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Old 22nd October 2014, 11:03   #61
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Default Re: Fiat Avventura : Test Drive & Review

Thanks for the wonderful detailed review.

I don't understand the recent fancy of manufacturers to come up with cross versions of their hatchbacks...put some extra cladding, increase the GC and some other styling changes (spare wheel on the hatch, roof rails etc) and here you have a 'Cross' version. The Polo Cross and the Etios cross have been a failure.

The Ecosport is a success no doubt but it is not a "cross' version. It looks totally different from any hatchback and the overall stance gives it a macho "SUV" look though in reality it might not be a true SUV.

I feel this segment has a market but so far, none of the cross versions have been able to exploit it and same goes with the Aventura. First of all, people won't be interested to buy something that looks like a hatch. So, the manufacturers need to go to drawing board and come up with a fresh design..they can use the hatch platform no issues but they need to come up with a design which gives the macho SUV look and which people in our country are crazy for. First thing they are going to ask - does this look like a SUV? If the answer is NO, the battle is lost even before the start. I'm afraid but I foresee the same fate of the Aventura as the other "cross' versions like Etios and Polo. And is the price difference over the Evo justified?

And rather than launching the "cross" version, Fiat could have improved the Evo a lot by providing better interior fit and finish, correcting the wrong ergonomics, improving the rear legroom and headroom and most important of all, tuning the engine and gearbox better to improve performance.

I hope the trend of the cross versions end soon and for good.

Last edited by adimicra : 22nd October 2014 at 11:07.
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Old 22nd October 2014, 11:07   #62
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Default Re: Fiat Avventura : Test Drive & Review

Quite an amazing advertisement, may be one of the best by FIAT. I just hope it motivates enough people to set sales chart on the move (Fire would not be a right word for FIAT)
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Originally Posted by myavu View Post
New Avventura TVC. Bang on!



Cheers!

Vinu
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Old 22nd October 2014, 11:08   #63
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Default Re: Fiat Avventura : Test Drive & Review

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Originally Posted by Astleviz View Post
So if you lose/ misplace that key, there is no way to unscrew the spare wheel without getting a new key ordered from Fiat?
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Originally Posted by Reinhard View Post
An extremely simple yet probably most important point about the car!!
I must admit I missed that Astleviz. Thanks for bringing it up. A simple yet brilliant question which never occurred to me at that moment.

Our local dealer has got his first load of vehicles. Let me try and get the answer to that question.

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Great review.
I can never wrap my mind around such stilted hatchbacks. It is better to get a proper crossover or an SUV over such half baked hatch/cross.
As of now, we do not have any proper SUVs below the Duster AWD/ Scorpio 4*4 do we? I wish the Gimny was available from Suzuki with a hard top and a/c.
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Old 22nd October 2014, 11:29   #64
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Default Re: Fiat Avventura : Test Drive & Review

That rear mounted spare wheel will be a real annoyance for anyone who does long drives often.

I was just back from a long drive to Rameswaram, and I just don't remember how many times I had to access the boot. Couldn't imagine doing the whole ordeal every time to access the boot in Avventura.

I think whoever designed this engineering should be made to own the Avventura as a punishment.

Also, I do not like the new interior design in the new Punto and Avventura, it looks silly and doesn't look aesthetically appealing to me. Roof rails, again, looks silly on a hatchback or a cross.

The ambient lighting though looks good.

Overall, Punto is one extra-ordinary car to drive on the highways, the Avventura carrying the same genes, and possibly with a better state of engine tune, should be a highway champ as well.

Fiat, wants to be on the limelight, so has done some masala stuff on the Punto to make it Avventura, but just like Masala movies, logic seems to be missing at a lot of places.

Will it be a hit or a miss?

As they say in film industry, "only audience will have to tell".
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Old 22nd October 2014, 11:30   #65
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Originally Posted by Astleviz View Post
"Fiat officials claim that the key to unscrew the spare is unique to each car and hence, it won't get stolen."
So if you lose/ misplace that key, there is no way to unscrew the spare wheel without getting a new key ordered from Fiat?
It is very similar to losing key and then you cannot crank the engine. By the way spare key can always be used.
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Old 22nd October 2014, 11:32   #66
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Crossovers were like SUVs but based on monocoque car chassis. They either provided extra traction for snowy roads or that extra room for passengers. But this is an lazy attempt thats waste of car maker's time.

In our country, where the market for mainstream cars itself is not small, how can these people expect anything for these things?
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Old 22nd October 2014, 11:36   #67
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Default Re: Fiat Avventura : Test Drive & Review

Quote:
Originally Posted by Astleviz View Post
"Fiat officials claim that the key to unscrew the spare is unique to each car and hence, it won't get stolen."
So if you lose/ misplace that key, there is no way to unscrew the spare wheel without getting a new key ordered from Fiat?
Exactly. If you go on a long trip through bad roads, and happen to lose your key, then God save you. I presume this will be the most ordered accessory right up front by most owners

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The Avventura is part of the action plan announced by Fiat a little time back.
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Originally Posted by KarthikK View Post
Excellent review CrazyDriver! Very comprehensive report and review on the car and very detailed pictures to boot.

