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Old 22nd March 2010, 01:42   #376
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@shantanumishra

From my previous experience in my official job as a supplier to automotive industry i can say the following.

Every Industry sector follows their own demand cycle. This depends on the macro economic factors as well as technological interventions. A typical Global Auto OEM business plans run into next 20 years from the current year.

Typically a new platform takes about 4 years to develop and 3 years to industrialize. A new platform typically remains in the market for about 3-4 years unless it is a catastrophic failure. A life of a vehicle is typically 7-10 years, so the vehicle needs to be serviced for 7 years since the last sale.
typically spare part policy (as i understand) is to keep the critical spares for 7 years since the last official warranee expiry.

so a model planning should take care into consideration 4+3+4+ (7 to 10) = 18 to 21 years. These years are for a roadmap planning in a top level planning department.

When it comes to a specific country market e.g. India, what the local marketeers do is only the planning for the middle 4 years. Thier job is to keep the model running for the 4 years successfully with the target level of sales. When ever the sales begin to decline e.g. 12-18 months form the introdcution, they would launch a varient. e.g. SMT to VMT change in Honda.

The OHC --> NHC ---> ANHC change is planned as a platform change and not a varient change. SMT to VMT change is a varient change.

Toyota and Honda because of their experience they have macro e-conomic forecast data as well as historical sales data from which one can predict the future demand with resonable accuracy. This decides their Product Life Cycle.

Last edited by StarVegabond : 22nd March 2010 at 01:45.
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Old 22nd March 2010, 01:59   #377
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StarVegabond View Post
Toyota and Honda because of their experience they have macro e-conomic forecast data as well as historical sales data from which one can predict the future demand with resonable accuracy. This decides their Product Life Cycle.
Does that mean, Toyota and Honda only projected good sales figures for 5 years for any particular model and to launch a new platform within that time frame, although at the time of change, all of their models were selling like hot cakes in the Indian market scenario. Even now, resale value of Qualis/OHC is extremely high and you would not find many people out there selling these beauties.
Even NHC was one of the best selling models for Honda when they replaced it although it had a puny engine as compared to OHC.
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Old 22nd March 2010, 02:19   #378
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shantanumishra View Post
Does that mean, Toyota and Honda only projected good sales figures for 5 years for any particular model and to launch a new platform within that time frame, although at the time of change, all of their models were selling like hot cakes in the Indian market scenario. Even now, resale value of Qualis/OHC is extremely high and you would not find many people out there selling these beauties.
Even NHC was one of the best selling models for Honda when they replaced it although it had a puny engine as compared to OHC.
Yes, if the market is crowded with more players, these number of years figure for good sales drops faster. If a competitor does technological intervention (=launching a product with a superior technology or user experience) then also the life cycle comes down. Then the marketeers might implement the plan B i.e. Price play (=milking the product) or Flanking (=a different segment product positioned very attractively near the competitor's product)

possibilities are endless, the above example is only one of the method. that is why marketing or selling considered as an ART than a science.

What Toyota did for Qualis in India was simple. Globally they were moving for a new platform (=innova), keeping Qualis in production only in India (small volumes compared global), was difficult. so that postioned Innova as a successor product to Qualis. Indians who had not seen such superior product simply latched onto it.

Last edited by StarVegabond : 22nd March 2010 at 02:21.
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Old 22nd March 2010, 02:26   #379
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Thanks a lot for the clarification, appreciate
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Old 22nd March 2010, 08:54   #380
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Eventhough I agree that mid-life face lifts are introduced to provide boost to the 'slowing down' sales, in case of Honda it seem to be a practice they follow irrespective of market response.
Overall Honda seem to go with their own plan and not be 'reactive' or 'wait and watch'. They have introduced new revamped model, despite current model doing very well, twice in case of 'City' brand. What is interesting is, they have been bold enough to move away from the successful formula (each generaton City has been radically different from it's predecessor). Not many firms adopt such approach. What is even more important is, they have never continued selling an old model alongside new model and milk it to the maximum as some other automakers do.
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Old 22nd March 2010, 09:04   #381
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guna View Post
Eventhough I agree that mid-life face lifts are introduced to provide boost to the 'slowing down' sales, in case of Honda it seem to be a practice they follow irrespective of market response.
Overall Honda seem to go with their own plan and not be 'reactive' or 'wait and watch'. They have introduced new revamped model, despite current model doing very well, twice in case of 'City' brand. What is interesting is, they have been bold enough to move away from the successful formula (each generaton City has been radically different from it's predecessor). Not many firms adopt such approach. What is even more important is, they have never continued selling an old model alongside new model and milk it to the maximum as some other automakers do.
+1

IMO they do the social engineering as well, the new buyers think that they have got something new to the ones who have bought 12-15 months ago. Like in case of City now they are getting better plastics, more luxuries looking beige colour, alloys, chrome etc.

