Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP India > Team-BHP Reviews > Test-Drives & Initial Ownership Reports


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 1st January 2010, 12:46   #1
BHPian
 
srisha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 165
Thanked: Once
Default My New Safari 2.2 and issues already

After a long wait, I finally decided to go for a new Safari 2.2 EX model. I have been a Safari fan for a long time and also owned the older 1998 model for a couple of years and sold it in 2005.

I bought this car on 16th Dec and took off to Salem and Tiruppur on 18th Dec for the weekend and thoroughly enjoyed the drive on wide beautiful roads. Kept an average speed of 100-120kms and at one strech between Dharmapuri and Krishnagiri touched a speed 160 kms for a very short period. In this trip I got an average of about 10km per litre. At the end of the trip I had finished 800kms.

The next few days, the vehicle was at rest at home since I had another trip to coastal Karnataka coming during the Christmas weekend.

We started the drive on 24th Dec to a beach resort in Koteshwar, which is about 450kms from Bangalore. Started at 1630 and took a break in Shimogga since I had kids and didnt want to drive the entire strech and poor road conditions.

We spent the weekend there and started our drive back to Bangalore on 28th December. We started at 1000am and reached the NICE road at Tumkur road around 0800pm. By this time, I had clocked 1800 kms.

The trouble started from here, while driving on the Nice road, the engine stopped abruptly without any noise. I slowly managed to park it by the side of the road. Didnt know what to do now, I check the fuel guage and the needle was nearing the reserve, and I assumed this must have been because of less diesel and possible air sucked into the fuel pump.

The great poor Tata After Sales Service starts from here, called the helpline number (road side assistance) sticked on the windshield only to know that the number was for Indica only. The person gives me another number and I call and is attended by a person called Tulsi. He gives me some directions to fill some diesel and pump the air out. Followed the direction but un successful, the engine doest fire, it cranks but didnt start. Called the same person again, and now he says 5 litres of Diesel in not sufficient and fill another 10 litres. We fill it with another 12 litres but no success, it still the same issue, cranks but doesnt start. I called the same guy again, and asked him to come and check the car, he claims to be out of the city which I for some reason could not believe him. He now asks me to tow the car to the nearest Tata service station and I refused until I have some one come and check the car. By this time, It was around 11pm and i had my family with kids and infants still in the car. This guy was so unhelpful didnt even provide me with any other technicians number.

I started checking the dealer and service network number provided by Tata and found another roadside assistance number and called this guy named Srinivas, he also suggested me to check the fuel pump to see if the diesel was flowing or not and I did every possible test and the result was still the same and requested this guy to come and check the car. He obliged and arrived at around 1200am and spent an hour checking everything possible but was unsuccessful and we decided to tow the car to the service station. By this time I sent my family in another taxi. The tow truck arrived at around 1am and took it to Concorde Kengeri service station. Finished all formalities and reached home around 0230am.

This whole experience was so horrifying and Tata service added to the trauma and unhelpful people in the middle of the night.

If you thought, everything went fine after this. No, it was even more horrible. Tata spent the next two days 29th and 30th Dec on the car to diagnose the problem but were not successful. The ECU when connected to their laptop was not reading and didnt respond, so we didnt know what the issue was. During these two days, Tata didnt even call me to update, and it was me who had call them at regular intervals to check the status and some times the service engineer mobile was switched off

Finally, I receive a call on the 31st, and the service engineer reports the issue - "Due to a wiring disconnection and some earthing issues with the ECU wiring harness" and said the problem is now rectified and will be delivered by evening.

I waited till 7pm in the evening, but the delivery didnt happend. I recieve a call at around 730pm and says the car will be at my residence in the next 45 minutes. Since I had to leave for a New year eve party, I asked him to deliver the car the next day.

Today 1st Jan 2010, I receive a call around 1000am and the driver says he is leaving in the next 15 minutes and the car will be delivered by 1130, I the receive another call around 11am and the car again broke down on the way with the same issues and had to be towed back to the service station. Today being a holiday, I will only know tomorrow on the issue.

With all this, I have lost faith in the car now and dont know what can I do now. Suggestions from the members are welcome on

how can I take this up with Tata?

Can I demand for a change in the car?

Will i have to go through a lot of mental trauma to fight this out with Tata?

Does anybody have the contact information of Tata senior management to escalate this issue to them?


