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Old 18th September 2009, 13:46   #196
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Originally Posted by MudMover View Post
Hey guys, I'm cool. Basically what each camp is trying to imply is that the particular variant of Bolero which they own is most suited to their specific user profile. The friction arose when one camp tried to project their variant as the best -- when actually the truth is that their variant is the best for THEM.

Ashley & Maheep, the above is my position. I admire the lengths to which you've gone to explain the technical logic of your view, but you have only convinced me that the CRDE was/is the best for me. Wow! the designers of the Bolero will be proud that their product has such die hard fans!

P.S: The best thing about using pseudonames is that nothing is personal!
Ur 100% correct sir, each variant is good, and best suited to the owner, tats why we all bought what we own today, and saying other is not good, would be inappropriate, Crde existed when i bought the SLX, and SLX existed when you or someone else went for the CRDe, so again a very personal choice, which everyone is entitled to.
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Old 18th September 2009, 14:12   #197
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Well, thats your version and driving ability sir!



Yup, you are cool.

Now, I would like Maheep007 to define offroading and what it means to him.

I dont see any issue in handling a different kind of vehicle over a same terrain and get it out and My aim is not to let an engine idle while i steer it out
I forgot to add this-
The technology too is simple, basic and uncomplicated, without any sensors, frills, ECU's and other sophisticated and delicate electronic equipment. For eg, if you happen to be in water and the water splashes/enters your ECU, what will the TOUGH Bolero do if it simply stalls as a result of that?

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Old 18th September 2009, 14:26   #198
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Hi guys,

I was following this thread quite avidly and I realised that I had to get myself registered atleast to put my 'opinions' to all bolero owners, myself included.

When are we all going to grow up and realise that we've all been had and just fighting over innanities, now that we are stuck with the beast for life. Donít get me wrong, but right from the time the first bolero was launched,it has been my dream vehicle and I got my slx on 2007.From the day I bought it I realized Iíve been had, for the reasons in which the Vlx version performs better.

Engine - This matter has been debated in all possible ways, so here's my 2 cents. I took my vehicle on my first long drive to bangalore from chennai(lovely roads by the way) and my slx maxxed out at 125 KPH and to maintain that speed on the highway was a nightmare. To add insult to injury, a 1992 model Premier Padmini was able to not only overtake me easily, but also stopped for chai and again repeated it. Imagine buying a slx for 6.5 lkhs and take it out on a drive and get licked by a sub Rs.30000 bucket and then try to say that I've got a better ride. This would have never happened on a vlx not only because of it engine power but also its ability to handle itself, Which brings me to the second point..


Suspension - Iím really surprised that this issue has not been mentioned in this thread at all. The front suspension of the vlx is a scorpio derived suspension. Look underneath the chassis and you will see that the shock absorbers, the anti-roll bars, the entire unit is different in the vlx. I know what Iím talking about because Iíve tried to upgrade my slx to this type of suspension, with no success as the people say its impossible. I challenge any slx owner to prove that their ride is more comfortable than the vlx on any form of road. This brings me the final point

Braking Ė The brakes in the vlx are bigger, the booster is more powerful and it comes fitted with lspv, which is not available in the slx. Ive done my homework pretty thoroughly and I challenge anyone to prove me wrong. Try crash braking the slx and the beast becomes a pig and starts squealing like one. Now try the same on the vlx and you will know what Iím taking about

So, a similar vehicle with a similar build quality has better speed, better suspension and better brakes for a price difference of just Rs60000/- is in my book a way better vehicle.

Now before all you vlx owners start smiling end to end, hereís the fact. JEEP is an acronym for JUST ENOUGH FOR EVERY PURPOSE. So donít you even remotely realize that for the amount of money you are paying, you could have easily got the scorpio lx for just another 60k more? The only excuse you can possibly say is that you cannot off-road in a scorpio. Let me tell you this, you cannot do serious off-roading in a vlx too because it does not have any low end torque.

The slx with the DI engine is better equipped for off-roading and thatís a fact. Whether the same can be said for the the suspension in terms of ride comfort in the slx, Im not so sure.

