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Old 15th July 2009, 02:14   #31
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Originally Posted by bkishore_77 View Post
Brakes are definitely a worry in wet or gravel surface. In my journey from Pune to B'lore, I had to brake hard on seeing the hump in the last minute and the car skidded a few meters in straight line. I guess this could be the leak in the rear brake cylinder which could have reulted in locking of the brake. This was replaced today. My safari brakes are much more confidence inspiring(it comes with abs).

As far as the deal, it is completely a white deal. . I paid 1.35 lacs.
Regarding the brakes - i thought as much. Suggest you tie that end up sooner than later.
WOW!!! That is a sweet deal! :-)

Last edited by Zensi : 15th July 2009 at 02:16.
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Old 15th July 2009, 02:19   #32
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Originally Posted by Zensi View Post
Regarding the brakes - i thought as much. Suggest you tie that end up sooner than later.
WOW!!! That is a sweet deal! :-)

That's a heck of a deal for a fantastic car. 1.6 Ltr Hatch? I still could not believe why Palio is not a blockbuster!
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Old 15th July 2009, 06:56   #33
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Originally Posted by bkishore_77 View Post
Brakes are definitely a worry in wet or gravel surface. In my journey from Pune to B'lore, I had to brake hard on seeing the hump in the last minute and the car skidded a few meters in straight line. I guess this could be the leak in the rear brake cylinder which could have reulted in locking of the brake. This was replaced today. My safari brakes are much more confidence inspiring(it comes with abs).
I have vowed to never talk about Fiats on this forum again in light of the heat that gets generated to even reasonable comment, however this was once my car, so I think I may be allowed an exception for this specific car
I would have only worried if the car had swung out under braking. Emergency braking is an art, and drivers have lost it with the advent of ABS. In many cases, a good driver will bring a non ABS equipped car to a halt in a shorter distance by modulating the pedal pressure in response to sensed traction loss, as compared to a ABS equipped car where all one can do is hit the pedal as hard as possible and rely on the ABS system efficacy. ABS serves the need of the mass market well though, by supporting average driving skills. Remember too that when we sing praises of how long the tyre lasts, there is a price to be paid somewhere, and traction on poor surfaces can be one. Of course, if the cylinder was leaking, that is a different matter. Btw, by how much was the fluid level down? I ask because I had gotten some cylinder in the brake system replacement charged to me in the last service 6 months ago, and given some of the bills I have been seeing in the past couple of years for the car, I believe that there is some aggresive profit center management going on. Or it could just be the age of the car, but I have not had the time to do the investigation to find out which one is the real reason.
PS: The bad news is that regardless of the reason, you will still lock up the wheels if you are not sensitive to what is happening at the contact patches. The good news is that it will make you a better driver over time.
PPS: Sweet deal? I think it was as all deals in life should be, that leave both parties thinking it was a good deal. I told Kishor to remember the low capital cost when the recurring maintenance bills come in, or whenever he is at the pump after a round of spirited driving, and to still maintain the right perspective on the deal after that! And that to my mind leads to the reason why the 1.6 GTX sold in limited numbers. It was a driving enthusiasts car among the very few such options at that price point in India, but it definitely not an eco commuter. Also, the car was sold via the Forum classifieds and the early bird got the worm!

Last edited by Sawyer : 15th July 2009 at 07:11. Reason: Postscripts
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Old 15th July 2009, 07:34   #34
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Another bit of information about the 1.6 GTX - in 2001, Fiat launched the 1.2 as well. In addition to the brilliant engine/tranny, the 1.6 was also given 14 inch alloys as opposed to the 13 inch steel rims on the 1.2, with lower profile tyres to leave the total dia unchanged. It was known that this would make for a harsher ride in the GTX, but the trade off would be better handling at the speeds that the GTX could reach. I suspect that there was something done to damping rates as well that accounted for some of this effect. The car was also tuned for performance and top end, which meant some traffic driveability issues. These were addressed to an extent in the S10 that came out in a few months, which probably was the Palio to own for an enthusiast. Who could keep his spirits up while the fuel needle visibly moved downwards from full.
Fiat made all the right moves, except in marketing and after sales. Just paying a cricketer a pile of money is not all that it takes, the virtues needed to be well communicated as well. The cars sold in truly large numbers all of the first year, and it looked like things were finally going well for the new Fiat in India...and here is where I shall stop, given the fact of my vow
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Old 15th July 2009, 09:54   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bkishore_77 View Post
So with the initial hurdle cleared, I had further talks with the owner Mr Kumar(Handle: cannedcarrot).
Quote:
Originally Posted by bkishore_77 View Post
Beats me. !! . Even I was not able to find it out from the user manual. Sawyer, could you enlighten us what it is.(He is the prev owner)
I thought cannedcarrots was the previous owner?

Anyway, now that your car is ship-shape, I guess you can frequent a good independent garage for future routine servicings [they do the same work for a lesser price] and go to the ASC only for jobs which need spares replacement.

Cheers,
Vikram
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Old 15th July 2009, 10:10   #36
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I thought cannedcarrots was the previous owner?
I was wondering how long it would take for someone to notice! I was never able to post on the site, but the classifieds were accessible. For some reason it does not really matter now. I was asked to reregister, hence the id change.
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Old 15th July 2009, 21:36   #37
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Originally Posted by mobike
Congrats Kishore, for that price it's daylight robbery
You saw Sawyer's reply for that. Even he feels he got a good deal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nishant_kingpin
I would recommend that you take good care of the car as it will demand some attention however, it will serve you good if you give it time.
Here's wishing you a pleasurable drive on this piece of art
Rest assured the car has changed hands from one over maintaining owner to another.