I will post the pix later

Srisha
srisha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st January 2010, 13:40   #2
BANNED
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: chandigarh,melbourne
Posts: 598
Thanked: 235 Times
Default

Hi srisha. Not the best start to the year i say. Its really unfortunate to know that what was supposed to be a thread showcasing your new set of wheels is actually a distress cal for help. In my opinion you should just ask tata to change your car and give you a new car. This is just not acceptable that a brand new car has a complete break down with in weeks of the purchase. Two of my friends have had similar experiences with their safari and this has made me a very strong hater of the brand.Tata has been selling these junk of passenger cars for way to long and i think you should not settle for anything less then a complete replacement of the car. Have a clear word with the owner of the dealership and tell him that you want a replacement. Move to the court if they refuse to honour your claim. A legal action should definitely be on your to do list.This is too much of a mental harassment.

Last edited by bigron : 1st January 2010 at 13:55.
bigron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st January 2010, 13:57   #3
Senior - BHPian
 
arnabchak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: MH-04
Posts: 1,319
Thanked: 1,083 Times
Default

The consumer court is the best resort to such cases.

I guess the demand for a new car is certainly valid under these circumstances.
A new car breaking down twice within weeks of the purchase is not acceptable.

I recall a very recent case of how a retired person won a case against GM when the Forester purchased by him under pretext of a SUV was very car like.

Sorry. Could not locate the link here.
arnabchak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st January 2010, 14:28   #4
BHPian
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 139
Thanked: 8 Times
Default

I think practically no company can give you a new car for this reason. The only thing that that you can put pressure on is to repair it and ask them to make sure that it does not breakdown . All the best for you and your Safari
vinu_pm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st January 2010, 15:17   #5
Senior - BHPian
 
MileCruncher's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 3,992
Thanked: 356 Times
Default

Hey srisha, sorry to hear about your Safari. Seems to be an issue with the electricals more than the engine. You may not like this, but legally you don't have a case for replacement of your car. What I would suggest is getting in touch with TM personnel in Bangalore (not just dealer staff) and letting them know your vehicle's performance. You should also impress upon them to change under warranty any offending part rather than repair. Once the vehicle comes back after repair from the workshop, if the problem exists then you can seek further action.
MileCruncher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st January 2010, 16:06   #6
BHPian
 
akhilesh51's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Jaipur, RAJ
Posts: 627
Thanked: 320 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vinu_pm View Post
I think practically no company can give you a new car for this reason. The only thing that that you can put pressure on is to repair it and ask them to make sure that it does not breakdown . All the best for you and your Safari
Quote:
Originally Posted by MileCruncher View Post
Hey srisha, sorry to hear about your Safari. Seems to be an issue with the electricals more than the engine. You may not like this, but legally you don't have a case for replacement of your car. What I would suggest is getting in touch with TM personnel in Bangalore (not just dealer staff) and letting them know your vehicle's performance. You should also impress upon them to change under warranty any offending part rather than repair. Once the vehicle comes back after repair from the workshop, if the problem exists then you can seek further action.
+1. A very very unfortunate incident but consumer court may not be the best way to approach this matter since legally company is not bound to change the vehicle.

On the other hand, contact the Bangalore Area office Customer Service Manager and explain the issue. Contrary to popular beliefs, Tata actually has a very strong Support network within the company and they will certainly help you and maybe even compensate you for the troubles cause. I can enlist umpteenth cases where vehicles have been thoroughly checked in presence of Tata personnel and good compensation being provided to customer from Tata.

The key here is to be supportive and positive in conversations and show an honest approach by providing whatever facts they ask. hammering them with requests of new car or persistently being impolite or offensive could harm your own self.

Once again, It is a very unfortunate incident and I must admit you would be very irritated and feeling down but my suggestion would be to make a sincere effort to reach a positive conclusion and who knows this vehicle could service you for many good times like many happy forum members including myself.
akhilesh51 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st January 2010, 18:05   #7
v&v
Senior - BHPian
 
v&v's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Delhi
Posts: 1,538
Thanked: 1,068 Times
Default

Hi srisha,
Very sad to know what happened with you.

i feel firstly you should get hold of the Gm / Works manager , get the first hand info.
If you can take leave from office, then be with your vehicle show your concern.
I feel to get work done, you need to be after their life.

