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Old 9th December 2007, 15:47   #16
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Default Two questions

1.) What is 'road presence'? The concept alludes me.

2.) Hyundai has a bad reputation in North America, where I have spent years driving. They are known for producing glitzy looking vehicles that hold up for 30K and then spend hour after hour in the service bay after that. Has Hyundai really proven itself in India in the quality vector?
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Old 9th December 2007, 15:51   #17
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2.) Hyundai has a bad reputation in North America, where I have spent years driving. They are known for producing glitzy looking vehicles that hold up for 30K and then spend hour after hour in the service bay after that. Has Hyundai really proven itself in India in the quality vector?
USATODAY.com - Hyundai improves dramatically in quality survey

Industry Report Part 1: New J.D. Power Initial Quality Survey Puts Hyundai Above Toyota - Automobile.com __ Auto News

And thats in 2004. You need to drive there more often, doc.
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Old 9th December 2007, 16:06   #18
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@Dan. Nice questions.
By road presence, many people means attention. Yes, the vehicle passes by and it grabs a lot of attention. This is sometimes due to sheer size, sometimes the badge, name, exclusivity etc... Hope I got it right.

What makes me more attracted to post here is the second question.
Hyundai. I hate them. I really dunno why. But I do. It could be due to the image which got imprinted in my mind from innumerous failures and dirty experiences we had with Hyundais abroad.
Ok! Coming to India, it's got a different image here. It's known for producing cheaper, good quality cars that are also cheaper and easy to service and maintain. What more would one ask from a car manufacturer? Especially when this company was managed by a certain personality called Mr. Subbu. Now, some quality issues are creeping in by very small numbers. Hope they control it.
As a matter of fact, Hyundai has a good respect here for cars below 8lacs price range. After which it looses it's charm to bigger brands.
Oh! We've gone too much OT here.

Coming back to the topic, I seriously recommend to test drive the good Ol' Pajero before you make your final decision. If you're still not happy with it, then get a Montero as I told before. (I'm serious this time. So, no smilie)

Last edited by speedzak : 9th December 2007 at 16:09. Reason: Spelling Baba!
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Old 9th December 2007, 16:22   #19
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Default Am not convinced just yet....

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Originally Posted by Steeroid View Post
And thats in 2004. You need to drive there more often, doc.
I would like to, the road builders have just installed a few new banks of potholes down the hill from me and I yearn mightily for a 500 kilometer drive unvexed by cows, drunken Tata truck drivers and Buses coming at me head on.

I am trying to keep an open mind on this Hyundai thing. The JD Power report tends to confirm an increase in quality but the pole only covers the first 3 months of vehicle ownership and we do not know from it what the nature of the reported problems were, e.g. the severity. As I said, Hyundai has a reputation for not lasting. I have no particular axe to grind. If they really become number one in quality I shall dance naked in the streets of Delhi in celebration....or, maybe not.
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Old 9th December 2007, 16:32   #20
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Default Nope!!

Just a few corrections for all and sundry!

1. Comparing Safari vs Tuscon - Tuscon is anyday a better offroader!

2. Hyundai is 'almost' a 'sleeper' brand in the US. It enjoys quite a few admirers!

And these are facts

thanks

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Old 9th December 2007, 16:34   #21
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Default An Answer!

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Coming to India, it's got a different image here. It's known for producing cheaper, good quality cars that are also cheaper and easy to service and maintain. What more would one ask from a car manufacturer? Especially when this company was managed by a certain personality called Mr. Subbu.
Speedzak, thanks, for your definitive answer. Now I understand. I hope this guy Mr. Subbu does not have a last name of 'Ru'.
Okay, so now I will take the Tucson more seriously.
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Old 9th December 2007, 16:51   #22
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Originally Posted by DirtyDan View Post
so now I will take the Tucson more seriously.
Emphasizing on what zak said- Hyundai had been really succesful under 8L bracket. Tucson was never taken seriously, together with many other models they launched. However, thats got more to do with the brand rather than the abilities of the car.
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Old 10th December 2007, 10:15   #23
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Originally Posted by rippergeo View Post
so, basically, I want a diesel soft-roader which handles well and can leave traffic behind if its irritating me- answer seems to be tuscon

top speed is not important. I rarely go above 100. but till i reach 100 its always pedal to the metal.

also- something I forgot to mention- braking- the tuscon thrashes the pants off the other two
.....at least get your spelling right - or do you buy a car without even getting the name right ; its TUCSON.