I own the first gen (2011) Linea T-Jet+ and the second gen (2012+) Punto with increased ground clearance. I have to say, the body roll on the Avventura is quite controlled for a car of this GC, not drastically different from my 2012 Punto. The ride quality too is typically fiat-ish and is very plush and controlled. There is minimal harshness for the passengers even on the worst of roads. The suspension smothers all the major and minor bumps with ease. I was expecting a bit of bounciness at higher speeds but that doesn't seem to be the case. It feels more or less like the 2012 suspension setup of Puntos. The 2011 versions are in a different (better) league though, but that's not a fair comparison.
Help me understand this better. How is this any how a value proposition for an aam aadmi, leaving a fiat aficionado aside.

Considering that the Evo 93 PS costs 7.2L exshowroom delhi , I'm just wondering what additional value the avventura provides:
- More ground clearance? You can get some of that by the 12k swap people have posted about.
- Better remap? is it really that big a deal?
- 16" wheels
- Tail-gate mounted wheel awesomeness?
- Skid plate? That's like 5k at a local shop, or maybe three times as much if someone wants to buy the OEM version right.

For 97k more? What did I miss?

This isn't a compelling enough value proposition to set the sales charts on fire - of course, that Ecosport costs much more isn't going to set Fiat's cash registers ringing IMHO.

/genuinely curious here.
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Old 22nd October 2014, 11:42   #68
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Default Re: Fiat Avventura : Test Drive & Review

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Originally Posted by phamilyman View Post
- More ground clearance? You can get some of that by the 12k swap people have posted about.
Hi,

I believe that swap is to bring pre-2012 model Punto GC at par with the Post 2012/ Evo.

I dont believe there is an upgrade to increase the GC of the Evo further, which is already at 180 mm.

I agree to rest of your points, but Fiat seems to have got atleast the initial euphoria in their side. Reports of 500 bookings already in two days. May not be too big a number, but that is close to what Punto does in a month!!

But the only Value proportion in my mind would be if it gets a Tjet heart. Other than that, as you rightly said, I dont see too much over my Punto to be spending close to a Lakh more.

Last edited by vibbs : 22nd October 2014 at 11:44.
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Old 22nd October 2014, 11:45   #69
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Default Re: Fiat Avventura : Test Drive & Review

Another crazy concept from Fiat, a hatchback with higher ground clearance. We Indians prefer sedans or SUVs and are not fond of estate cars and high ground clearance cars. SUVs need some body height, so I guess a Santro or Wagon R based SUV would sell better.

BTW I can imagine Duster/Terrano owners fitting this jugaadu spare tyre to their SUVs to BOOST the SUV look ??

Last edited by rxpaul : 22nd October 2014 at 11:47.
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Old 22nd October 2014, 11:46   #70
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i> Its a FIAT, FIAT needs to get the basics right to succeed in India. First solve their service woes and then go for the product launch. This very same car(sans that inconvenient spare wheel) launched by a Maruti or a Hyundai would have been a potential chartbuster.
Tell us something new. Everytime Fiat launches something isnt this the argument put forth by people who at the time are already writing obituaries? While I agree the service isn't world class or at the level of Maruti, I havent heard any of my friends having major problems with service and I have 5 of my close one's who own a Punto.

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ii> its basically a Punto. If the Punto doesnt sell much how can the more expensive crossover sell. Ask an average Joe if he really cares about that wheel at the back for the butch look over the inconvenience it brings in. Already people in our forum itself are considering how to get that wheel(the supposedly USP of the vehicle) removed.
The product has enough differentiation along with a brand new name to side itself from Punto Evo. It is atleast a much better offering than the Cross Polo or the Etios Cross. I am sure Fiat is not looking for blockbuster sales with this one but if this can bring people into their showrooms and get to test drive their other cars, which is a better proposition than an outright rejection because it is a Fiat, it would have done its job.

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iii> Fiat needs to get a decent small car or a good sedan to gain market share and then launch these 'experimental' products.
Punto was more than a decent small car and Linea was a more than good enough sedan and they did not sell so I do not know how bringing in brand new products which will require significant capital investment is a good idea especially with the kind of volumes they are doing? And it is not even that they would get away by just launching, I am pretty sure people will still say "Oh its a Fiat and hence the service is bad".
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Old 22nd October 2014, 11:47   #71
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Default Re: Fiat Avventura : Test Drive & Review

Thanks CrazyDriver for a super review. Rated well deserved 5 stars.

I have seen Avventura in person & there is no doubt its a good looking little crossover having excellent road presence.

Many of us feel tail mounted spare wheel is impractical but IMO this is one of the major reason Avventura is getting such an attention in media & hopefully will get noticed on our roads as well. (I guess this is the reason that huge spare wheel cover is standard on all variants) and will help Fiat get noticed & help build some brand in Indian market, which today is not even in consideration list of 90% of the customers.
IMO this anyways is a stop gap arrangement before Fiat comes up with an all new small SUV in 2016.