Since you are following up with them on phone, they are giving priority to other vehicle.
If you have a Job card, still you are not getting the desired result, Get hold of zonal manager speak to him and also fire a email from the tata website and follow up.D

Be after them and get you problem resolved. First find the cause of problem, then you can think of replacement or other course of action
v&v is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st January 2010, 18:42   #8
BHPian
 
bj96's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Pune
Posts: 779
Thanked: 127 Times
Default

Agree, not a pleasant start on a new car and new year. However, here are some observations I made based on your post. Texts marked in bold.

Quote:
Originally Posted by srisha View Post
I bought this car on 16th Dec and took off to Salem ... Kept an average speed of 100-120kms and at one strech ... touched a speed 160 kms for a very short period. In this trip I got an average of about 10km per litre. At the end of the trip I had finished 800kms.
...
called the helpline number (road side assistance) sticked on the windshield..

I started checking the dealer and service network number provided by Tata
1. You did not follow run-in procedure? The average returned (10 kmpl) on a highway run, shows that you had done some real ripping of the new engine. Testing max speed and sustained speeds above 100 km/h on a new motor for long stretches does not go well. I believe in old school of being gentle with the motor for first 1-2000 kms etc.

2. The number stuck on windshield is usually the number of the Dealer's workshop (based on my experience with Maruti, Hyundai and Tata in Pune) who sold you the car. This number is useful only within municipal limits or near about unless you know someone personally there.

Tata has tied up with TVS service (toll free# 1800 209 7979) for 24x7 breakdown service. When out on a highway away from city, I will rest my faith on this toll free call centre first than calling the dealer- who most probably on a holiday/after hours had minimum staff on duty + they may not have network outside the city to help. Enrollment to this 24x7 service is free for cars sold in 2009+.

Hope you get back your car just fine. Don't jump into temptation of courts/legal fight etc. It will be more hassle and less gain. You will not get a "new" car for sure. The issue will be fixed by TML. Talk to TML customer helpline directly if you are unhappy with TASS. Tata Motors Customer Care :: Home

One question?
You mention that you reached 1800kms during your journey. Didn't you do first service between 1000-1500 kms? Did they drain engine oil? If not you should replace engine oil immediately.

-BJ

Last edited by bj96 : 1st January 2010 at 19:00. Reason: servicing question
bj96 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st January 2010, 19:57   #9
BHPian
 
1-Testosterone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Amritsar
Posts: 388
Thanked: 37 Times
Default

Very unfortunate buddy. This was the main reason I never went for SAFARI after my TATA INDICA. The real problem is How TATA handles your problem after the breakdown. But for a new SUV (Tough One...Huh) to break down, it's not at all acceptable (Even if you haven't adhered to initial RUN-IN period of 2000 Km!)

Good luck to their future vehicles which may boast of multiple ECU's and all; If they gonna behave like this, good luck to their owners! They seriously need to concentrate on their A$$ (including emergencies) more than they do for their vehicles.

This is some 10th time I'm reading a horror story of BRAND NEW SAFARI owner.
1-Testosterone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st January 2010, 20:08   #10
BHPian
 
srisha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 165
Thanked: Once
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by akhilesh51 View Post
+1. A very very unfortunate incident but consumer court may not be the best way to approach this matter since legally company is not bound to change the vehicle.
Quote:
Originally Posted by akhilesh51 View Post

True, I have spoken to many people and approaching consumer court is not the best options, since Tata is is repairing these at free of cost, since the vehicle is under warranty.

The key here is to be supportive and positive in conversations and show an honest approach by providing whatever facts they ask. hammering them with requests of new car or persistently being impolite or offensive could harm your own self.

I have been very calm and never shown my frustration because I still need them at the end of the day and dont like to spoil my relationship.

Once again, It is a very unfortunate incident and I must admit you would be very irritated and feeling down but my suggestion would be to make a sincere effort to reach a positive conclusion and who knows this vehicle could service you for many good times like many happy forum members including myself.


Very true, I still trust this vehicle and i still have the same passion I had before purchasing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bj96 View Post
Agree, not a pleasant start on a new car and new year. However, here are some observations I made based on your post. Texts marked in bold.



