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View Poll Results: Which Version would you prefer
Manual 87 36.10%
Paddle Shifting 98 40.66%
I wont buy the Civic 56 23.24%
Voters: 241. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 19th August 2006, 00:46   #316
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BUSA
I agree to that but at 139kms?? Having driven 30,000kms done Optra, 65,000kms Octavia, 10,000kms Elantra Test drive cars, all were excellent in their built quality. Thought the 12,000kms done Corolla was not in such a good shape. The fact of the matter is that Civic has been highly localised hence the extremely delayed launch and thats why its cheaper then a Corolla/Optra but the down side is that materials arenot that good and the build quality is quite poor, sit in one and i am sure you will feel the same.
As if Toyota and Optra aren't localized? Moreover "localized" should not be correlated to bad build quality. If Corolla and Optra are priced higher, it's due to their nearly monopolistic existence until this launch. Go to dealers now, and checkout the discount they give !! The "cheaper than Corolla/Optra" tag is all but misleading.

And yeah.. India launch of the Civic has taken place 7 months after its global debut, so its not that bad, neither "extremely" delayed !! No?

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Old 19th August 2006, 15:41   #317
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I would still rely on more opinions and further test drives by others
Hey Would love to see your report, why dont you go and test drive and post the findings. Each one is entitled to ones own opinion, No offense be taken by my wordings please. What i felt i wrote, your thoughts might differ from mine.
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Old 19th August 2006, 21:51   #318
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Hey,
Had a test drive of Civic MT today at Prime Honda.
What a car ! I definitely am game for this !
The car is silent, very refined, handles really well, got effective braking, and decent acceleration.
Although lower on power as compared to the international edition, the car is frugal and very well poised vis-a-vis dated competition. Civic is definitely a generation ahead in terms of technology and instrumentation. One would definitely get floored by the very futuristic console.
It has got reverse windshield wipers that actually cleans up more visible area than the conventional wipers (though some part remains uncovered at the rearview mirror space).
On the negatives, I'd expect 16'' alloys and foglamps to be part of the package.For a better ride, broader set of tyres would suit.
The other drawback was the lack of boot space, even lesser than the NHC.

Last edited by scorp 1 : 19th August 2006 at 21:58.
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Old 19th August 2006, 22:06   #319
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All aspects that you've mentioned (including bumpy ride, and falling off exhausts) may be due to bad road conditions or more.
I drove a "cheap Korean" Daewoo Matiz for about 50,000kms on the same bad roads but the exhaust never fell off and the car never had a single rattle or squeak. I drove the Fiat Palio for 30,000kms and counting on the same bad roads but again never had any rattles, squeaks or parts falling off. I really wonder why bad roads affected the Civic and not these other cars. And that too after just 139kms! Instead of finding excuses and justifications for a poorly made Honda, why not just call a lemon a lemon. So what if it's made by Honda. As difficult as it seems to digest for Indians, the fact is even Honda makes lemons.
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Old 19th August 2006, 22:33   #320
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I drove a "cheap Korean" Daewoo Matiz for about 50,000kms on the same bad roads but the exhaust never fell off and the car never had a single rattle or squeak. I drove the Fiat Palio for 30,000kms and counting on the same bad roads but again never had any rattles, squeaks or parts falling off. I really wonder why bad roads affected the Civic and not these other cars. And that too after just 139kms! Instead of finding excuses and justifications for a poorly made Honda, why not just call a lemon a lemon. So what if it's made by Honda. As difficult as it seems to digest for Indians, the fact is even Honda makes lemons.
You're just looking at one car here. Many others (including me) have driven Civics around the country and nothing of this sort happened.

Maybe you were just unfortunate to get the bad one.

No car in India (prob anywhere) has ever had 0 problems per hundred cars. U talk about your Matiz doing 50K without probs. My uncle's Matiz has most of it's parts replaced and it's not even done 50K yet.

My Vtec has done 60.5 K kms and there are no rattles or squeaks. But i've seen some Vtecs, where the suspension had to be replaced at 30K.

When a company makes so many cars, a few are bound to be defective.

Calling a car good, doesn't mean it's fail proof. It just means that it's got more positives than negatives.

Shan2nu
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Old 19th August 2006, 23:59   #321
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Calling a car good, doesn't mean it's fail proof. It just means that it's got more positives than negatives.
I totally agree with everything that you said Shan. But my response was not about Honda or the Civic in particular but about some of the excuses that we have read and still get to read on this thread regarding the exhaust issue. My opinion on this particular Civic's exhaust issue is on page 5 of this same thread and I did'nt then and I don't now, expect Civic's in general to have this problem of parts falling off. Come on, this is Honda we are talking about not Citroen or Alfa Romeo!

This particular Civic is a badly made car. People have to accept that instead of calling Busa biased and blaming bad roads for the issue. Thank God Busa posted pictures as proof or I am sure he would have been banned from this site! And yes, Honda is extremely lucky that this car ended up as a test drive vehicle and wasn't sold to a customer.

Last edited by amit : 20th August 2006 at 00:08.
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Old 20th August 2006, 00:39   #322
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amit
I drove a "cheap Korean" Daewoo Matiz for about 50,000kms on the same bad roads but the exhaust never fell off and the car never had a single rattle or squeak. I drove the Fiat Palio for 30,000kms and counting on the same bad roads but again never had any rattles, squeaks or parts falling off. I really wonder why bad roads affected the Civic and not these other cars. And that too after just 139kms! Instead of finding excuses and justifications for a poorly made Honda, why not just call a lemon a lemon. So what if it's made by Honda. As difficult as it seems to digest for Indians, the fact is even Honda makes lemons.
Please remember, that was a demo car. Not a single-owner driven. And for that matter, theres no owner per-se. You know what I mean. And hence theres no comparo. Period.
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Old 20th August 2006, 20:59   #323
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Please remember, that was a demo car. Not a single-owner driven. And for that matter, theres no owner per-se. You know what I mean. And hence theres no comparo. Period.
Ridiculous! Honda would be laughing away at this attitude. This is the first time in the history of the automobile that a company goofed up, made a genuine lemon and actually has people defending the car and the company!

