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Old 23rd July 2009, 16:46   #136
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[quote=opendro;1397487]So, diesels have more torque, and thus quicker in acceleration, but petrols make it up by keeping the average torque till a good range of rpm. If one would have to draw a power graph against rpm for both diesel and petrol engines, diesel will have steeper climb, but would fall very soon while petrol would still continue to climb.

I think you have a point. Diesels scorch the tarmac and take off. Petrols may be sluggish to start with but may catch up with diesels. But there is just one catch. We do not have un-inhabitated 100 Km straights like they have in Western Australia where you can put a brick on gas pedal and go to sleep. Here, in India you have to hit the brake pedal as regularily as you breathe, so technically petrols cannot catch up with diesels.
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Old 23rd July 2009, 18:54   #137
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Originally Posted by kuttapan View Post
Do you care? You will be part of a very exclusive club(compared to the Punto - many ownership threads now appearing). Anyone in this club booked the Asta(O) yet?
I have booked Asta(O). Just did the PDI and will get delivery in a week's time.
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Old 24th July 2009, 10:34   #138
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Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom View Post
Mistaken premise.

Torque is pulling power,and has nothing to do with acceleration.
Sorry for the off topic. Just to let Thad E Gunathom know, acceleration is nothing, but rate of change of velocity. What you said is also correct, torque means more pulling capabilty (intentionally avoided the use of the word power, which is rate of work done).

So, more torque can pull heavier mass. If we keep the weight of the vehicle constant, say, 1.2 ton, what would it mean to have more torque than 1.2 ton of car would require to move? Assume that x amount of torque is required to move this 1.2 ton car. Now, if you have 2x amount of torque for the same car, it would mean moving the car with much ease and thus quicker acceleration. How long the quick acceleration will continue depends on how long the torque remains in the rev-range, which is nothing but power (rpm * torque).

Last edited by opendro : 24th July 2009 at 10:35.
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Old 24th July 2009, 12:05   #139
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In simple words,
Torque- Strength eg. Weight lifter
Power(bhp) - Stamina eg. Marathon runner.
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Old 24th July 2009, 12:33   #140
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Without elaborating further,

torque = quick (how quickly reached a particular speed)
power = fast (high speed)

Beyond that, please google. Stamina is a little different. A 100m runner has more power (work done per unit time) than marathon runner.
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Old 24th July 2009, 14:05   #141
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Unhappy Bangalore - i20 CRDi waiting for RTO approval

I understand from my dealer that i20 diesel is still under RTO approval process and cant register my car. Now after rushing thro all the loan stuff and getting allotment of the car it is just getting difficult to wait for RTO

Do any body have an idea on how long does it take for an RTO approval?? BTW, any body else on BHP who is waiting for registration (i20 CRDi) in Bangalore
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Old 24th July 2009, 21:08   #142
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Well, I don't agree with opendro's interpretation, but I don't have the academic ability to argue the terms.

I can say, take my Swift DDI; torque, pulling power, is great. Acceleration is not so great.
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Old 24th July 2009, 23:10   #143
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Torque is the turning effect of force, and is measured as the Force multiplied by the perpendicular distance from the axis of rotation.

Diesel drivers might have noticed - if you release your clutch in 2nd gear without even stepping on the accelerator, the vehicle moves ahead on its own with a good amount of thrust - this does not happen with a petrol.

Ever noticed bus drivers simply letting a bus full of passengers simply pull on in 2nd or 3rd gear without stepping on the accelerator? That's torque.

The diesel engine, and consequently the drive connected to it, has the ability to 'turn the wheels' more than what a petrol engine can.

That's why you have diesel engines for buses and trucks, and not petrol.

So how does torque help acceleration? Simple. Since more torque means the engine has a higher ability to 'turn your wheels given whatever amount of load', it obviously results in a greater increase in engine / wheel rpm in a given amount of time, than a petrol engine. A higher rate of change of wheel rpm simply means greater acceleration!

Was that difficult?