Similarly the old buyers think their car / variant is quite old within 4-5 years and they end up buying Honda / Toyota again ;-)
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Old 29th March 2010, 10:54   #382
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I travelled from Bangalore to Mumbai on 26th Afternoon. Left Yelahanka at 2.10 PM and Reached a relative's home at Ghansoli, Navi Mumbai today morning 6:50 AM on 27th March

Pre-drive preparations
---------------------
Decided about the trip and drive just 2 days before the actual trip
Got some recent updates as well as toll gate details from the Bangalore-Mumbai thread (Thanks HVK and Parag)
Got the washed and cleaned on 26th morning, refueled at IOCL, airpressure checked
We wanted to reach Hotel Sankam for the dinner, the resturant closes by 11 PM, we had about 8 hours to reach Belgaum. My calculations told me it would need about 7 hours 40 minutes (It actuall took me 7 hours 50 minutes this trip)
Refreshed the memory stick with the new music needed by my daughter.
We had the bootfull of luggage.


Some mile stones are as below
--------------------------------
02:10 PM Departure from yelahanka
03:30 PM Tumkur BP.
05.00 PM VRL Check point & Resturant prior to Chitradurga
05:25 PM departure from VRL after tea and snacks
09:50 PM Hotel Sankam, Belgaum
11.30 PM departure from Hotel Sankam after dinner & refueling
02:00 AM 20 minutes break near Karad for tea
05:10 AM Expressway foodmall prior to Lonavala
05:40 AM Departure after some early hot breakfast & Tea
06:50 AM reached Gansoli, Navi Mumbai.

Some statistics:
--------------------
Total Time : 16 hours, 40 minutes
Break time : 2 hours 55 minutes
Journey time : 13 hours 45 minutes
Totak KM : 987 KM
Average Speed : 71 KMPH
Standard speed : 80-90 KMPH
Peak Speed : 110 KMPH
AC Usage : 97% except during toll booths, some minutes of fresh air intake at night etc

Fuel Economy
--------------
Total Fuel Consumed : 32.xx ltrs x 2 times = 65 Ltrs minus few ltrs left in the tank before reaching reserve (assume 6/7 ltrs remaining) = 58 LTR
Fuel economy : ~ 17 KMPH
The display indicator showed 18.4 KMPH (error of 1.4)

Driving Comfort :
-----------------
Except for sleep rushing in during wee hours and on the last leg from Panvel to Ghansoli, rest of the trip was very comfortable. My daughter had one of the most pleasant sleep on the back seat for the whole night.

Road conditions:
-------------------
Yelahanka to Dodballapur : Excellent, 2 lane, 2 railway crossings

Dodballapur to Dobaspet : Excellent except for the rumblers, couple of pot holed sections, one railway crossing

Dobaspet to Tumkur Bypass: Excellent

Tumkur Bypass : work in progress, old speed breakers are bypassed now section of the flyover is operational, new speed breakers do the same thing like old ones, scrape the underbelly of the car

Sira-Hiriyur-Chitradurga : Excellent

Chitradurga BP : Work in progress, but the service road is very good, but single lane.

Chitradurga-Davangere : Work in progress in couple of sections, overall good

Davangere Bypass : Work in progress, go slow,

Davangere - Ranebennur - Haveri : Work in progress, out of this ~ 120 KMs stretch, some 30-40 KMs of work is still pending, Lot of Dust clouds, sudden end to the roads, diversion to the opposite side, huge pot holes at the diversions. Easier to drive during day time. Ranebennur town is a traffic mess, i am sure the citizens of the town are fed up with the traffic
jams throughout the day. There are two railway crossings between Rane bennur and Haveri, often gets blocked due to the train. The diversion to Haveri bypass is not properly markeed. we drove straight into the haveri town which is another traffic mess. This entry into town took away additional 20 minutes of our time.

Haveri onwards till Mumbai: Roads are Outstanding. perfect time to drive is in the nights, we drove at constant 80 KMPH in one lane and only 2-3 vehicles (mainly the cars who appeared to be in hurry) managed to overtake us

Finding a resturant which is open at night is a challenge, there are small tea stalls ( called Tapri in Marathi) who serve fresh and strong tea, you can find these when you find several trucks are parked on the side of the road.

Some night driving tips for myself (for future reference) to be followed during next trip

1. Ensure to eat light dinner as heavy food will make one drowsy
2. Know the locations of good fuel stations that would be open at night and, else ensure that you have tank full.
3. Do not change the lanes frequenty, drive in one lane
4. Have some patience before the truck in front of you allows you to overtake.
5. When ever one feels sleepy ensure that you stop, get yourself re-freshed with a facewash or hot tea/coffee etc.
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Old 29th March 2010, 13:52   #383
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1000KM in 16hours , that's too much, were you the only driver? I dont think I could drive more than 500KM in day that too in my Automatic.