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Originally Posted by rippergeo View Post
The safari is a softroader, no doubt.It was built to carry people in comfort and it does that job brilliantly. better than the other two(infact better than most cars I've driven) even over extremely rough terrain
BUT
the GC is only 180mm and the soft suspension bottoms out in deep ruts. scraping the underbody is also frequent.I had to baby it on the trail, while the endeavour sailed through and the tuscon did to a lesser extent
Your comments made me smile - its always good to have a laugh early in the day - the Safari bottoming out on deep ruts and scraping the underbody and the Tucson "sailing" through the same???? ROTFLMAO, no offense meant.

But let the Safari bashing continue in the meantime.........

Last edited by suman : 10th December 2007 at 10:20.
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Old 10th December 2007, 19:38   #24
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Originally Posted by suman View Post
.....at least get your spelling right - or do you buy a car without even getting the name right ; its TUCSON.


Your comments made me smile - its always good to have a laugh early in the day - the Safari bottoming out on deep ruts and scraping the underbody and the Tucson "sailing" through the same???? ROTFLMAO, no offense meant.

But let the Safari bashing continue in the meantime.........
@Suman, i guess i touched a raw nerve when criticised the safari. didnt know you were so passionate about it. you yourself know that it is not an off roader. copied and pasted below is what you wrote in reply to a question from doctorkats on the raid de himalaya thread. It doesnt seem like you have much confidence in it either, as an offroader.
__________________________________________________ _____________
Originally Posted by doctorkats
how good is the safari 4x4 for the raid?
Your reply was-Terrible I'd say....you need something that has the agility of a mountain goat & our beast is more of the Yeti type in terms of rumbling round the hairpins. A Gypsy if anything - I know that Sideways managed it in a Scorpio but only he could have done it.....apart from, of course, Nitin who celebrated his honeymoon in ONE HELL OF A UNIQUE WAY, congrats on that once again Nitin!
__________________________________________________ ______________
here's the link to your own post http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/motor-...tml#post428418

I never said the safari is a bad car. I said its not a great offroader, and you yourself agree with me.

further-the GC is only 180mm, the suspension is soft and travels quite a bit. when you enter a rut at speed,the chassis will dip and use up that 180mm quite quickly, hitting the lip of the rut.

I only say this cos it happened to me twice on the TD of the safari. the same rut in the Tucson(i got the spelling right this time) was no problem.
the tucson escaped because of the marginally higher GC(190 mm) ,stiffer suspension, lesser weight.

Its only physics.

Now the same quality of the safari's suspension(soft,with greater travel) has advantages in a softroader for india.
The ride in the safari is brilliant and beats the tucson and the big endy by miles.
and please note- i never said the tucson sailed through, i said the endeavour sailed through and the tuscon did to a lesser extent.

Its not safari bashing.
I called it like I saw it.

Like I said, It is unfair to compare the safari with cars that cost double. i knew it, but still did a TD. and I wrote about the safari. I liked it, but I wont buy it cos my requirements are different.

Last edited by rippergeo : 10th December 2007 at 19:40.
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Old 11th December 2007, 00:18   #25
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Safari 2.2 GC is 205mm now I think, please correct me if I am wrong.
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Old 11th December 2007, 03:52   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rippergeo;653011[B
]@Suman, i guess i touched a raw nerve when criticised the safari. didnt know you were so passionate about it.[/b] you yourself know that it is not an off roader. copied and pasted below is what you wrote in reply to a question from doctorkats on the raid de himalaya thread. It doesnt seem like you have much confidence in it either, as an offroader.
__________________________________________________ _____________
Originally Posted by doctorkats
how good is the safari 4x4 for the raid?
Your reply was-Terrible I'd say....you need something that has the agility of a mountain goat & our beast is more of the Yeti type in terms of rumbling round the hairpins. A Gypsy if anything - I know that Sideways managed it in a Scorpio but only he could have done it.....apart from, of course, Nitin who celebrated his honeymoon in ONE HELL OF A UNIQUE WAY, congrats on that once again Nitin!
__________________________________________________ ______________
here's the link to your own post http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/motor-...tml#post428418

I never said the safari is a bad car. I said its not a great offroader, and you yourself agree with me.

further-the GC is only 180mm, the suspension is soft and travels quite a bit. when you enter a rut at speed,the chassis will dip and use up that 180mm quite quickly, hitting the lip of the rut.