Now that's why cars with similarly sized petrol engines are unable to overtake their turbodiesel counterparts!
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Old 25th July 2009, 00:00   #144
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I really can't understand why people make such stereotype comments going by hearsay? Has anyone driven a getz with upgraded rubber and pushed that car around to see how it handles. I can probably show worse handling cars than the getz that never get mentioned here at all. If you find it hard to fathom, kindly take a trip down to Bangalore and see the getz's in action for yourself. And this comes from a swift ddis owner. Given a chance I would take the Getz up Nandi Hills everyday and leave my swift behind in the basement. The getz is so much more fun, provided you know where the limits are and know how to drive that rocket!
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Old 25th July 2009, 09:14   #145
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Originally Posted by mclaren1885 View Post
I really can't understand why people make such stereotype comments going by hearsay? Has anyone driven a getz with upgraded rubber and pushed that car around to see how it handles. I can probably show worse handling cars than the getz that never get mentioned here at all. If you find it hard to fathom, kindly take a trip down to Bangalore and see the getz's in action for yourself. And this comes from a swift ddis owner. Given a chance I would take the Getz up Nandi Hills everyday and leave my swift behind in the basement. The getz is so much more fun, provided you know where the limits are and know how to drive that rocket!
Rahul.

Only people who own or have driven this car enough can appreciate this car.
Across the country, Getz CRDi were hardly available anywhere for TD which makes me wonder how ppl make baseless comments on the chassis being pathetic/funny/ ridiculous and what not without even driving it.

btw its a i20 crdi thread. Both of us are
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Old 25th July 2009, 11:18   #146
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hello guys just to mention it here,
most of the guys around here are taking for granted that the i20 crdi handles worse, chassis is not suited and all that stuff without even test driving it!.
are there guys around here who have test driven the i20 crdi and other hatches please do give an honest review!
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Old 25th July 2009, 16:26   #147
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Guys, gentle nudge : Please stick to the topic.
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Old 28th July 2009, 01:32   #148
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Default i20 CRDI - What is the catch?

i20 Crdi should be the king of diesel hatches in India. It is probably the safest(5* NCAP, 6 airbags, 4 discs, ABS and all that), looks are appealing to most(However, I fell for the Punto but my wife likes it) and nothing else(other than the Getz Crdi) can match it in performance. Interiors are pretty and well put together and it has a lot of features, albeit at a cost, in the top end model.

But I don't think it will be. Why, you may ask? One, the pricing makes sure that i20 is not going to be the best seller(compared to the Punto and Swift). And now, for the most important part - the car just doesn't inspire confidence on road.

I did two test drives, one in Bangalore and one in Pune. The first one was a scary experience. I did the test drive on the inner ring road, and in mildly damp conditions, the car squirmed and went almost out of control when doing a sudden lane change during turning. While I admit most people would not drive a car thus, this is something my Swift would have done with aplomb. Let truth be told, my Swift rode on Michelins and the test drive i20 on Apollo Acceleres and I believe there is no comparison.

The second one, in Pune was a longer affair and I really got to put the i20 through it's grind. I did not like it's suspension. It is stiff and all the road irregularities are made aware to the driver with appropriate acoustics for accompaniment. In particular, I didn't like the way it went over road humps. As I knew how it would perform during a sudden direction change, this time I deliberately provoked the car, by doing slalom lane changes(left-right-left) on a flyover while climbing, speeds in excess of 80 kmph (seat of the pants reading - speedo not working). It reacted as expected, tires immediately losing grip and car was all over the place. Another sharp turn at a moderate speed and the rear neatly swings out. Add the over-assisted, numb steering to the mix and you have what I call a 'dangerous tool in the hands of a novice'.

I have a feeling that the car itself may be good, the stupid steering notwithstanding, and that the Apollo Accelere's are the culprit. I would request the potential enthusiast(read - racer boy) owners to go for upgraded rubber and be fully accustomed to how the car behaves, lest they be caught off-guard.

These two drives put me off buying the i20. 6 weeks waiting period quoted was the final nail on the coffin. Which probably explains why a minimal grey Punto adorns my parking space currently.

