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View Poll Results: Which Version would you prefer
Manual 87 36.10%
Paddle Shifting 98 40.66%
I wont buy the Civic 56 23.24%
Voters: 241. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 18th July 2006, 00:08   #211
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Quote:
Originally Posted by devarshi84
A skoda RS cannot be smoked by a Corolla. Its not just the turbo that skoda Boasts.
Quote:
Originally Posted by shan2nu
U still think it was the wheels don't you? Cmon man, 150bhp Turbo Charged RS vs 125bhp Corolla, in a straight line???? No brainer!!!
So u guys still dont believe that a corrolla could/can take on a RS ?? Well its been proven on a strip already , so im not being imaginative and the corolla was stock .. The same corolla took down 2 RS's i guess ..

Well lets talk in shantanu's own lingo .. That being PTWR .. Corrolla 125PS at 1160 kgs = 107.7bhp/tonne ..

RS at 147.5 bhp with a weight of 1350 kgs has a PTWR of 109.2bhp/tonne plus turbo lag exactly as busa put it .. Also , doesnt aerodynamics play any important role ??

With upsized wheels the corrolla puts down the power better than the RS would .. Yes i do agree to nudge the RS it would certainly need some good driver talent as pointed out by devarshi, but the guy driving the RS was no slouch either .. Im not saying all corrollas with a tyre swap could whip the RS (driver talent matters more) .. All im saying is when it could give a real good fight to the so called "true performance" car in under 15L category then comments such as those put forth by st7677 and sandeep arent quite ON THE DOT and misleading .. Also anyone who says a corrolla doesnt like being pushed over 4500 revvs must be out of their mind or must be driving a lemon .. Im saying this after redlining a corolla in the 1st 3 gears ..

Dont want to start a debate here and go seriously OT , but my only point was corrolla is neither underpowered or a slouch that doesnt like being revved over 4.5 revvs as it has been made out to be ..

And just because civic is according to u (or ACI for that matter) better on some fronts and deserves 9/10 doesnt mean the corrolla doesnt deserve a 8/10 .. And we blame only our cricketers for match fixing .. I can see it happening right here ..

PS : No offense to anyone .. Just my views ..

Last edited by mclaren1885 : 18th July 2006 at 00:22.
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Old 18th July 2006, 00:22   #212
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Quote:
Im not saying all corrollas with a tyre swap could whip the RS (driver talent matters more)
Thats what i said. Maybe it beat the RS but not just bcoz it got the right upsize. The driver counts as well. But given the same driver, the RS would win each and everytime.

The RS does have turbo lag but does that show in it's acc? Nope, its still bloody quick.

Remember the track test OD had? The RS nuked the Corolla and even the 2.4 Accord. And track racing is where you'd prob feel turbo lag the most (since you need to keep it at high revvs all the time, one mistake and you're off boost).

The RS has managed to get the best balance between power and handling.

Shan2nu
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Old 18th July 2006, 00:26   #213
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Originally Posted by Shan2nu
Thats what i said. Maybe it beat the RS but not just bcoz it got the right upsize. The driver counts as well. But given the same driver, the RS would win each and everytime.

The RS does have turbo lag but does that show in it's acc? Nope, its still bloody quick.

Remember the track test OD had? The RS nuked the Corolla and even the 2.4 Accord. And track racing is where you'd prob feel turbo lag the most (since you need to keep it at high revvs all the time, one mistake and you're off boost).

The RS has managed to get the best balance between power and handling.

Shan2nu
Completely agree with u but atleast toyota aint marketting corolla as a true performance car are they ?? If it can keep up with the likes of the RS and be within 0.5sec or less of an RS itself speak volumes to its engines capabilites .. My whole point was about calling the corolla a slouch which certainly is not the case either on paper or on tarmac as it was made out to be in a few posts prior to this ..

Also its quite easy to negate a difference of 1.5bhp/tonne with a good driver and still u could have a corolla winning hands down against an RS .. It certainly is not impossible .. Also the corolla has an advantage in terms of aerodynamics also im guessing ??

