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Old 4th September 2007, 16:59   #46
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Hey, the idea of segments is rubbish. Does it bother anybody that they own A,B,C,D or A1,A2,A3,A4 segment cars? No !! What matters to them is that they own 6 lakh car, 8 lakh car, 14 lakh car. I won't go to the market to buy a A3 segment car or a C segment car. I go to market to buy a 8 lakh car.
While it is perfectly fine that you go to market to buy a car in a certain price bracket, please do not generalise and say everyone does that.

(I had a budget to buy the NHC VTec when I evaluated cars during my purchase. I bought a Baleno. And it wasn't ONLY due to the lower price.)

Now since you shop/categorise cars by price bracket, why not compare the NHCs 'whipping' capabilities with cars that belong to the 7.5+ L range ? Why are you comparing with <1500cc cars then ?
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Old 4th September 2007, 17:00   #47
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Can they? If they can, then they should, like they have done with 1.5L 77BHP iDSI engine. Why not?
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without compromising other things??

Last edited by diabloo : 4th September 2007 at 17:13.
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Old 4th September 2007, 17:13   #48
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Hey man, why do you relate BHP to price? If the BHP is to increase with price, then I can't imagine the BHP of Maybach
You bought Baleno to meet your requirements. People buy NHC for their requirements. Obviously your requirement & their requirement don't match. If they had matched then you would have had NHC

Reason for comparison: Somebody said NHC is underpowered. When other cars in its category can't come near it, then how can it be underpowered?

Do you buy the fastest car in your budget?
Quote:
Originally Posted by shuvc View Post
While it is perfectly fine that you go to market to buy a car in a certain price bracket, please do not generalise and say everyone does that.

(I had a budget to buy the NHC VTec when I evaluated cars during my purchase. I bought a Baleno. And it wasn't ONLY due to the lower price.)

Now since you shop/categorise cars by price bracket, why not compare the NHCs 'whipping' capabilities with cars that belong to the 7.5+ L range ? Why are you comparing with <1500cc cars then ?
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Old 4th September 2007, 17:34   #49
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Originally Posted by diabloo View Post
You bought Baleno to meet your requirements. People buy NHC for their requirements. Obviously your requirement & their requirement don't match. If they had matched then you would have had NHC
Agree with you 100%.

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Originally Posted by diabloo View Post
Reason for comparison: Somebody said NHC is underpowered. When other cars in its category can't come near it, then how can it be underpowered?
IMO, the key word here is 'category'. When considering power, you categorise cars with engines of similar cubic capacity. Which is fine, 'coz as above, it is how you define your requirement.

However, please be open enough to accept that there may be others whose definition of category could be different. They look for a minimum amount of power for a given price.

You will find many in this forum find the Laura underpowered for its price. At the same time there are others who find it adequate.

Bottomline - I am not trying to say your argument of the NHC having enough power is wrong. I am just trying to put the perspective right.

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Do you buy the fastest car in your budget?
A quick car would be only one of the deciding factors. For me, it's got to be fun to drive.
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Old 4th September 2007, 17:38   #50
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Quote:
L series engine in for B series engine
Diabloo do you work for Honda?

And get your facts right, if the OHC came with B series engines it would have circled around the NHC all day long, not that it cant with the current engine which happens to be a D15 and not B
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Old 4th September 2007, 17:41   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by diabloo View Post
When other cars in its category can't come near it
Not very sure what you mean by the above statement.

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Do you buy the fastest car in your budget?
yes, I have and I will.
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Old 4th September 2007, 17:54   #52
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I too feel that Honda has underplayed on the power part when they are charging so high for the car. Along with the goodies they should have thrown in some additional power for the enthusiasts too ( maybe an additional variant apart from exi, gxi at the same price as gxi) after all people are paying good money not only for a rich looking interior and a smooth engine. But, some people like us would rate the performance a bit higher on their selection criteria.

Btw, I also think that many cars can beat the iDSI Honda namely, Esteem, Verna, Accent, Fiesta in petrol and Accent and Verna CRDI hands down in diesel. It just needs a good driver even if one odd cars that i mentioned could be less than 1.5L category

Now, maybe i should also add the Swift D to the list
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Old 4th September 2007, 17:57   #53
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NHC is quite decent car to drive. Only issue is that its quite difficult to make it go beyond 140.