Quote:
Emergency braking is an art, and drivers have lost it with the advent of ABS. In many cases, a good driver will bring a non ABS equipped car to a halt in a shorter distance by modulating the pedal pressure in response to sensed traction loss, as compared to a ABS equipped car where all one can do is hit the pedal as hard as possible and rely on the ABS system efficacy. ABS serves the need of the mass market well though, by supporting average driving skills. if the cylinder was leaking, that is a different matter.
I beg to differ here. The modulating of the pedal pressure works fine when the obstacle for emergency braking is still moving(but slowing down rapidly). This is not true if the obstacle is stationery. I may be wrong but this is from my experience. Coz in case of a stationery obstacle, you need to come to a complete stop and i doubt anyone would lower the pressure on the pedal when close to the obstacle. So in this case it is almost a panic braking.

Whereas when the obstacle is moving it's much easier to modulate the pressure on the pedal and control the car since you don't have to bring the car to a complete halt. In the above case when the car skidded, I was lining myself to overtake the truck as truck started moving to the left for me to overtake in a two lane.(In one of the incomplete stretch where there is only 2 lane) . These truck driver obviously knew the road well and he passed through a opening where there was no hump and since I was accelerating to overtake this truck, I saw the hump in the last moment and I had to brake pretty hard. That's how the car skidded. There was no time to modulate the pressure of anything . Just simple plain hard braking. . We usually depend on the speed of the vehicles ahead for any hint of obstacles but in this case I was deceived.

Quote:
Btw, by how much was the fluid level down? I ask because I had gotten some cylinder in the brake system replacement charged to me in the last service 6 months ago,!
Yes. There was visible leak to warrant a replacement
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Old 15th July 2009, 22:12   #38
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Originally Posted by bkishore_77 View Post
You saw Sawyer's reply for that. Even he feels he got a good deal.
......

I beg to differ here. The modulating of the pedal pressure works fine when the obstacle for emergency braking is still moving(but slowing down rapidly). This is not true if the obstacle is stationery. I may be wrong but this is from my experience. Coz in case of a stationery obstacle, you need to come to a complete stop and i doubt anyone would lower the pressure on the pedal when close to the obstacle. So in this case it is almost a panic braking.
As a current owner - I think it is a steal!

Sawyer is right. Try it - just standing on the pedal Vs. Easing off and pressing again - repeatedly. Trust me - the latter cuts short the braking distance and prevents skids.

Cheers,
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Old 15th July 2009, 22:17   #39
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Originally Posted by bkishore_77 View Post

I beg to differ here.
Lets agree to disagree. Consider this too - in an exactly equivalent ABS equipped car in the exact same circumstances, where all you could have done was stood on the brakes and prayed,the car would not have skidded, but it also may have overshot the barrier. Or not. Can't say either with certainty after the event.
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Old 15th July 2009, 22:43   #40
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Originally Posted by Ravveendrra View Post
Sawyer is right. Try it - just standing on the pedal Vs. Easing off and pressing again - repeatedly. Trust me - the latter cuts short the braking distance and prevents skids.

Cheers,
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sawyer View Post
Lets agree to disagree. Consider this too - in an exactly equivalent ABS equipped car in the exact same circumstances, where all you could have done was stood on the brakes and prayed,the car would not have skidded, but it also may have overshot the barrier. Or not. Can't say either with certainty after the event.

I agree - having driven an ABS equipped Accord last couple of years - I think, i could do a better job and cut down breaking distance without it. With ABS - i feel scared - i dont get as much control as I possibly could, but then someone already pointed out - ABS benefits the "aam junta" (Common Public).
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Old 16th July 2009, 10:28   #41
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Originally Posted by Ravveendrra View Post
Sawyer is right. Try it - just standing on the pedal Vs. Easing off and pressing again - repeatedly. Trust me - the latter cuts short the braking distance and prevents skids.
Is this what is also called pumping of the brakes? Also, what should be the duration that you hold the brake down? Press-hold for 2 secs-release, or a fast continuous press-release, press-release? Does this deteriorate the brake pads more vis-a-vis just plain hard braking?

Sorry if answering this seems like stating the obvious to you, but it would help me a lot as a majority of my driving is on the NH4. Till now [luckily] I haven't had to do any serious emergency braking, but this will definitely come in handy when I have to do it.

Cheers,
Vikram

Last edited by comfortablynumb : 16th July 2009 at 10:45. Reason: Added brake pads question
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Old 16th July 2009, 13:50   #42
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Originally Posted by Ravveendrra View Post
... remember that the 1.6 develps max torque at 4250 rpm and max power at 5500 bhp. ...
So, for purely spirited driving (without worrying about FE), should one upshift at 4250 rpm or 5500 rpm and why?
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Old 16th July 2009, 14:14   #43
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my my that looks like a well maitained Palio GTX.... very very hard to find these days!
Sweet deal!
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Old 17th July 2009, 01:09   #44
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Originally Posted by khan_sultan View Post
So, for purely spirited driving (without worrying about FE), should one upshift at 4250 rpm or 5500 rpm and why?
I would think one would shift up at 5500 rpm (and try to keep the revs at 4250).

Since power = torque X rpm, after peak power is achieved it means the torque is falling so drastically that it is, in a manner of speaking, actually pulling back the car.

Keeping the tacho at the peak torque figure means you are getting maximum push from the engine which in theory is the most efficient use of the engine, not necessarily the most fuel efficient as efficiency here includes speed.

Cheers,
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Old 17th July 2009, 13:57   #45
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Congrats Kishore! was wondering all the while if you boght the car or not

Car looks to e in a amazing shape and also the price...

Have fun and lest meet up sometime, want to drive the beast
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