Last edited by mclaren1885 : 18th July 2006 at 00:32.
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Old 18th July 2006, 00:29   #214
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Remember in that track day the fastest car in straights was the Accord and there was lag in the Octy. The Corolla if not a good engine then how did it manage to whip a Accord on the track. So its simple, Accord engine better then Civic and Corollas better then Accord so Corollas engine is better then Civic. Infact there is so much capablity in the Corolla engine that the inside tyres wheelspin and there is torque steer.

Rememeber i am only talking about engine as a overall package its difficult to bear the Civic till the new Corolla comes.

Quote:
The RS has managed to get the best balance between power and handling.
Shaan you said it. The RS was better on the track simply because of its handling and not its engine. On the engine front the Toyota kept up (almost) and hence in a drag (read: no corners) The Corolla was able to take the RS, but when its comes to corners the RS is in a league of its own. Corolla has the engine not the handling, etc. The RS has it.

Last edited by BUSA : 18th July 2006 at 00:35.
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Old 18th July 2006, 00:38   #215
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The Corolla if not a good engine then how did it manage to whip a Accord on the track.
Have you driven an Accord around corners? That car wasn't meant for that kind of stuff. It maybe fast in a straight line but, it loses out heavily in the corners.

So it's not the engine thats letting it down but the weight/suspension setup.

Whereas the Corolla is neither as quick as the RS, nor handles as well.

Anyway, we seem to have left the Civic out of the discussion, so lets get back on track.

The Civic was never going to be quicker than the RS, but the Civic vs Corolla fight would be interesting to see. And yeah, lets wait for the new Corolla.

Shan2nu

Last edited by Shan2nu : 18th July 2006 at 00:43.
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Old 18th July 2006, 00:47   #216
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He he he

Wait till you watch Civic smoke a Corolla and with better FE too...
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Old 18th July 2006, 00:52   #217
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shan2nu
Have you driven an Accord around corners? That car wasn't meant for that kind of stuff.
Shan2nu
By corners if u meant on a track than sadly i must say not many cars in our country can handle tracks at all .. Barring maybe the lancers and the esteems .. Anyways back to topic of discussion on the civic now ..

Not at all surprised that yet again we have a car with no-low end torque from honda .. But get that needle above 5k and its pure bliss .. Shan lets not argue on this front its a very well known fact to everyone about this Honda trait .. Dud until the VTEC kicks in and a scorching rocket thereafter ..
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Old 18th July 2006, 01:02   #218
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ST7677
He he he

Wait till you watch Civic smoke a Corolla and with better FE too...
No one is denying the fact that the civic COULD or WOULD smoke a corolla .. The only point we were trying to prove is that corolla is not a slouch either .. Thats it .. However this would be one battle that would keep me waiting for with my eyes wide open .. Should be very interesting to see the RS's , civics and the corolla's take on each other in the 1.6-2L category pro stock classes ..

Just keep in mind that GEARING also plays a major role in 0-100 timings and quarter miles .. The corolla can do over a 100 in 2nd gear , anyone knows where the cut off for the civic is wrt to speedo ??

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Old 18th July 2006, 01:33   #219
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anyone knows where the cut off for the civic is wrt to speedo ??
The Civic does it in 2nd too but the Corolla has torque much lower down. All depends on how the car is launched, a perfect launch can see anything happen anytime. The similarties in these cars is so much that its hard to guess. Anywayz the point is not which is faster but as Mclaren said that Corolla is no slouch.

Also 5 bhp difference doesnot matter much it depends on gearing, torque, weight, tyres, etc. Look at a Baleno(94bhp) and a Accent(100bhp), the former has tall gearing and no prizes for guessing which is the faster of the two though it has less power.
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Old 18th July 2006, 02:33   #220
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hey Shan2nu and Mclaren you are debating to prove the same point.

ST7677, agree that your Honda Civic is a great car but saying that corolla is not a performance machine would be wrong.