Agree with your view that Fiat should have launched Avventura first & then Evo or may be Punto should have continued as is with refreshed interiors only.

Will I buy this? Yes, if I was in market today, I would have gone ahead with this for its ground clearance (necessary for our road conditions), smart & rugged looking cladding all around, excellent ride & handling & VFM pricing & cost of ownership.
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Old 22nd October 2014, 12:01   #72
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Originally Posted by phamilyman View Post
Help me understand this better. How is this any how a value proposition for an aam aadmi, leaving a fiat aficionado aside.

Considering that the Evo 93 PS costs 7.2L exshowroom delhi , I'm just wondering what additional value the avventura provides:
- More ground clearance? You can get some of that by the 12k swap people have posted about.
- Better remap? is it really that big a deal?
- 16" wheels
- Tail-gate mounted wheel awesomeness?
- Skid plate? That's like 5k at a local shop, or maybe three times as much if someone wants to buy the OEM version right.

For 97k more? What did I miss?

This isn't a compelling enough value proposition to set the sales charts on fire - of course, that Ecosport costs much more isn't going to set Fiat's cash registers ringing IMHO.

/genuinely curious here.
I agree that looking at the value proposition over the Punto Evo, it does not look like a good deal but the whole small SUV segment isn't about creating a value proposition, it is about making the product "desirable" so to speak.
A friend of mine just bought a Ford EcpoSport and when I asked him why does he not buy the brand new Hyundai i20 Elite (or the new Fiesta which has the same chassis, interiors but rides and handles infinitely better) which has enough Chutzpah if not more, is good looking and costs a couple of lakhs less than the EcoSport his answer was simple. It is not an SUV even though I argued that the only SUV's thing about EcoSport is the ground clearance.

The point is that people simply do not care about what credentials a car carries as long as it is desirable or for that matter any other product (iPhone?). There are number of examples that I can quote like the Duster which is cheaper than Polo in the UK market but sells at a much more premium in the Indian market.

Last edited by extreme_torque : 22nd October 2014 at 12:02.
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Old 22nd October 2014, 12:25   #73
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Default Re: Fiat Avventura : Test Drive & Review

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Originally Posted by phamilyman View Post
Help me understand this better. How is this any how a value proposition for an aam aadmi, leaving a fiat aficionado aside.

Considering that the Evo 93 PS costs 7.2L exshowroom delhi , I'm just wondering what additional value the avventura provides:
- More ground clearance? You can get some of that by the 12k swap people have posted about.
- Better remap? is it really that big a deal?
- 16" wheels
- Tail-gate mounted wheel awesomeness?
- Skid plate? That's like 5k at a local shop, or maybe three times as much if someone wants to buy the OEM version right.

For 97k more? What did I miss?

This isn't a compelling enough value proposition to set the sales charts on fire - of course, that Ecosport costs much more isn't going to set Fiat's cash registers ringing IMHO.
I believe Ecosport is selling due to its looks and its ground clearance. And ironically there is no SUV trait in it. Duster has managed to bring the AWD finally. Had it not then the same ground clearance is the only difference i see when compared to a sedan. And yet people buy em. And it is a growing segment.
And the 12k swap information is misunderstood. Get the facts right

Remap. Yes. It is. After driving a 2011 Punto for four years i feel it is highly required.
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Old 22nd October 2014, 12:31   #74
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What I like the most about the Avventura is that they aren't really attempting to showcase it as an SUV. They are honestly calling it a "CUV". Contemporary URBAN Vehicle. It really is an Urban car. By no means will it be able to perform any activities doable with even with a small real Utility vehicle like the Duster. It looks excellent in the TVC, but I'll personally salute & bow to the owner if I ever see a bicycle mounted on the Avventura in real life.

Yes on paper it gets a good 205mm ground clearance. GC is current hot word so it sells. The EVO has a 180mm GC and that is pretty sufficient on our roads (or lack thereof). A 205mm GC can be boasted about for a car with at least a little off-roading ability. The Punto's long front overhang scrapes even when you try to join the highway back after a quick bite at a dhaba without paved approach road.

So like @extreme_torque has very correctly said, the vehicle's WOW factor is its USP. Not exactly its capabilities per say.

Last edited by Reinhard : 22nd October 2014 at 12:35.
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Old 22nd October 2014, 12:37   #75
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And the 12k swap information is misunderstood. Get the facts right
Please give me the correct facts - the above number was from some member post only. I'm not saying I know the exact number.

FYI - I find the ecosport an overpriced hatch on stilts and like ET said, most other B2 hatches like the elite i20 are so much more value for money or the Fiesta for that matter.

So yes, my skepticism is for the whole segment and not just because its a Fiat product. Coming to Fiat I have a senti corner for them and I'm just a wee bit disappointed by the tailgate setup. I think there should be ways to make it work without the 2 step process. This can't be that tough for Fiat's engineers!!
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