yet.
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Old 9th November 2012, 18:03   #26
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Default re: Tata Aria Pride 4x4: Owner's pain & frustration. EDIT: Saves 3 lives in an accident!

Bravo, really bad experience with the most expensive offering from Tata. My sympathies.

Tata Motors really need to introspect and decide which direction they want to take. If they are happy with low-end, high volume, low-margin, cut-throat competetion business; they should keep on hashing out more variants of Indica and pray to some automotive-God that they would survive. If they really want to make a mark in mid-level and premium segment, the product and customer experience has to go up by quite a few notches and some good word-of-mouth should start circulating. The dealership and service centers have a huge role to play too as they are the most critical touch-points.

The amount of damage a single sad story like this does to the image of Tata Motors is immense. The earlier Tatas understand that and take some solid corrective steps, the better for everybody.

If I were handling this issue as an Tata Motors executive, I would ensure that at least a handful of heads would roll right from internal QC and customer-care to dealer-service-center staff.

Last edited by SDP : 9th November 2012 at 18:05.
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Old 9th November 2012, 18:17   #27
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Default re: Tata Aria Pride 4x4: Owner's pain & frustration. EDIT: Saves 3 lives in an accident!

This is what scares me from buying a Safari as our next family car .

Mistakes are made and faults do arise , after all its a machine and they do go wrong . However the sheer incompetence of the service center to solve them leaves me wondering what future TATA has. Its a company that promises the sky but unfortunately shows you the reality in no time .More over im surprised to know that tata engineers could not figure out what was wrong with your car!
And I commend your patience. However i guess all these issues should now be brought before the court. We have had instances earlier where the court has ordered manufacturers to replace such vehicles plagued with issues.

I have always been a TATA fan all my life and I still dream of owning the safari , but such incidents really squash ones dreams .

No wonder Mahindra is ahead !
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Old 10th November 2012, 00:46   #28
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Default re: Tata Aria Pride 4x4: Owner's pain & frustration. EDIT: Saves 3 lives in an accident!

Quote:
Originally Posted by mayankjha1806 View Post
there is still a huge difference between Tata and Skoda. Folks talk bad about Skoda for no reason. In this case, the way it looks to me is Tata is trying to help the customer out, by replacing parts free of cost, and i believe of the customer demands a replacement of the car they might listen. In my view Skoda's are worse, they wont even acknowledge there is a problem forget supporting the customer, all they try to do is brush the issue under the carpet. There are innumerable examples of this.
Though I cant comment about the skodas but I can certainly say that Tata do listen and take corrective measures but its limited to replacing parts under warranty and tightening the noose against dealers, but i my case this alone wont suffice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by teamveevee View Post
Sorry to hear about these incidents. Looks like you are so frustrated, decided to start a new thread. Most of the details you mentioned here are already covered (Tata Aria Pride - Zero Pride in Ownership)in detail in indian21r s thread. Only good thing is of the TBHPians who own Aria only Indian21r and you reported series of issues, others reported one off incidents.
One discrepancy noticed in chronology of events is, earlier you mentioned in one post (Tata Aria Pride - Zero Pride in Ownership)

But in this thread you said you had issues from day 1 with security system, Mal aligned steering etc. May be you forgot about these incidents?
Hope you will not have any issues in the future.
Security issue went unnoticed for quite a long time. Retrospectively i realized the issue was from day one. To give details; the car used to get unlocked on its own overnight. Now if i try to pull the door handle the cars security system will go off. Since i always used the remote to unlock i failed to realize that this was an issue.
Mal aligned steering and rattle, i never mentioned on team bhp earlier because posting here would mean a lot to Tata motors reputation.

Infact i had drafted this thread 6 months back but never put it here. Posting here would magnify the case many time and it would affect Tata motors badly. But Tata motors harassed me to the extent that i was left with no choice. The statement of product manager further added fuel to fire.
Quote:
Originally Posted by roy_libran View Post

I see you are based out of Gurgaon, so why don't you come over to one of our GURGAON MEETS sometime?
I would love to join you. However i am unaware of these happenings.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MAS View Post
@bravo82in - I would suggest you to sell the car immediately and go for a more trusted brand, especially when you are going in for a luxury segment.
The quoted price of this car by Tata resale section is 7 lacs. I cant afford to lose 10 lacs for 1 year of usage. I can get a better price by selling it to someone close or known to but how can i pass this lemon to someone else?

Quote:
Originally Posted by akhilesh51 View Post

1. The engine issue is totally a case of negligence on part of TASC rather than a vehicle defect.

2. For issues with Front tyre misalignment and steering misalignment, TML has already brought a change in steering setup involving a very small Rs. 21 part update provided FREE OF COST to all vehicles manufactured prior to Jan 2012. All vehicles manufactured post this date are already updated.

3. Bluetooth clarity is actually not a defect but really a case of quality. Different systems have different quality parameters. While a BMW or Audi would provide a crisp and loud hands-free conversation, all vehicles in sub 20L range have varying quality of Bluetooth communication. You can surely tinker with the settings in system menu to achieve a more comfortable function.

4. Please provide more details on ABS failure as you have not elaborated on the incident anywhere despite your having gotten the vehicle towed. ABS malfunctions usually do not require tow service since vehicle functionality is usually not hampered.

5. It seems that TML engineers have actually taken proactive steps in your case barring the regional sales manager whose words simply fail me.
1. There was certainly something wrong with the engine. TASC negligence only magnified the issue. But anything going wrong with the engine at 9k kms is not acceptable by any chance. And secondly it took close to a month to mount a new heart in my car. The workshop did its task in 7 days, It took Tatas 3 weeks to provide the parts to the workshop.

