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Old 15th January 2010, 11:23   #61
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PS is definitely harder than Santro or any other PS in same range, partially due to broader tyres, and EPS is crazy, has its own mind

If bubble does not disappear in couple of days, then its not good, get it replaced.

Regarding the off centric steering, it should not cause arm pain, unless its causing the car to steer right or left. In that case you will have to get the wheel alignment adjusted.

In anycase, I did felt the same pain initially, because I felt that I have to hold steering tight and straight to keep the car on track. but with time I have adjusted and I am pretty comfortable now

FE of 9-10 with 100% ACC is fine, Should improve a little after first and second service, but do not expect much.

Max I have got with 100% ACC is 12 Km/L

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Originally Posted by DigitalDragon View Post
Also the steering is slightly harder. Guys is it the way it is in SX4 ? or is it because of EPS or because of my 215 size tyre ? All these observations are directly in comparison with the Santro I had earlier.

I am seeing lots of small dotted bubbles across the sides and rear. Dealer guy told it will go off as the films get dried. Is it true ?

Any idea if the suspension could be made a bit softer ?

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Originally Posted by DigitalDragon View Post
Windscreen Gurus ! Need your expert feedback on the bubble part as mentioned in my last post.

Yesterday I had a mini-long drive to Nandi Hills. With 4 adults packed SX4 could pull it throughout in 2nd / 3rd gear except during the last steep slopes, where I used 1st gear couple of times. Now I am happy that the pulling problem as I mentioned earlier has gone with more running of the car.

Measured FE for the 2nd time. This time it is 9 kmpl as against 10 I got during 1st tank fill. All in city with AC on 100 % with the same BP unleaded petrol. Is it normal to decrease first and increase again (expecting) ?

Somwhow I feel the steering is a bit off-centric. This I noticed by keeping the steering level exactly at the incstrument cluster top portion (the curved plastic part). Anybody has tried this? May be this is the reason I am getting pain on the right arm after an hour long drive.

Fornax/ Abhi and others - are you feeling any such pain ? Please post your experience so that I can talk to the dealer service person, if it is a common type of problem.

Last edited by rkbharat : 15th January 2010 at 11:25.
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Old 15th January 2010, 12:08   #62
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Originally Posted by rkbharat View Post
PS is definitely harder than Santro or any other PS in same range, partially due to broader tyres, and EPS is crazy, has its own mind

If bubble does not disappear in couple of days, then its not good, get it replaced.

Regarding the off centric steering, it should not cause arm pain, unless its causing the car to steer right or left. In that case you will have to get the wheel alignment adjusted.

In anycase, I did felt the same pain initially, because I felt that I have to hold steering tight and straight to keep the car on track. but with time I have adjusted and I am pretty comfortable now

FE of 9-10 with 100% ACC is fine, Should improve a little after first and second service, but do not expect much.

Max I have got with 100% ACC is 12 Km/L
Thanks Bharat.

The car is not pulling to any side. What I meant by offcentric is that the steering is not fixed exactly along the middle of the seat. Glad to know that the arm pain will go off with time. I am also feeling that I have to work hard on the steering to move along.

On the sun film, i am not sure whether i will call them as bubbles - they are tiny dot dot spots where the solution did not come out, but the numbers are more. Is it normal ?

for FE, If I get 12, I will be more than happy as I was getting the same with my Santro.
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Old 15th January 2010, 13:52   #63
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Windscreen Gurus ! Need your expert feedback on the bubble part as mentioned in my last post.
Did you notice the bubbles a while after they'd put the sun-film? If that's the case yes they should disappear. The sun-film is usually pressed hard and there shouldn't be any bubble immediately

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Originally Posted by DigitalDragon View Post
Yesterday I had a mini-long drive to Nandi Hills. With 4 adults packed SX4 could pull it throughout in 2nd / 3rd gear except during the last steep slopes, where I used 1st gear couple of times. Now I am happy that the pulling problem as I mentioned earlier has gone with more running of the car.
Glad its' working as per your expectation, lets just call the earlier observation an exception. My guess (for the earlier experience) is slight pressure on the clutch which may have kept the car from delivering full power.

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Originally Posted by DigitalDragon View Post
Measured FE for the 2nd time. This time it is 9 kmpl as against 10 I got during 1st tank fill. All in city with AC on 100 % with the same BP unleaded petrol. Is it normal to decrease first and increase again (expecting) ?
That's a tad low IMHO, but its' bound to go up by atleast 10-15% after the first service. Two possible checkpoints - 1. The pulling and 2. The tyre pressure. Please experiment a bit.

