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Old 15th January 2014, 09:54   #61
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Default Re: Tata Nano Twist XT : Driven

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Originally Posted by a4anurag View Post
With the front seat adjusted to my height (5'11"), I can happily sur behind and still have some place bergen the setback and my knees - dam my Swift fails on this part.
+1 that. I am 6ft and after adjusting the driver seat there is sufficient room for a 5'7" person to sit

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Originally Posted by Motard_Blr View Post
but it's a Maruti. Need I say more?
This is the key. The mindset of middle class indian buyers.TATA needs to work on its 'Reliability' and 'Trust' imaging if it wants to give the alto & eon a run for their money
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Old 15th January 2014, 10:59   #62
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Default Re: Tata Nano Twist XT : Driven

That's because even tata is confused with its positioning. If you recall the 'awesome' ad, did you see anything utilitarian there. It was clearly 'over the top' attempting to make a huge leap. Also the target group was clearly youngsters/ young achievers in the ad.

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Originally Posted by a4anurag View Post
The Nano may not be desirable add the the Alto 800 but my point is pelt are writing this car off because of its 'Cheap car' image. No one is really having a go in it even before writing it off.

Out of 100 customers who are in the market for the small car, all 100 will go into the Maruti showroom but not even think of entering the Tata one - Thanks to its image and TASS.

Last edited by aah78 : 4th February 2014 at 21:34. Reason: Quote fixed.
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Old 15th January 2014, 11:26   #63
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Default Re: Tata Nano Twist XT : Driven

Autocar reports that Tata has confirmed that its evaluating an automatic transmission for the Nano. Me likey . I've been thinking for a long time that the Nano with PS + Auto-box would be the ultimate city car. Quickly Tata, quickly!
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Old 15th January 2014, 11:59   #64
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Default Re: Tata Nano Twist XT : Driven

Launching Nano Twist XT is a good move by Tata Motors. I have been waiting to buy the diesel version for my wife for almost an year now. But looks like instead of waiting further I would rather buy this Twist for her soon.

It's really sad to see most people discount Nano because of it's "Cheap Image". And unfortunately I believe this image increased by word of mouth from one person to another (as gossip) than just the media. It's probably due to our culture to follow the mass and not evaluate personally based on ones needs.

If one does a clear comparison of features and experiences the Nano in flesh with an open and practical mind keeping aside the image, I am sure the perception will change. Most of them are afraid to justify their decision to buy the Nano to their family and friends.

I feel more sorry for the common man than for Tata on the Nano's failure. Tata gave the mass a great VFM four wheeler which met most of the criteria of what a car should be. The common man failed to use this opportunity to a great extent mainly due to their ego and lack of self awareness.

Some of my friends prefer to drive a 10-15 yr old Omni or Matiz than a Nano. Not sure how much better image they have in society owning these old cars than a Nano.

I have spoken to lot of people in my circle with diverse background and age and the common response from all of them are as below;
1. Sounds like an Auto
2. It's a back engine like an auto
3. It's too fragile and small

Sadly only 2-3 of them out of 50-60 people I might have spoken to said they had seen and experienced the Nano in flesh. Rest of them made the comments based on hearsay and not independent evaluation.

For all the above comments made by people I would like to ask the following questions.
1. What if it sounds like an auto if you don't mind travelling in one ?
2. What if the car is back engine ? How does that affect the drivability or capability ?
3. Fragile ? Just because it was launched at 1 lac doesn't mean its fragile.
4. Small ? Have you seen a Nano next to Maruti Estilo or Wagon R? Do you still see it as small and fragile ?

Hope the Indian mass awake and make a reasonable judgment for their own good.
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Old 15th January 2014, 12:09   #65
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Default Re: Tata Nano Twist XT : Driven

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Originally Posted by Motard_Blr View Post
... The car is quite reliable and capable and there are a lot of advantages and benefits to the Nano, but what about desirability? Buying a car is one of the more important decisions in a lot of people's lives and most often it is an emotional one. An Alto 800 may not be very desirable either but it's a Maruti. Need I say more?
Do you know which car will be recognized by even the kids who have just learnt to talk? Do you know which car will make you famous in the neighbourhood (be it your home or office) without making people jealous?