2. In my case i lived with a misaligned steering for months before the error was finally rectified, that too after it started chewing the tires. How did the vehicle with misaligned steering pass the PDI?

3. It might be acceptable in Manza or vista but not in Aria. Quality cant be bad to the extent that it makes the bluetooth non usable. If not Audi/BWM class but atleast a decent system is accepted. I brought the issue to the notice of Tata engineers but they too are unable to do anything with the settings. Further issue is more because performance of bluetooth is not consistent.

4. Not sure if actually ABS went wrong. The car was driven through a wet patch(not more that 9 inches of water logging), there was some knocking kind of thing from front tires, Inspected but couldnt find anything. Kept driving for another half a km when the ABS light started flashing. The engine was running but the car refused to move. The car was towed to Autolinks, Rama road. In the morning got a call that 'there is no issue with the car and it running fine. Further ABS sensor got wet causing the car to misbehave. There was some error registered with the system but no problem with the running of the car.'

5 Proactive steps taken by Tata engineers lasted just 10 days/ 1000kms

6. The mats are not manufacture by TML but must be sourced from Tata accessory division. There could have been some quality check over the parts sold at Tata accessories.

7. The side steps were Tata genuine accessory, the dealer only pushed me buy one. The smart lady even insisted on putting fabric seat cover over my leather seats .

8. Thank you for updating me that foldable side steps are available. Though i have no plans of putting any accessory in this lemon.

9. In my case many parts have failed over which Tata can have quality control. What can a dealer do if a part fails.

Quote:
Originally Posted by srh View Post
How much have you spent till date in the 60 days that the vehicle has spent at the service center? Mind sharing some job cards/ bills to understand how did they treat this during warranty period?
All parts replaced under warranty were free, including pick up and delivery. They asked me to pay for consumables which i flatly refused. For minor issues the workshop mechanic visited my place. All i have paid for is the fuel expenses for frequent workshop visits and cab bills while my aria was treated at workshops.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trapezio View Post
I agree with Akhilesh that this seems to be triggered by the dealer's sloppiness end and does not look like a manufacturing defect.
Ofcouse it is easy to pile it on Tata.


Quote:
Originally Posted by akhilesh51 View Post
Many a times, the product is perfectly fine but negligence on the part of customer or dealer can make it go wrong and picture itself as LEMON. In this case too, I have felt much of the issues are dealer related and rest assured TML too will take the case of the dealer if it is so.
Barring one all other issue were product related. Issues reoccurring despite the part being replaced only reflects the poor QC of Tata motors. The Autolinks has so far been supportive. For last two incidence of car getting stranded i can not blame the service in any way. Most of the work done in my car was under the guidance of Tata engineers directly.
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Old 10th November 2012, 07:42   #29
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Default re: Tata Aria Pride 4x4: Owner's pain & frustration. EDIT: Saves 3 lives in an accident!

What is extended warranty duration with the Aria ? Is the Aria parts available in open domain to be able to service the same with any local mechanic/independent garage ?

What would happen if the warranty runs out and these issues persist since TASS service cost are through the roof plus the regular skimming tactics like "Sir Clutch will fail in another 2000 kms , Disk brakes would fail anytime , radiator needs servicing ...etc". Since it is Tata vehicle once would not have much idea on if the service adviser is telling the truth or just trying to meet targets since anything can fail any time here. Hence once extended warranty runs over maintaining a Tata car itself is costly but maintaining a Tata lemon would break the bank. Hence cutting the loses and selling it would be the best option when the warranty is about to get over.

Also i don't think that posting in forums would negatively affect Tata motors in any significant way. Most of the car buying is word of mouth in India and when anyone buys a Tata car nowadays the question which everyone asks is "Why Tata , was there nothing else available".
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Old 10th November 2012, 13:51   #30
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Default re: Tata Aria Pride 4x4: Owner's pain & frustration. EDIT: Saves 3 lives in an accident!

Disappointed, but not shocked. Tata only sells 50 - 100 Arias each month. If it can't keep this minuscule number of owners happy, well, I'm just glad the Aria isn't selling 2,000 units a month!

This shockingly poor quality is why my family has washed it's hands off Tata cars. Really liked the Manza, but family wouldn't approve the car (even though I was sold on the Manza). Our 2007 Indigo is the only car we've gotten rid off in 4.xx years of ownership (we usually keep cars for 8 - 10 years). Reason = The rubbish manner in which it was put together, and the shockingly awful part quality, meant that the car was completely finished by 2011 / 40,000 odd kms. I can't decide which car was the worst to join our family : The '92 Premier 118 NE or the '07 Tata Indigo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by roy_libran View Post
that some folks may have had relatively pleasant experiences with Tata products. For example my tenant bought a Manza about a year and a half back and he hasn't reported anything amiss or unusual so far.
Every manufacturer has satisfied customers, even the Sipani Montana would have a handful.

What matters is the number of dissatisfied customers per 100 or 1000 vehicles sold. It's here that Tata greatly loses out due to its shoddy reliability track record. To put things in perspective, perhaps 2 Honda Citys out of a 100 face problems. With a vehicle like the ol' Tata Indigo, that number is probably closer to 20, if not 30. Thus, there will always be 70 "satisfied" Indigo owners. But the number of unhappy folk will be 15X that of Honda.

Thus, even though there are happy owners, it's the alarmingly high failure rate for the other cars that is of concern.

Another example : We are well aware of DSGs going bust. VW went as far as publicly apologising in China. But you wouldn't believe the number of people I know who have driven 80,000 - 100,000 kms without any issue.
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