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Originally Posted by DigitalDragon View Post
Somwhow I feel the steering is a bit off-centric. This I noticed by keeping the steering level exactly at the incstrument cluster top portion (the curved plastic part).
I'd say dont wait for the first service, as its' still 300Kms away, that will do some harm to the tyres if the steering is off center. The reason for it being off center could be the tyre-alignment or the steering itself. So get it checked asap - tommorrows' a weekend right?

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Originally Posted by DigitalDragon View Post
Anybody has tried this? May be this is the reason I am getting pain on the right arm after an hour long drive.
Fornax/ Abhi and others - are you feeling any such pain ? Please post your experience so that I can talk to the dealer service person, if it is a common type of problem.
Mine is - so far - aligned to the center. Also, if its' slightly off, then it will exert a fair amount of pressure on your arms, especially on curves. This needs to be rectificed at the earliest.

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Originally Posted by DigitalDragon View Post
The car is not pulling to any side. What I meant by offcentric is that the steering is not fixed exactly along the middle of the seat. Glad to know that the arm pain will go off with time. I am also feeling that I have to work hard on the steering to move along.
Its' perhaps the same, as the steering in the center would mean the car veers off to the side. I honestly dont think the steering is off center, rather its' something else.

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Originally Posted by DigitalDragon View Post
On the sun film, i am not sure whether i will call them as bubbles - they are tiny dot dot spots where the solution did not come out, but the numbers are more. Is it normal ?

for FE, If I get 12, I will be more than happy as I was getting the same with my Santro.
Can you check your gear-shifts too, I think 2500 rpm shift ought to fetch you around 10-11 to begin with, going upto 12 after 1st service.

Cheers - Happy Driving!

Last edited by Fornax : 15th January 2010 at 13:56.
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Old 15th January 2010, 14:03   #64
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Originally Posted by DigitalDragon View Post

I am seeing lots of small dotted bubbles across the sides and rear. Dealer guy told it will go off as the films get dried. Is it true ?

Any idea if the suspension could be made a bit softer ?
give it a week to go away most of the bubbles should disappear in that time. otherwise go back to your dealer.

btw for things like hid voiding warranty it all depends on your relationship with the dealer. on my getz, i had a conical air filter and a free flow exhaust installed and we still managed to get some parts changed under warranty. also the k&n filter, if its a stock replacement will not void warranty, since it is of the same size and specs as the oe filter.
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Old 22nd January 2010, 11:51   #65
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Default First Service Over

Many thnigs to update - but time was the constraint. Well...quite a few things wanted to share since the last update of 1000 Kms.

Went on a real long drive to Yelagiri (it was a T-BHP meet drive), around 180 km one side, with approx 25 kms uphill.

Overall Performance:
The beast performed quite well upto the expectation. On the NH 7, i was unable to know when the speedo has crossed 120. It was pretty hard for me to keep the speed within 100-110 as the first service was still due. As many others have experienced the stalling problem, this time I did not experience a single instance of stalling. I was able to take the car up with mostly 2nd/3rd with some places in 1st - This was not a very steep slope. However, my final judgement is SX4 definitely lacks low end torque. I have to live with it.

Power Steering Response:
I would vote for Hydraulic PS anyday vis-a-vis EPS. Sometimes I did feel a MISS in the POWER of the steering, especially on sharp turning, with very low speed.

As far as the steering off-centricity is concerned, the dealer service managers say its perfectly alright. However, I still feel there is slight off-centricity. This I confirmed after checking with 3 other SX4's'. They say whatever I have is my perception, also it looks like this because of my broader tyres. Is it anyway linked to the tyre - even after an alignment and balancing ?

I would be grateful, if any Fellow BHPians in Bangalore could check and vouch on the same. Please PM me and we shall co-ordinate.

I have found a self-remedy to my arm pain. I am keeping the neck rest pillow on the door hand rest portion and resting my elbow on it while driving, which has actually worked.

Sun-Film Performance:
After reading lot of posts on the windshield sun-film thread, I thought I will update my experience too - the 3M CR 70 in the front DID adequate job of shileding heat. There is a definite improvement in terms of % of heat getting inside. Of course not in the tune of 50 % as claimed by the company, in reality its difficult to gauge a no. but may be somewhere around 30 % heat rejected. Also the side & rear nanolux were quite effective. The VLT is 40 % but in reality this is much transparent and hence increases the visibility.

@akshay1234: I showed the bubbles to the installer. Initial reaction was that is normal - 5 % /10 % bubbles will be there. After a hard discussion they agreed to re-fit the films. But I feel if they remove and re-fit the films, the film itself might get damaged. Also as the installer is same he will have the bubbles again, as I saw all the cars sunfilm installed by the person have similar quantity of bubbles. Point is I paid almost 1200 Rs. extra just to fit it at the dealer to avoid any warranty issues with the ECM getting damaged etc.