SO both the vehicles are a bit of everything which effectively adds up to nothing. Now that Iíve said my piece letís all put our heads together and bawl cause weíve all BEEN HAD
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Old 18th September 2009, 20:41   #199
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Originally Posted by maheep007 View Post
some are made keeping in mind modern age technology some are intentionally kept the old way keeping in mind their functionality, thats the reason CRDe was never introduced in pick up versions and other commercial vehicles, it would be of no use there,
What Engines do the Volvos, the Mercedes or the Scanias use for hauling - DI?

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Now that Iíve said my piece letís all put our heads together and bawl cause weíve all BEEN HAD
This is the best part..


Hi Neil, nice post which has said the attributes of the Bolero quite well.,

Now, the Scorp is not just 60K more, its a lot more than that, atleast when I enquired - The base scorp costed me close to 9 whereas my VLX was 7.38 landed!!


And yes, you are right about the suspension and the LSPV bit.
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Old 18th September 2009, 22:32   #200
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Sounds like the so-called car-like qualities of the CRDe Bolero might be just the ticket for rough city roads in the monsoon and trips to the rural areas though.

I am seriously considering one of these as a secondary vehicle. Any recommendations on good dealers in Chennai?
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Old 19th September 2009, 07:56   #201
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I am seriously considering one of these as a secondary vehicle. Any recommendations on good dealers in Chennai?
There are 2 dealers - MPL Automobiles and VST Motors. Both do NOT recommend a Storm due to some unknown reason.

You could check out this thread for further details on dealer opinions!

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-d...rde-storm.html (97BHP, 25.5 Kgm, Common Rail - The Bolero CRDe Storm)
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Old 19th September 2009, 09:10   #202
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Originally Posted by Neil Roy View Post
Hi guys,

I was following this thread quite avidly and I realised that I had to get myself registered atleast to put my 'opinions' to all bolero owners, myself included.

When are we all going to grow up and realise that we've all been had and just fighting over innanities, now that we are stuck with the beast for life. Don’t get me wrong, but right from the time the first bolero was launched,it has been my dream vehicle and I got my slx on 2007.From the day I bought it I realized I’ve been had, for the reasons in which the Vlx version performs better.

Engine - This matter has been debated in all possible ways, so here's my 2 cents. I took my vehicle on my first long drive to bangalore from chennai(lovely roads by the way) and my slx maxxed out at 125 KPH and to maintain that speed on the highway was a nightmare. To add insult to injury, a 1992 model Premier Padmini was able to not only overtake me easily, but also stopped for chai and again repeated it. Imagine buying a slx for 6.5 lkhs and take it out on a drive and get licked by a sub Rs.30000 bucket and then try to say that I've got a better ride. This would have never happened on a vlx not only because of it engine power but also its ability to handle itself, Which brings me to the second point..


Suspension - I’m really surprised that this issue has not been mentioned in this thread at all. The front suspension of the vlx is a scorpio derived suspension. Look underneath the chassis and you will see that the shock absorbers, the anti-roll bars, the entire unit is different in the vlx. I know what I’m talking about because I’ve tried to upgrade my slx to this type of suspension, with no success as the people say its impossible. I challenge any slx owner to prove that their ride is more comfortable than the vlx on any form of road. This brings me the final point

Braking – The brakes in the vlx are bigger, the booster is more powerful and it comes fitted with lspv, which is not available in the slx. Ive done my homework pretty thoroughly and I challenge anyone to prove me wrong. Try crash braking the slx and the beast becomes a pig and starts squealing like one. Now try the same on the vlx and you will know what I’m taking about

So, a similar vehicle with a similar build quality has better speed, better suspension and better brakes for a price difference of just Rs60000/- is in my book a way better vehicle.

Now before all you vlx owners start smiling end to end, here’s the fact. JEEP is an acronym for JUST ENOUGH FOR EVERY PURPOSE. So don’t you even remotely realize that for the amount of money you are paying, you could have easily got the scorpio lx for just another 60k more? The only excuse you can possibly say is that you cannot off-road in a scorpio. Let me tell you this, you cannot do serious off-roading in a vlx too because it does not have any low end torque.

The slx with the DI engine is better equipped for off-roading and that’s a fact. Whether the same can be said for the the suspension in terms of ride comfort in the slx, Im not so sure.