Last edited by msdivy : 4th September 2007 at 17:59.
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Old 4th September 2007, 18:12   #54
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Corrected: L15A1 VTEC in for D15 VTEC LEV.
Nope, I don't work for Honda. In fact nobody in Honda knows that I am there :(
Thanks for pointing out.
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Originally Posted by BUSA View Post
Diabloo do you work for Honda?

And get your facts right, if the OHC came with B series engines it would have circled around the NHC all day long, not that it cant with the current engine which happens to be a D15 and not B
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Old 4th September 2007, 18:17   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mobike008 View Post
I too feel that Honda has underplayed on the power part when they are charging so high for the car. Along with the goodies they should have thrown in some additional power for the enthusiasts too ( maybe an additional variant apart from exi, gxi at the same price as gxi) after all people are paying good money not only for a rich looking interior and a smooth engine. But, some people like us would rate the performance a bit higher on their selection criteria.

Btw, I also think that many cars can beat the iDSI Honda namely, Esteem, Verna, Accent, Fiesta in petrol and Accent and Verna CRDI hands down in diesel. It just needs a good driver even if one odd cars that i mentioned could be less than 1.5L category

Now, maybe i should also add the Swift D to the list

You need to deplaoy a bad driver to drive the NHC if you want an esteem to beat it.

The problem that many so called enthusiats have with NHC is that NHC's torque is silent and for them "silent accelration" is not as thrilling as "noisy accelration".

Every time I take off from a red signal, I remeber that Kelivator ad - "Madam, what's the problem with the fridge? Does it not cool things?"
"No, it cools. Lekin...awaj hi nahi karta...."
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Old 4th September 2007, 18:26   #56
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Originally Posted by anandpadhye View Post
You need to deplaoy a bad driver to drive the NHC if you want an esteem to beat it.
The bhp figures of the two cars dont support this. But then claimed bhp is not the only factor. The Accent 1.6 DOHC claimed 103 Bhp but did not feel like that on road.
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Old 4th September 2007, 18:45   #57
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One fact is to be accepted. It is that Honda built a reputation with the Indian Customers during their entry into the market by building the Honda City which is worth all the money. Now the company has evolved like any other manufacturers in that segment.
  • Honda doesnt give any good discounts on their vehicles(including the Honda Motorcycles).
  • The Honda Quality has reduced drastically. (THe Brake issue which one of ur BHPian was facing with his NHC Vtec & the fuel pump problem that persists with the Honda Motorcycles. I have a Unicorn and Activa which suffer cold start. I spend 15mins using tactics to get the vehicle moving.)
  • OVERPRICING!
  • They have better tactics to retain their reputation in the market even after the issues with CRV and the Accord.
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Old 4th September 2007, 18:49   #58
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Originally Posted by anandpadhye View Post
The problem that many so called enthusiats have with NHC is that NHC's torque is silent and for them "silent accelration" is not as thrilling as "noisy accelration".
Interesting point you made there.....! One of my first impressions with my VTEC was that, 'Accent was better'.

However, over a period of time I realized that VTEC was doing a better job (incl. 0-100 timing) and what was missing was the coarse sound of the Accent engine.

The smooth engine and gear box of NHC VTEC is quite a dampner to somebody who expects the car to make all sorts of grunt & growl to hit three digit speeds.
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Old 4th September 2007, 18:53   #59
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He he he....

This is no argument. These are figures.

If the three cars are in 4th gear at 50 kmph and the drivers step on gas, they will reach 100kmph at the same time!

This does not mean the drivers can not downshift....

If one does not understand the significance of this test, and thinks the test is about racing, then I am sorry for him.
Thats the whole point... this test hardly has any significance unlike say 0-100 or 20-80 in 3rd as no one who needs acceleration will do 40-100 in 4th gear.

Anyway looks like autocar messed up the figures in this one. Just opened the review and the figures for 20-80 in 3rd gear and 40-100 in 4th gear are

Speed iDSI/CVT/VTEC
20-80(3rd) 13.56/8.25/12.71
40-100(4th) 17.76/10.95/17.29

From those figures its obvious that the CVT and VTEC figures are interchanged . There's no the iDSI CVT is 7 seconds faster than the VTEC.
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Old 4th September 2007, 19:09   #60
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Yes.

Looks like Vtec figures are messed up with the CVT ones.
Thanks for bringing that up.

This in fact, firms my faith in Honda.
Their Vtec is way ahead of equally powered Ford and their lower power engine is actually as much capable as the higher power Ford!!!

Way to go Honda.

On a sidenote - 40-100 test does tell you how much torque you have in 4'th gear while crusing. So it's not a useless test as such.
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