Talk desirability! Whenever I drive to work, I hear kids say "Nano!" as I pass them. These are kids standing at their doorsteps, in the arms of their mothers or passing by in an autorickshaw. They all recognize the car. Not even a BMW or a Mercedes would have that recognition.

It's an almost go-anywhere car. As long as the terrain is motorable and doesn't require a 4x4 capability, I am sure the Nano would scale it.
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Old 15th January 2014, 12:24   #66
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Default Re: Tata Nano Twist XT : Driven

Tata blundered by positioning the Nano as a "cheap" car & I think they have woken up now. The upwardly mobile Indian middle class will always hesitate to buy such a car. There was way too much hype around the 1 lakh price tag & that put off many a potential buyer.Not to mention the incidents of Nanos catching fire randomly. Regardless of all its flaws( lack of power on the highway,no safety features et al), the Nano had everything that was needed to make a sizeable dent in the market share of the Maruti 800 & the Alto. Smart marketing & some timely PR actions should have done the trick. Unfortunately , Tata squandered a golden opportunity.
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Old 15th January 2014, 12:48   #67
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Default Re: Tata Nano Twist XT : Driven

I would agree with Honeybee here; Kids love the Nano. When I had one, I saw so many kids admiring the Nano. Plus, it comes with a pre-installed FFE
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Old 15th January 2014, 13:05   #68
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Default Re: Tata Nano Twist XT : Driven

Indians by nature are quite influenced by what my neighbor says, no matter if my neighbor is an illiterate retard!!! Buying a car is more to please my neighbors and upgrade my standing in the society, than how much I plan to utilize it.
Nano, failed in precisely this, not being cool enough/costly enough or premium enough, coupled with Ratan Tata's scooter replacement theory, even a tinpot Alto 800 or Estilo seems more desirable.
As the old Alto owner, I speak with experience and I am frankly horrified at what Maruti has managed to do to the Alto 800, from a well built, honest small car, it has turned almost into a 4 seater auto rickshaw with a higher price!! I am sure Maruti has discovered how to turn chart paper to look and feel like metal, if I were to review the body, which I can dent by pushing in a finger. Plastics are a level below, and something horrible has happened to the 800cc engine, because it doesn't seem to pull cleanly beyond 80kmph!!!
Now imagine how much Tata must have blundered with positioning the Nano for it to not beat even the Alto 800.

Last edited by apachelongbow : 15th January 2014 at 13:06.
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Old 15th January 2014, 13:21   #69
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Default Re: Tata Nano Twist XT : Driven

Well said. Im even more shacked about Eon not making the cut with the masses. Alto 800 is a paper car, no doubt. And featureless.


Now imagine how much Tata must have blundered with positioning the Nano for it to not beat even the Alto 800.[/quote]
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Old 15th January 2014, 13:45   #70
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Default Re: Tata Nano Twist XT : Driven

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Originally Posted by apachelongbow View Post
Indians by nature are quite influenced by what my neighbor says, no matter if my neighbor is an illiterate retard!!!
Nano's "cheapest car in the world" tag did the most damage to its sales. I still remember a news where an auto driver sold off his 2 month old Nano and got a pre-owned Maruti 800 because that gave him a bump up the class ladder. In India, at least 95% people do not buy what they require, but buy what other people think they require. What I've seen is that many of the Jazzy coloured Nanos belong to people with more than one car and they consider it as a well rounded city run about. Now with the addition of an EPS it makes an even more stronger case for itself. If Tata markets the Nano as a lifestyle vehicle, I seriously think that it will sell better. It is high time that they remove the "cheap car" image from this one.
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Old 15th January 2014, 14:39   #71
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Default Re: Tata Nano Twist XT : Driven