BTW, thats a great report and thanks again for encouraging and motivating to record everything during a travel and then sharing.
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Old 29th March 2010, 14:05   #384
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That's is great marathon drive by you star!
Considering your peak speed to be modest @110 kmph, your average speed is very good. 17 kmpl is kind of FE you expect in a hatchback.
Are you used to driving in the night? My suggestion is to avoid it unless you had a good sleep during the day.

Last edited by Guna : 29th March 2010 at 14:08.
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Old 29th March 2010, 14:56   #385
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Originally Posted by TheBeastFieast View Post
were you the only driver? I dont think I could drive more than 500KM in day that too in my Automatic.

BTW, thats a great report and thanks again for encouraging and motivating to record everything during a travel and then sharing.
Hi TBF, yes, even though my wife drive, i did not want to let go the steering. . Honda cars provide good comfort on lond road trips. I was dead tired when i did similar trip on my Palio during 2008. This time with just 4 hours sleep, i was back to normal.

The whole purpose of the thread and forum is to share the experience. As a consumer of info, i feel the need to contribute. it is as simple as that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guna View Post
That's is great marathon drive by you star!
Considering your peak speed to be modest @110 kmph, your average speed is very good. 17 kmpl is kind of FE you expect in a hatchback.
Are you used to driving in the night? My suggestion is to avoid it unless you had a good sleep during the day.
ANHC fuel economy is very good, more importantly it is consistant.
i was driving at constant speed most of the time. this helps in getting the best out of the car as far as FE is concerned.

I am fairly used to night driving, but yes, i avoid it if possible. I do my research and avoid the difficult/dangerous routes during night especially after 8 PM. These days, my work timings have been bit skewed towards Europe, i generally remain awake till 1 AM atleast. this helped during the trip. I had slept at 1 AM and woke up at 9 AM on 26th March. SO the whole sleep pattern got shifted a bit.

sill i felt sleepy immediately after the dinner (a very heavy Punjabi food), again at 2:30 AM (stopped and had a hot / strong cup of tea) and again on the express way (stopped at the food mall, got refreshed), at the fag end of expressway (stopped the car and washed the face/eyes)

i had to reach Mumbai on 27th morning. initially we had planned not to bring the car, but considering the planned stay of 1 week and need of commuting, we decided to drive.

Last edited by StarVegabond : 29th March 2010 at 14:59.
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Old 29th March 2010, 15:27   #386
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Star - thats one hell of a long trip, why dont you give us a longer dedicated tarvel report?
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Old 29th March 2010, 15:48   #387
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Woah ... 987Km on a single go and alone is quite an achievement , but with City I think its feasible as you said the seat comfort.

However do let me know how the stock headlight fair on the Highway, Unless you have done some mods on the head lamps (If yes then let me know how were they too).

I am sure you will agree that City has one of the most pathetic Head lamps. I have trouble driving on city highways with those lights.
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Old 29th March 2010, 16:36   #388
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Hi SV,

16 hours woah, ANHC driving comfort is pretty good, it eases us.

Have fun and happy vacation.

Same query as MaimMishra, how did the head lights handle the night ride?
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Old 29th March 2010, 16:52   #389
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That must be one of the great drives. Do post some pics if any.
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Old 29th March 2010, 17:40   #390
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyWalker View Post
Star - thats one hell of a long trip, why dont you give us a longer dedicated tarvel report?
I do not want to post a travelogue as this is not a fun trip. I just posted the details about the trip that it would be of some use to others as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mailmishra View Post
However do let me know how the stock headlight fair on the Highway, Unless you have done some mods on the head lamps (If yes then let me know how were they too).

I am sure you will agree that City has one of the most pathetic Head lamps. I have trouble driving on city highways with those lights.
No, DO not agree that ANHC head light is pathetic. It is as per the legal requirements and enables one to drive during the night. I have not done any mods to the head lights as i think it is illegal to do so. I alwasy suffer when some one shoots his illegally modified headlights into my eyes whild travelling at night. I think it is not only insensitive to do so, but also insane. I would not join the fraternity who so. the intention of this post is not to undermine the people who have modified thier head lamps, my point of view is simple, if it is a safety and real user requirment, then it would have been part of the product specs as well as mandetory requirement in first place.

if we do not respect the law, then we can not expect others to do so.
more over we should not selectively decide which law to follow and which one to avoid and which one to break.


Quote:
Originally Posted by raghu230506 View Post
Hi SV,

Have fun and happy vacation.

Same query as MaimMishra, how did the head lights handle the night ride?
Hi Raghu, it is not a vaction or fun trip, but an must do emergency trip

I think headlights were adequate. I hit the bad stretch between Davangere to Haveri between 6 PM to 7:30 PM. My headlights were adequate to spot what ever pot holes or diversions etc up to a distance of (may be) 300 meters plus. I think it is adequate to break the vehicle even when it is at 80-90 KMPH.
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