Anybody has any experience of removing and re-fitting the same sun film again ?

@Fornax - The bubbles were right from the beginning when the film was getting installed. The guy said it will dry up in 2 days.

First Service:

I feel the car has become noticeably smooth after the first service. Right from the gear shift to engine noise, freeness in the steering, overall performance etc. have improved. Need to check for the FE now. There were 2 rattlings - one was from the front left side - a typical jhumka type of sound. Dealer service guy said, its taken care. I notice though it has reduced to a great extent, its still there and sounds very rarely. The 2nd sound was most probably the back seat squeaking sound which has gone now. Asked if the suspension could be made a bit softer - NOT possible they say. The cleaning job was very bad and i outightly said I will give you very poor rating. Immediately the service manager arranged for a spring clean (in their words - I felt i could have done a better job myself). Total invoice value was below 1800 (some 17XX), with oil and oil filter change.

Wobbling Issue:

The rear left wheel, I felt was having some wobbling - visibly. However, they showed me with instrument (fitted to the wheel hub plate) that it was within permissible limit. I am still confused, then why the wheel when fitted is wobbling. More shockingly he showed me at least 3 cars (one ritz, one swift and one 800 - all almost new) that the wobbling IS there in all cars. Is it stadard in maruti or standard with all cars ? I never checked it though in my santro, honestly.
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Old 22nd January 2010, 13:28   #66
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Originally Posted by DigitalDragon View Post
On the NH 7, i was unable to know when the speedo has crossed 120. It was pretty hard for me to keep the speed within 100-110 as the first service was still due.
DD, I can understand how much you were missing the speed.This might have reminded you of santro where you were not coming below 120.Right?
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Old 3rd February 2010, 13:08   #67
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Default Car seating ergonomics

I have mentioned earlier somewhere in the thread regarding the SX4 seat and my incompatibility with the same for which I am getting a pain on the right shoulder and now headache.

I was going through the web on seat adjustment and found the attached article quite informative. Posting it for all.

@Mods: Please move this to appropriate thread, if this is not the right place.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf vehicle ergonomics and best practice guide.pdf (740.4 KB, 471 views)
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Old 3rd February 2010, 13:48   #68
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Originally Posted by DigitalDragon View Post
Anybody has any experience of removing and re-fitting the same sun film again ?
The same film cannot be re-fitted, as far as I know. One needs to remove the film, clean the glass extensively, and then fit a new one.

Excessive bubbles happen due to poor workmanship. I had similar experience where the dealer fitted new film once I objected the quality of the job done. You better supervise the job.
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Old 3rd February 2010, 14:00   #69
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Originally Posted by WhiteKnight View Post
The same film cannot be re-fitted, as far as I know. One needs to remove the film, clean the glass extensively, and then fit a new one.

Excessive bubbles happen due to poor workmanship. I had similar experience where the dealer fitted new film once I objected the quality of the job done. You better supervise the job.
Thanks for the info. Even i feel the same. Unfortunately if i ask the dealer he will remove it and even if he fits a new one, the same problem will happen as the installer is the same. I did watch while they initially fitted and he tried his best - may be because of the instruments they use it did not work well or may be he does not know the proper way of fitting. Hence i did not insist on removing the one; on the other side they might make some scratches on the glass again while cleaning it.
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Old 4th February 2010, 21:08   #70
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Originally Posted by DigitalDragon View Post
However, my final judgement is SX4 definitely lacks low end torque. I have to live with it.
Thanks buddy, for reiterating my belief!

Exactly the reason for not adding SX4 to my list of shortlisted cars for near future buy. In fact that point is a deal breaker for me!
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Old 4th February 2010, 21:09   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WhiteKnight View Post
The same film cannot be re-fitted, as far as I know. One needs to remove the film, clean the glass extensively, and then fit a new one.

Excessive bubbles happen due to poor workmanship. I had similar experience where the dealer fitted new film once I objected the quality of the job done. You better supervise the job.
Bubbles also appear when there is dust entrapped between the glass and the film. A little bit of air also get trapped with it and with the heat of the sun it keeps expanding and the bubble only gets bigger. Suggest, you ask the dealer to redo the job with a new film. Be firm and teel its a s***ty job he has done an that you will not accept this type of work.

If thats not possible, take a sharp sewing needle and pierce a minute hole on the bubble an squeeze the film with your Credit card wrapped in a handkerchief.

So long.....
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Old 5th February 2010, 13:04   #72
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Bubbles also appear when there is dust entrapped between the glass and the film. A little bit of air also get trapped with it and with the heat of the sun it keeps expanding and the bubble only gets bigger. Suggest, you ask the dealer to redo the job with a new film. Be firm and teel its a s***ty job he has done an that you will not accept this type of work.