SO both the vehicles are a bit of everything which effectively adds up to nothing. Now that I’ve said my piece let’s all put our heads together and bawl cause we’ve all BEEN HAD
You added more than humble 2cents , however

Engine - IT has been mentioned and agreed again and again that the DI is not an ideal highway cruiser in terms of overtaking and speeds in excess of 120KM/H comfortably, and cannot compete with other engines/vehicles on a highway, its a weakness it has, that has already been acknowledged & agreed upon. However its virtues cannot be ignored, stress has also been tried to laid on the fact of its functionality, its performance as a solid maintenance free simple uncomplicated and long life engine that has made its mark in proving it can handle loads of abuse and stress, without a complain and whimper.

Suspension - Jeep suspensions are always different than a soft roader, they will always be stiff ( Gypsy) as most will have leaf suspension, springs are mostly given in cars and other soft roaders which mostly commute on well laid concrete mettled roads, in case of SLX, front is springs and back is leaf, as i believe back suspension was designed to carry load.

Brakes - Since the power has been boosted, its but natural the brakes had to be boosted to handle the higher speeds. When a vehicle is to cruise above the 120 KM/H mark, bigger brakes are better, and in a way, a necessity.

My advice would be not too push that gas paddle too much, the speed and the braking no doubt has been boosted, but the boxy shape has not changed and so haven't the driving dynamics on a highway, and its not an aerodynamic vehicle, and chances of it overturning are much more at high speed than a car, that for a fact is true with every SUV.

Ur addition in the end about it being a better JEEP, correctly put and strengthened the facts.

Last edited by maheep007 : 19th September 2009 at 09:12.
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Old 19th September 2009, 09:25   #203
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[quote=headers;1490485]What Engines do the Volvos, the Mercedes or the Scanias use for hauling - DI?



Dude you are talking about high end vehicles and companies that are light years ahead in technology than our Mahindra, and their vehicles and engines cost much much more than our DI or CRDe, they put in loads of time, effort to develop a single vehicle and engine. Their engines are much more high powered and churn our very impressive low and high end torques, as economy is not their main focussed point, performance is, where as here in India, its the opposite, so don't even go there, its comparing apples and oranges, lets see what we have here, and what we can own and discuss about.
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Old 19th September 2009, 09:33   #204
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There are 2 dealers - MPL Automobiles and VST Motors. Both do NOT recommend a Storm due to some unknown reason.

You could check out this thread for further details on dealer opinions!

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-d...rde-storm.html (97BHP, 25.5 Kgm, Common Rail - The Bolero CRDe Storm)
Ur correct there, the dealerships here too don't recommend the STORM, they put their bet on the DI, atleast thats what the sales team and the mechanics at their service section had to say, they said they seldom sell a CRDe, primarily cuz of the price diff, and secondly again i'll have to say people's preference for the proven rugged nature and cheaper running cost of the DI, not to add its cheaper spares hence cheaper service costs every time.
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Old 19th September 2009, 11:22   #205
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Originally Posted by maheep007 View Post
[
Dude you are talking about high end vehicles and companies that are light years ahead in technology than our Mahindra, and their vehicles and engines cost much much more than our DI or CRDe, they put in loads of time, effort to develop a single vehicle and engine. Their engines are much more high powered and churn our very impressive low and high end torques, as economy is not their main focussed point, performance is,
Thanks, this was just to establish that CRDi Technology can churn out low end torque too!!

BTW, Mahindra is not too behind in technology when it comes to World Class - It is one of the companies that has does a turn around with their Scorpio!!

True they did start of low tech, but now, they are impressive!

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Originally Posted by maheep007 View Post
Ur correct there, the dealerships here too don't recommend the STORM, they put their bet on the DI, atleast thats what the sales team and the mechanics at their service section had to say, they said they seldom sell a CRDe, primarily cuz of the price diff, and secondly again i'll have to say people's preference for the proven rugged nature and cheaper running cost of the DI, not to add its cheaper spares hence cheaper service costs every time.
LOL - Its sad that a mechanic is making the owner decide on what type of car to buy.

It could also mean that the mechanic understands nothing of CRDe and hence the above statements.
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Old 19th September 2009, 12:21   #206
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Hi Guys,

Iím glad that my opinions were well received, and hopefully, wat I say further does not offend anybody. The idea behind any forum discussion is to encourage debate which brings out many revelations that will ultimately help a third person decide better about wat he wants. In this case, this discussion is about the Bolero Storm, wat it can and cannot do, and the obvious comparison to its cousin the Bolero SLX . Atleast thatís my understanding.