Corolla loses 7-8 horses to the civic but is lightweght and aerodynamic at the same time. Hence A corolla is equivalent to the civic including the engine.

SKODA RS may have been beaten once. But to say that RS as an overall package including the engine or any of its characters is inferior to the civic or corolla is just too much. Turbo Lag is felt in the powerband as in at the speed it is going. But RS will still be faster than corolla or civic without the Turbo because turbo is not everything about the RS. :PLEASE
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Old 18th July 2006, 03:46   #221
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ST7677
I was looking at Modulo (?) body kit available through Honda, looks quiet goon, but it sounded very expensive...

Front Under Spoiler - 14559
Rear Under Spoiler - 14559
Side Under Spoiler - 16989
Boot Spoiler - 15773

Total = 62000 approx... (which I think should be half outside)
Pretty much spot on! Aftermarket Kit (Import, Made from ABS) including front spoiler, rear spoiler, side skirts and boot spoiler would be around Rs.36,000 and aftermarket Fog Lights are coming in around Rs.9,000. As compared to Rs.62,000 and Rs.18,000 respectively from Honda.

Arush
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Old 18th July 2006, 10:47   #222
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Pretty much spot on! Aftermarket Kit (Import, Made from ABS) including front spoiler, rear spoiler, side skirts and boot spoiler would be around Rs.36,000 and aftermarket Fog Lights are coming in around Rs.9,000. As compared to Rs.62,000 and Rs.18,000 respectively from Honda.
Thanks for that Autopsyche,
I am assuming that it includes painting cost also. Can folks please guide me where to get a good body kit in Bangalore?

Devarishi,
I never said Corolla is not a performance machine!!!
Here all three in discussion are and we are talking only relatively...
I have driven all three of them and performance wise, it would be...
Octavia 1.8T
Civic
Corolla

I am talking stock, and since they are all very close there will always be exceptions in the drag, based on individual tuning of the vehicle
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Old 18th July 2006, 10:56   #223
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I am not saying corolla is a slouch, just that it hates being pushed, while the hondas love it. When the corolla's engine sounds thrashy above 4,500 rpm, honda actually gets a kick in the butt and wants to go to 8k. I also forgot to add that the front left suspension in the corolla I drove was shot, it kept bottoming / dropping out on corners with bumps giving out a loud thunk or if I took a speed breaker a bit too quickly. Dealer said to drive more slowly!! I have hit speed breaker at 60km/h on my OHC and in all these years never had a suspension problem.

As far as low end torque business goes:
Corolla - 16.1 kg-m/4,200 rpm
Civic - 17.5 kg-m/4300 rpm
And all that about low end torque being invaluable and all that which hondas cannot deliver is total hogwash: My OHC pulls very cleanly without any knocking whatsoever in 5th from 35km/h, whatever the torque figures, they are quite adequate, let me tell you. The swift does not like 5th below 45km/h.

I do believe that till now and maybe still also, corolla maybe overall nice car to be driven in, but still not to drive. I have always felt honda to deliver more than the paper figures while other cars always seem to deliver less - which was ST7677 was trying to point out.


Basically power to weight ratio about same in corolla/civic so none are going to be slouchy. It is simply that the civic will on an average always smoke the corolla because there is no hesitation in keeping pedal to the metal. Both seem to be very good cars to me, minor niggles can be sorted out. Maybe not worth the price but then that is because of taxes, etc. and another story. In fact I myself posted that this is best time to buy corolla, since average car buyer looking more for VFM.
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Old 18th July 2006, 11:06   #224
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Hey but one thing I am sure of is that the Civic AT (with it's tiptronic) will definately beat Corolla A/T and Octavta 1.8 A/T

I hope, for a change, there will be no disagreement on this
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Old 18th July 2006, 11:15   #225
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Civic looks like a better package than the current Corolla, but the new Corolla might be a completely different story...btw, why are we comparing all these cars again? I thought this was a review of the Civic.
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