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Originally Posted by Pardus View Post
Launching Nano Twist XT is a good move by Tata Motors. ... But looks like instead of waiting further I would rather buy this Twist for her soon.
Running costs of Nano actually isn't an issue AT ALL.
Quote:
It's really sad to see most people discount Nano because of it's "Cheap Image". And unfortunately I believe this image increased by word of mouth from one person to another (as gossip) than just the media. It's probably due to our culture to follow the mass and not evaluate personally based on ones needs.
BANG ON! After his announcement about his will to make such a car, Maruti (and some other players) had really bad-mouthed Ratan Tata's idea saying it wasn't possible.

I don't blame the media as much as the people who mocked it AFTER Tata Motors made it possible. IMO the people let down an honest man even after he made the seemingly impossible, possible.

Quote:
...If one does a clear comparison of features and experiences the Nano in flesh with an open and practical mind keeping aside the image, I am sure the perception will change. Most of them are afraid to justify their decision to buy the Nano to their family and friends...

Some of my friends prefer to drive a 10-15 yr old Omni or Matiz than a Nano. Not sure how much better image they have in society owning these old cars than a Nano.
I came across some guy who'd come to Bangalore for just 4 years, and was choosing between a 10 year old esteem and 7yr old Alto, also he didn't know how to drive.

I tried to put some sense into his head, that with him learning, something or the other will start going wrong even if the cars are fit & fine as of now. Atleast with a Nano will have Warranty+Extended W+AMC, and offer better mileage.

After much discussion, I even told him that choosing Alto over Nano is fine, but he should look for better friends.

Quote:
...I feel more sorry for the common man than for Tata on the Nano's failure. Tata gave the mass a great VFM four wheeler which met most of the criteria of what a car should be. The common man failed to use this opportunity to a great extent mainly due to their ego and lack of self awareness...
Tell me about it! I'm into finance and I've seen people having very real financial concerns fail to understand what a financial solution the Nano could be to them, unfortunately they chose longer EMI's just for this biased rationale!

Quote:
...I have spoken to lot of people in my circle with diverse background and age and the common response from all of them are as below;
1. Sounds like an Auto
2. It's a back engine like an auto
3. It's too fragile and small

Sadly only 2-3 of them out of 50-60 people I might have spoken to said they had seen and experienced the Nano in flesh. Rest of them made the comments based on hearsay and not independent evaluation.

For all the above comments made by people I would like to ask the following questions.
1. What if it sounds like an auto if you don't mind travelling in one ?
2. What if the car is back engine ? How does that affect the drivability or capability ?
3. Fragile ? Just because it was launched at 1 lac doesn't mean its fragile.
4. Small ? Have you seen a Nano next to Maruti Estilo or Wagon R? Do you still see it as small and fragile ?

Hope the Indian mass awake and make a reasonable judgment for their own good.
THAT's the problem, IMO 90% of the people criticising it, have never really test drove it or even considered giving it an actual thought. In a way, the initial LONG waiting periods just fueled this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by honeybee View Post
Do you know which car will be recognized by even the kids who have just learnt to talk? Do you know which car will make you famous in the neighbourhood (be it your home or office) without making people jealous?

Talk desirability! Whenever I drive to work, I hear kids say "Nano!" as I pass them. These are kids standing at their doorsteps, in the arms of their mothers or passing by in an autorickshaw. They all recognize the car. Not even a BMW or a Mercedes would have that recognition.