How many different people do you think drove the car for 139kms!?! Ok buddy, you think falling off exhausts are justified in a demo car, here is something to think about:

1. When I was buying the Matiz, I test drove a demo car that had done over 300 kms and nothing fell off from the vehicle.

2. When I went to buy the Palio, I drove a GTX demo that had done over 200 kms and nothing fell off.

3. A few months later I test drove a Palio D just for the heck of it and that car had over 1200 kms and still nothing fell off.

4. My friends have driven demo Octavia's (owned by dealership owner) done over 40-50,000 kms and the car did'nt have a rattle or squeak to show.

5. I have driven a demo dealership owner owned Toyota Qualis that had over 70,000kms on the odo and nothing fell off from the car.

6. I test drove a demo Accent done over 200kms and nothing fell off.

7. I test drove a demo Ikon done approx 1500kms and nothing fell off.

The cars above were all demo cars driven by various drivers. Being a demo car doesn't mean it's justified to have parts falling off. If anything, such cars will scare off customers from buying it all together.

No-one here expects the Civic to have poor quality or parts falling off. But this particular demo car was a lemon. As difficult as it sounds to you, even Honda makes lemons. Accept it. And lets move on from this exhaust issue!

Last edited by amit : 20th August 2006 at 21:01.
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Old 20th August 2006, 21:26   #324
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Fiat launched the palio twins 1.2/1.6 in India But they didnt even test the car properly. Fitted a wrong tyre-size and didnt even remember to set the odo accordingly. It was not a test vehicle, but they actually sold quite a lot of em before realizing the mistake. People bit them back with fuel-efficiency problems and the huge sales dissolved faster than an iceberg.

Auto manufacturers mistakes dont affect them as long as its not in a sale car.
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Old 20th August 2006, 21:29   #325
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Please remember, that was a demo car. Not a single-owner driven. And for that matter, theres no owner per-se. You know what I mean. And hence theres no comparo. Period.
Not a good enuf reason, unless the test car took part in a recent INRC event. LOL

The fact remains that the exhaust did fall. While this maynot concern all Civics, it would be interesting to see why it happened. Yes, if i was the owner of that particular Civic, i'd have been furious.

Like i've said, not evey car made......will be perfect. Some bad ones are bound to show up.

Only time will tell how the other Civics will fare on Indian soil. The next JD Power survey should be a good indication. Look out for the PP100C section.

Shan2nu

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Old 21st August 2006, 01:22   #326
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I have test driven the following cars : -

1) Skoda Octavia 1.9TDi Ambiente 74,000kms - Absolutely rock solid.
2) Chevrolet Optra 1.8LT - 27,000kms -Almost as good as new.
3) Toyota Corolla 1.8H2 - 18,000kms - Body Vibrating a bit but not that bad.
4) Hyundai Elantra 2.0CRDi - 7,000kms & 1.8GLS - 3700kms - Strong performance.
5) Old Honda City Vtec 1.5 - 52,000kms - Probably the best of the lot.
6) NHC 1.5 CVT - 12,000kms - Tyres locked a bit but otherwise quite good.
7) Honda Civic - 200kms - Great Interiors, Good Noise at High Revs but some how i wasnot convinced by the ride, Handling good but not great.

Note that all these cars are test drive cars and they are subject to more wear and tear possibly because they are driven on the limit.

Based on the above experience and reading BUSA review, it is quite shocking that a manufaturer of Hondas level has compromised on quality, probably it has something to do with the indian mentalilty but there is no denying the fact that quality that Honda provided in the Old City Vtec is not the same anymore with the Civic and i agree with Amit that maybe this time Honda indeed has produced a lemon We are all mature individuals and we should not blindly support the manufacturers for their name as everybody makes mistakes and Honda is no exception.

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Old 21st August 2006, 10:35   #327
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Nobody is blindly supporting mfr. even Honda. even 1km over a bad speed breaker may have been the reason for the muffler falling off. Any sort of thing could have happened to cause it, either goof up by Honda or during transit or initial drives by dealer/customers. Sometimes problems do occur in some cars. While Busa may not buy the civic due to his bad experience, others have reported good experiences overall.

Low speed ride quality is a bit harsh, but just go beyond 60km/h and see how everything feels solid, unlike corolla.

In many things, in today's world we simply are not going to get quality like some older cars and stuff (even I owned OHC). We simply have to compare against what is available at comparable prices and make decision based on each one's requirement.
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Old 21st August 2006, 11:40   #328
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I have seen multiple times that there are brand new cars with broken parts in transit from the company to the dealers. these cars are usually in the stock area near to the paint section or so I have found at various dealers.

sometimes its just a broken signal light to, Scratched bumper to headlight to windscreen.

They just fix the stuff and sell it.
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Old 21st August 2006, 12:03   #329
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Note from Mod

Can we stop talking about demo cars and talk about Civics MT/AT
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Old 23rd August 2006, 09:22   #330
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Saw a driving school Civic today. Amazingly, it was the higher spec one kitted out with alloys and sunroof. Lucky newbie drivers!
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