Bolero claims to be the largest selling SUV in India. What it effectively means is that many people like me like to own one at an affordable price. What it definitely does not mean is that all the people who buy a bolero have to go off-roading, and definitely not always. It is just a comforting reassurance to know that such an option exists. It is in this context that any comparison has to be made. Not every bolero owner is a hardcore off-roading fanatic who goes off into the jungle looking for adventure. Iím an averge joe trying to look macho in the city and Iím hoping that my ride (read Bolero) projects that image, and Iím happy that in that respect atleast mission accomplished. No two wheeler or auto or for that matter even town bus tries to mess with the bolero too much. And true, the DI engine is a work horse which does not create any maintenance issues. However, the negatives also must be mentioned or rather emphasized so that any prospective buyer will atleast know wat he is getting into.
Engine: Granted, the DI engine in the SLX is a work horse. But does it justify that I have to spend upward of 6.5 lakhs on a 2009 model SLX to see myself being overtaken by an archaic 92 model Premier Padmini? Believe me, it is very,very humiliating. IS is too much too expect my so-called SUV to be at par with vehicles, designed and made almost 2 decades earlier? And Yes, the engine doing service in a premier padmini is also a work horse and easy to maintain. The SLX is a big NO for guys living in upscale places cos the engine noise is an embarrassment to any potential owner who looks to it as a status symbol. Try starting it in the middle of the nite, should you have any emergency to do so, and Iím pretty sure you will have disapproving stares from your neighborsí the next day. In this regard, the Storm is swift and silent. MM also offers a 100000Km warranty on the Storm Engine, I Think.

Suspension : The VLX also has coil springs in the front and Spring leaf in the back. Hence it can also carry higher loads. Only the front part is a Scorpio derived suspension. To put it in layman terms, driver fatigue driving a VLX is lesser than driving a SLX and the ride is far more comfortable . I have a major disc problem on my back and hence the extensive emphasis on drivability and comfort, which I think is not unreasonable when I invest my hard-earned money on Indiaís largest selling SUV. And Hereís the cinch, VLX offers higher standard warranty than the SLX.

Brakes : I personally do not believe in belittling another personsí opinion, but facts have to be emphasized especially when brakes or lack of it not only poses a risk to us, but also to the public. I can vouch that Bolero SLX brakes are definitely not upto the mark. Right from the time I purchased my SLX I have visited MPL garage regarding brakes, and got them replaced, within warranty of course, and still the rear tyres lock up.It has been acknowledged by the MPL itself, Ďstrictly off the recordí that VLX brakes are superior. Anyways, who will not want a better braking option for their ride??? Not that Iím a speed freak, But driving a SLX even at low speeds, one has to be extremely watchful cos if you slam the brakes, the rear tyres lock up and skid, and skid loudly.
In conclusion regarding Bolero SLX, the ride is tiresome, exhausting and not to be expected from Indiaís largest selling SUV.

Regarding Bolero Storm, VLX
Hi Headers,
Maybe Iím wrong but this is the price list quoted in scorpio web-site for chennai
LX -725700
M2DI -681300
SLE 824700
Excepting M2DI, this is for the 2.2 litre Mhawk engine
Prices are ex-show-room so add maybe say 70k. Again I may be wrong.
Hereís the price list link
[COLOR=#800080]http://www.mahindrascorpio.com/scorpio_refresh/buy_price.asp[/COLOR]

There are three issues regarding Bolero Storm,vlx.
Firstly, the price is not far from an entry level scorpio.
Secondly, and again I emphasise that I do not want to offend anybody, fuel efficiency. My SLX gives me 10.5 Kmpl in city, bumper to bumper traffic where you cannot even reach 4th gear. I do not know if that performance will be matched in the CRDE engine as this engine is rev-happy unlike itís DI counterpart which will chug along in idling itself- and thatís how I drive in city.
Thirdly, the dealers themselves do not know their right foot from their left when it comes to The Bolero Storm. In fact one sales rep in MPL told me that the only difference b/w the SLX and VLX was the engine and only because of the engine weight difference, the handling is better. Don know whether I should laugh or cry. Laugh at his lack of intelligence(to put it mildly) or cry knowing that I invested in my SLX trusting these guys???
I think Iím gonna do both.
Bye
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Old 19th September 2009, 13:35   #207
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Engine: Granted, the DI engine in the SLX is a work horse. But does it justify that I have to spend upward of 6.5 lakhs on a 2009 model SLX
Agreed!