I only say this cos it happened to me twice on the TD of the safari. the same rut in the Tucson(i got the spelling right this time) was no problem.
the tucson escaped because of the marginally higher GC(190 mm) ,stiffer suspension, lesser weight.

Its only physics.

Now the same quality of the safari's suspension(soft,with greater travel) has advantages in a softroader for india.
The ride in the safari is brilliant and beats the tucson and the big endy by miles.
and please note- i never said the tucson sailed through, i said the endeavour sailed through and the tuscon did to a lesser extent.

Its not safari bashing.
I called it like I saw it.

Like I said, It is unfair to compare the safari with cars that cost double. i knew it, but still did a TD. and I wrote about the safari. I liked it, but I wont buy it cos my requirements are different.
Howdy Ripper?
You're right. Suman is mighty passionate about his Safari.
You know how I know I'm passionate about mine too.Thats why we ended up buying the truck.We did our recky and homework too.
You're welcome to your opinion and we respect it, as your opinion.
My Safari 4x4 has run nearly 12000km.
I have driven my baby up and down the nastiest of places.Mud,slush,clay,rocks,streams,mounds,gravel and silt.Never once have I been disappointed.
I have had my clutch fried like a breakfast sausage on a pan for having foolishly driven into a clayey river bed where my car partially sank like the titanic.
Even then I wasn't disappointed with it because I knew the best off-roaders can get stuck.Circumstances.
In my case it was more driver error.
What Suman was trying to tell me on my Raid question was that I would be better off in a lighter,swifter and more nimble car than a bulky beast like the Safari.That didn't mean the Safari is not Raid worthy.
My friend Rakesh Gupta came 6th in the SUV category and 1st as first timers in the Raid de Himalaya (Adventure) this year.You know what he was driving?An un-modded Honda CRV save an under body protector.
The Safari maybe no Gurkha.But trust me she is NO soft roader.
You'll be surprised if you could see her perform.
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Old 11th December 2007, 04:02   #27
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Nicely put, Suman!
Your words took the very unnecessary doubt off my mind. I've heard stories of people going mud crazy with their 4X4 safaris. Then suddenly I fall into a pit where it seemed to fail before a Tucson. No! No!

BTW, this is the beauty of Team-BHP. You can have different views and come to your own conclusion without hurting others. Kudos to Team-BHP.
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Old 11th December 2007, 06:49   #28
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Originally Posted by speedzak View Post
Nicely put, Suman!
Your words took the very unnecessary doubt off my mind. I've heard stories of people going mud crazy with their 4X4 safaris. Then suddenly I fall into a pit where it seemed to fail before a Tucson. No! No!

BTW, this is the beauty of Team-BHP. You can have different views and come to your own conclusion without hurting others. Kudos to Team-BHP.
Thats what i'm trying to say guys. these are just my views. and not meant to hurt anyone. and what happened with the safari is not a failure in anyway.It seems to be built for a different purpose than the endeavour or pajero.

BTW, I have no doubt It will do well in the mud, the engine is torquey, has pleny of oomph, the wheels bite well, have enough traction.Rocks and hard obstacles like logs are where the safari will suffer. so will the tucson.

I'm dissapointed by the car like GC of the safari.thats what makes the underbody scrape IMO.
Tuzy edged past probably because of the slightly higher GC(a difference of 10mm) and the stiffer suspension(which gives it a rougher ride)which helps it utilize the scant advantage that this 10mm gives. This is what I felt during my TD.
after all it was only a TD. If you have been using the safari for offroading, you are definitely going to be better at it than me. this was my 1st ever drive in a safari, and my first ever offroading experience other than the Gypsy, MM540 and the Nissan Patrol(UK)

I'll say this again-I never said the safari is a bad car. you can see so in my review.

Last edited by rippergeo : 11th December 2007 at 06:56.
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Old 11th December 2007, 06:58   #29
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You don't have to be apologetic, ripper! This is the way it works here. If you like some thing, you take it. If you don't ignore it after some try.
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Old 11th December 2007, 07:20   #30
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Did you take all TD cars into the forest, by any chance?

For someone used to driving small cars (me), hearing of these big SUVs scraping belly seems too out-of-the world.

Last edited by CrAzY dRiVeR : 11th December 2007 at 07:28.
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