DISCLAIMER:-
1. I have nothing against the i20, just wanted to give a heads up that, if all the power under the hood of the i20 is not used wisely, you may have the shiny side down. Hope Hyundai fans take this TD report at face value, and not be prejudiced by the fact that it has been posted by a (now) Fiat owner.

2. When I say I am disappointed with the handling of i20, I am comparing it with Swift DDiS only and not the Punto as I have only driven it for 200kms. However, from what I see, the Punto appears to be leagues ahead in road manners than the i20.

Let the brickbats flow.

Last edited by kuttapan : 28th July 2009 at 01:35. Reason: spelling
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Old 28th July 2009, 01:53   #149
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Wow another i20 bashing thread.
Have fun people.!


You could have just posted this in the i20 crdi test drive/launched thread instead of starting a new thread.

Quote:
Which probably explains why a minimal grey Punto adorns my parking space currently.
Aaaah that explains it all.

Last edited by faithless_1984 : 28th July 2009 at 01:55.
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Old 28th July 2009, 02:59   #150
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another thread to disgrace the i20 crdi

so you mean to say its a catch that the i20 cant do slalom changes at speeds in excess of 80kmph!! mainly that, then the high price!( this is not at all true. the car do is that costly and yes hyundai has worked real good to demand that premium for the image and reliabilty the hyundai has! not like the punto where in the review thread the thread poster goes on to show the parts that FELL OFF! jesus! What is FIAT upto??)

And Frankly your style of driving during the test drive is not something to be encouraged in any sense!!
I think its KNOWN AS RASH DRIVING!!. the other test drive thread mentions roads becoming Burnout Videogame so its better to have a punto then one can do slalom driving or ZIG ZAG??

why is it that i get the feeling Team-bhp is more or less having Boy racers or in in general guys who are more interested in high speed circus?? or is it only those who own Fiats??

this Forum is sending out the wrong picture Mods keep a check! and i think this thread doesnt hold much to say. better to close it than encouraging unwanted kind of driving.

i am for one betting that most of the newbies around here or those guys who are buying the punto or going through the threads will be getting the picture that getting the punto is having a virtual licence to be more agressive in taking corners in the highways and do slaloms and all. Christ!! this is not what a forum should be spreading!

dude seriously. did it appear to you that you would have taken that slalom in the same way you did with swift or punto?? what i meant is turn the steering in the same way??

i am pretty sure one who drives a verna will be doing a lane change in accordance with the feel of the steering , same thing goes for Getz, then i20, for each and every car depending on the Steering the driving Character has to change or get adapted!!.

and dude in a level road the slalom, its acceptable though not needed.
But you were really lucky to have done it going up a flyover!! and dont you know that there will torque steer besides the torque rush which will really make controlling the vehicle dangerous!! not just to you but to others on the road?

The magazine guyys do it because its their business to do it and get better ratings for their mags!! you on the other hand is deliberately doing it taking unwanted risk and then using that to the extent of degrading the vehicle too. Great Effort keep it up.

i feel that most of the Fiat threads or punto encouraging or hyundai bashing threads make a huge cry of the verna, getz, i20 all crdi cars with engines thats ages ahead in performance, being real bad at handling while all the ownership threads for both verna and getz and i20( very few though ) are saying that they are happy with it. ( i guess the simple explanation is that these are common guys or guys who are not boy racers?? )

Is all Fiat owners boy racers???i saw a post claiming that the S10 can cruise all day at 190kmph!! in the other test drive thread!! ( frankly whats these posts intended to spread? ) in which dream is all this possible??

Doesnt Team-Bhp encourage safe driving?? or its ok with Fiat drivers to post all about their high speed circus over here??

and Lastly the waiting period. you say that 6 weeks waiting period is a catch while people had to wait for 3months for the Swift DDiS ?? thats 12 weeks double the time period! so is the waiting period for the swift diesel also a catch??!

this thread is just going to become another thread like the many other threads to give a boost to punto . hehe.
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