Quote:
There are three issues regarding Bolero Storm,vlx.
Firstly, the price is not far from an entry level scorpio.
Websites are dissapointing - Thats how i got misled into thinking about the XYLO for 1 day.


Quote:
Secondly, and again I emphasise that I do not want to offend anybody, fuel efficiency. My SLX gives me 10.5 Kmpl in city, bumper to bumper traffic where you cannot even reach 4th gear. I do not know if that performance will be matched in the CRDE engine as this engine is rev-happy unlike it’s DI counterpart which will chug along in idling itself- and that’s how I drive in city.
I've heard guys quoting 16kpl in the DI turbo.

Quote:
Thirdly, the dealers themselves do not know their right foot from their left when it comes to The Bolero Storm. In fact one sales rep in MPL told me that the only difference b/w the SLX and VLX was the engine and only because of the engine weight difference, the handling is better. Don know whether I should laugh or cry. Laugh at his lack of intelligence(to put it mildly) or cry knowing that I invested in my SLX trusting these guys???
BTW, sir, please stop using sms language in your typing as it will entail an infraction.

The dealers need to be trained hard and fast my M&M
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Old 19th September 2009, 16:10   #208
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Originally Posted by headers View Post
There are 2 dealers - MPL Automobiles and VST Motors. Both do NOT recommend a Storm due to some unknown reason.

You could check out this thread for further details on dealer opinions!

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-d...rde-storm.html (97BHP, 25.5 Kgm, Common Rail - The Bolero CRDe Storm)
Thanks - maybe not the VLX after all, might just stick to the DI version. Any suggestions on good used Mahindra dealers? Contacted a known one, TS Mahalingam & Sons, but they didn't have any in stock.

Went for a test-drive in city traffic today, they sent a SLE version equipped with AC but no power windows. Quite an "experience", but I think for busy city & rough conditions it is ideal.
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Old 19th September 2009, 17:50   #209
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Thanks, this was just to establish that CRDi Technology can churn out low end torque too!!

BTW, Mahindra is not too behind in technology when it comes to World Class - It is one of the companies that has does a turn around with their Scorpio!!

True they did start of low tech, but now, they are impressive!



LOL - Its sad that a mechanic is making the owner decide on what type of car to buy.

It could also mean that the mechanic understands nothing of CRDe and hence the above statements.
Yes sir it can, and i have added in my earlier post why can they do it, but we were always discussing only the Mahindra DI and Mahindra CRDe, and what these two could do and could not do. It definitely is not behind according to Indian standards, its a good, decent and reliable technology, but when you use the term "World Class", Mahindra might fall short of that position/recognition, as world class truly actually means world class, and very top reputable companies such as Mercedes, Audi, BMW etc. fall in that category, many other and rather most companies around the world cannot boast of being truly "World Class", and that was the reason i said lets not venture in that unknown, its a segment and a category very different from what we are discussing, lets discuss options we have and what we drive.
The mechanics don't tell the owners what to buy sir, but they do add their opinions/knowledge based on experience and everyday activities at the dealerships, they don't go around telling people not to buy the STORM sir, its when you occasionally go to the service centre to get ur vehicle serviced and you get in discussion, that they open up and discuss what they have to say.
You seem to be quite offended with me my friend, what did i say so personal to you that you have your temp blowing up the thermometer? Take it easy, we are all here to share our views, if we don't like or agree with other persons view, then like i said, accept them as other persons personal opinion, to which, again, every one is entitled to, correct? Regards and Cheers!!
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Old 19th September 2009, 18:01   #210
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Hi Guys,




Engine: Granted, the DI engine in the SLX is a work horse. But does it justify that I have to spend upward of 6.5 lakhs on a 2009 model SLX
Bye
I got mine last year in Aug for 6.23 after discount, after that due to launch of XYLO the prices of Bolero and Scorpio were slashed and Bolero was priced around 5.75, now about 20 days ago someone told me the SLX was still for 5.75 or 5.85 showroom price.
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