If thats not possible, take a sharp sewing needle and pierce a minute hole on the bubble an squeeze the film with your Credit card wrapped in a handkerchief.

So long.....
Thanks Varun.. Will try your advice.
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Old 5th February 2010, 13:25   #73
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Hi DD,

Can you post some pics of the bubbles ? As i have seen, however carefull the installers are , some bubbles will always be present.
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Old 5th February 2010, 20:32   #74
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[quote]
Quote:
Originally Posted by DigitalDragon View Post
One more observation on the CAR - The rear left wheel is slightly wobbling. Got this observation while I was checking the rotation of the wheels to find if there is any jam in the disc brakes. Tyre people said its because of Rim. MASS said its because of tyre. Asked MASS to check with a different set of tyre and rim. The problem was still there. They could not sort out the issue that day. Promised that they will check everything during the first service. Although the wheel alignment report shows everything is within limit. But I can still see the visible wobbling, which MASS also acknowledged. Any answer ?
Could be a very small problem. On the sidewall of the tyres you will find a 4mm beading running all around just where the tyre touches the Rim. There shoud be a uniform gap between the Rim and this beading. However just to be sure you could do the following. 1) Deflate the tyre by releasing the air in it. 2) refill air to almost 30-40% more than the required pressure. 3. Reduce the pressure to the desired level. You can do this with either the tyre fitted on to the car or by removing it. If this does set the problem right then..... Jack up the car, loosen all nuts of the defective wheel, remove the Disc, change position and re-tighten the nuts.

This is the most important process of removing and refitting a wheel and most technicians and mechanics are either ignorant of carelees about it. If possible screw on the nuts with your hands as far as possible. If you feel this is not possible, use your wheel spanner and tighten nuts till you feel the slightest resistance.Once you have finished doing this with all the nuts, tighten Nuts in the following order. Nut No. 1-3-2-4 for a four nut wheel and Nut No. 1-3-5-2-4 for a five nut wheel. You can give an imaginary No. to the nuts in clockwise or anti-clockwise direction. Now remove the Jack and Tighten all the nuts in the same manner shown above. By doing you will avoid that small possibility of an imperfect fit that leads to a wobble at high speeds.
Weight Balancing of all the wheels is the most important part of the maintenance schedule and one should give it the same priority as an Engine Oil change, if not more.


Quote:
Few accessory additions are yet to happen :[list=1][*]Sun Film - I am a bit cautious about putting 40 % VLT films all around except front windshield. The shade is brownish and suits the beige color. Will there be any probelm for the 40 % VLT in Bangalore from COP perspective ? Otherwise how about 50 %, including rear ?
Go ahead in Bangalore, Nobody will bother you here, especially the cops. They wouldn't know the difference between 10 & 100 %

Quote:
[*]Where can I get a TL puncture kit and how much it should cost me ?
Unless you are conversant in using one its no point in having one. With tube less tyres you can drive for over 50 Kms. and I sure you will fin a repairer in that period. It does not cost much. A good one will cost about 350 Rs. I have
one since 2004 and I haven't used it even once.

Quote:
[*]Planning to buy a vacuum cleaner too.
Car Vacumn cleaners are a joke, unless you want to clean the ashtrays, which anyway are removal ones these days. Instead invest in a good one or your home. They not only give exceptional results in car cleaning but are cheaper in the long run.

Quote:
[*]Is it a good idea to consider K&N filter at this moment ? Will it increase the performance / FE ?
Not a bad idea if you need that extra Zip at the cost of a considerable lower FE. That is if you Zoom. But about a KM less with normal driving.

Enjoy.......

So long.....

Last edited by varunroy : 5th February 2010 at 20:47.
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Old 7th February 2010, 23:43   #75
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Originally Posted by DigitalDragon View Post
...However, my final judgement is SX4 definitely lacks low end torque. I have to live with it...
It's insufficient to put it more aptly, but havent' you tried half-clutch? On green, I've never found myself lagging behind a Santo or a Corolla or even an Octy..

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Originally Posted by breezydrive View Post
Thanks buddy, for reiterating my belief!

Exactly the reason for not adding SX4 to my list of shortlisted cars for near future buy. In fact that point is a deal breaker for me!
Please let us know your chosen alternative, frankly at this price range whatever you've chosen is more likely to be a "deal-breaker" to (current and potential) SX4 owners.

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Car Vacumn cleaners are a joke, unless you want to clean the ashtrays, which anyway are removal ones these days. Instead invest in a good one or your home. They not only give exceptional results in car cleaning but are cheaper in the long run.
+1, a 10-rupee mop would give much better result.
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