It's an almost go-anywhere car. As long as the terrain is motorable and doesn't require a 4x4 capability, I am sure the Nano would scale it.
+100. Exactly man! THAT feeling. It wasn't the exclusivity, but the sheer fact that people waited & dreamed (not just aspired) to own a car made by an Indian company, for Indian road conditions for the income that an average trying-to-earn Indian would have.
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Old 15th January 2014, 14:45   #72
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Default Re: Tata Nano Twist XT : Driven

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Originally Posted by GrammarNazi View Post
Running costs of Nano actually isn't an issue AT ALL.
Could you point me to the running costs for Nano, service intervals etc?
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Old 15th January 2014, 14:58   #73
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Default Re: Tata Nano Twist XT : Driven

As long as the car battery is inside the cabin, i am not buying this. Power steering or not.
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Old 15th January 2014, 15:00   #74
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Default Re: Tata Nano Twist XT : Driven

One point i would like to add here from my side. Lots of people keep saying why Nano is not selling, be it because of cheap image, putter putter sound, quality etc. All those reasons are right. But one more reason is there which i found a major factor going against Nano. That reason is resale car market. Nano being cheap also costs at least 1.5 - 2.25 Lacs at least for OTR. In that price you can easily buy a well maintained Maruti Alto, Santro, Wagon R etc and also big cars like Esteem, Ascent, Ikon, etc. All these cars are bigger, well engineered products. These are more capable cars and has better image than Nano. So lots of people go for resale cars than going for new Nano.
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Old 15th January 2014, 15:28   #75
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Default Re: Tata Nano Twist XT : Driven

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Originally Posted by procrj View Post
TATA needs to work on its 'Reliability' and 'Trust' imaging if it wants to give the alto & eon a run for their money
Well, Tata had the trust at one time and has only itself to blame for the image issues it suffers from today.

Do you know that the Indica had 1.15 lakh fully paid bookings within a week of launch? We're talking fully paid, not some lousy 20 - 30k deposit.

The market gave Tata its trust. Tata delivered cars that broke it. Many ex-Tata owners (like me) cannot stop talking about the troubles we've suffered with our cars (my Indigo was the least reliable car I've ever owned, less so than a Padmini 137D).

Trivia: The Fiat Uno holds the record for most number of bookings upon launch (2.9 lakhs). However, in terms of absolute $$$ value, the Indica owns it (fully paid vs partial deposit).

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Originally Posted by aniketi View Post
Lots of people keep saying why Nano is not selling
My 2 paise:

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
So why did the Nano not rack up 20,000 – 30,000 sales a month as expected? The answer greatly varies depending on who you are listening to, but if you ask me, there are 5 fundamental reasons:

1. Poor targeting: Let's face it, a large number of 2 wheeler owners – out of choice – don’t want to upgrade to a car. Petrol is too expensive (commuter bikes are 5 - 6 times as fuel efficient as a Nano) while a large % of motorcycle owners don’t even know how to drive. That probably explains why a majority of bookings (from the 1st round) were for the top-end LX variant.

2. It’s simply too unconventional: The Indian market, especially first-timer buyers, are a conservative lot. In that, they are extremely risk averse. The Nano is too “different” and “unconventional” for the mass market tastes. Factors like the engine placed at the back, a hatch that doesn’t open, battery under the front seat, 3-bolt wheels, differently sized front & rear tyres, lack of a glovebox et al make the Nano too different a concept for the junta. Many, including some owners, refer to the car as a toy.

3. The image of the “cheapest car” in the world: The media & Tata overplayed the “1 lakh car” bit. Let's reflect on when the Maruti 800 was launched; it was hardly pitched as a cheap car. Instead, Maruti chose to focus on the strengths of the product, which were only amplified by word-of-mouth recommendations based on owner experiences. Car ownership in India is greatly driven by aspirational value, and owning the “cheapest car in India / the world” is not something one aspires to. Simply put, the Nano lacks the all-too-crucial status that first time car owners are looking for.

4. The Nano isn’t really a 1 lakh car: The on-road pricing varies between 1.5 lakhs for the base version, and goes to well over 2 lakhs for the LX variant. Many two-wheeler owners weren't even eligible for car financing in the first place. For those that are, in our EMI-driven times, the 800, Alto & Spark aren't too far away.

5. Poor communications: Tata’s handling of the media around the Nano fire incidents left a lot to be desired. 5 out of 10 people who sat in my test Nano mentioned something or the other about the car catching fire.
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