1. You did not follow run-in procedure? The average returned (10 kmpl) on a highway run, shows that you had done some real ripping of the new engine. Testing max speed and sustained speeds above 100 km/h on a new motor for long stretches does not go well. I believe in old school of being gentle with the motor for first 1-2000 kms etc.

I was not told by Tata that there is any run in period, not even the manual or any other document provided by Tata mentioned about the run in period, So I dont think this had anything to do with the issue

2. The number stuck on windshield is usually the number of the Dealer's workshop (based on my experience with Maruti, Hyundai and Tata in Pune) who sold you the car. This number is useful only within municipal limits or near about unless you know someone personally there.

The sticker was of road side assistance by the dealer, unfortunately they changes this number to Indica only.

Tata has tied up with TVS service (toll free# 1800 209 7979) for 24x7 breakdown service. When out on a highway away from city, I will rest my faith on this toll free call centre first than calling the dealer- who most probably on a holiday/after hours had minimum staff on duty + they may not have network outside the city to help. Enrollment to this 24x7 service is free for cars sold in 2009+.

I got to know about this number only later, and seems like you need to pay 500/- to be a member and avail their services.

Hope you get back your car just fine. Don't jump into temptation of courts/legal fight etc. It will be more hassle and less gain. You will not get a "new" car for sure. The issue will be fixed by TML. Talk to TML customer helpline directly if you are unhappy with TASS. Tata Motors Customer Care :: Home

No, I am not approaching consumer court.

One question?
You mention that you reached 1800kms during your journey. Didn't you do first service between 1000-1500 kms? Did they drain engine oil? If not you should replace engine oil immediately.

I went to the service station when I had finished 800kms and was about to start the next one and had spoken to the service manager and he said max i could run was about 2000kms and nothing more than that. I have now finished the first service.
-BJ
All the other, thank you for your support. Did any of you have any issues with the ECU earlier, is their a back up if the ECU fails or are we dependent on the ECU completely for the car to function.
srisha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st January 2010, 21:13   #11
BHPian
 
Fornax's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Bombay
Posts: 288
Thanked: 79 Times
Default

I had a similiar issue - but in my Indica - where the engine would just shut down, in the middle of a perfectly normal run, giving no prior indication whatsoever. It was traced to an electrical issue, which I got fixed from a local mechanic. The issue was serious enough for him to take two days to fix and he said he had to re-wire a lot.

I can only suggest that you switch your service centre - especially since they had fixed the issue and it recurred during its' return trip.

Good luck.
Fornax is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st January 2010, 21:15   #12
BHPian
 
bj96's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Pune
Posts: 779
Thanked: 127 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by srisha View Post
I was not told by Tata that there is any run in period, not even the manual or any other document provided by Tata mentioned about the run in period, So I dont think this had anything to do with the issue
Not to disappoint you, but, here is the excerpt from Safari DiCOR user manual- page# 77.

Name:  safarirunin.jpg
Views: 930
Size:  29.6 KB

Well, an abuse in running-in period may not result into breakdown that you faced, however, it certainly affects the long term health of the car. It is like mother's milk to a new born baby. She may not die if not nurtured by mother's milk immediately after birth, but, you know it is important to build the long term immunity in the baby. Just search t-bhp and google why running-in is important on a new engine.


Quote:
Originally Posted by srisha View Post
I got to know about this number only later, and seems like you need to pay 500/- to be a member and avail their services.
Not sure, I haven't used this service yet. Touch-wood. But I got this enrollment + pamphlet from my dealer when I bought my safari in Feb-09. I didn't pay anything for this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by srisha View Post
I went to the service station when I had finished 800kms and was about to start the next one and had spoken to the service manager and he said max i could run was about 2000kms and nothing more than that. I have now finished the first service.
User manual clearly says 1st service between 1-1.5k kms and it is one of the terms of warranty. Keep a record, if possible, of the advice from service advisor that servicing at 2k kms was OK. You may need this should, TML contest the warranty claims in future.

Quote:
Originally Posted by srisha View Post
Did any of you have any issues with the ECU earlier, is their a back up if the ECU fails...
AFAIK, ECU is single and there is no "by-pass" for this in DiCOR engine. However, ECU life should be several 1000s of kms. It should not fail so easily, unless there was a voltage surge/circuit malfunction etc. Did TASS confirm it was a ECU failure or some other circuit element gave in?

Just a friendly advice, you may post your technical queries to "safari technical issues" thread which is frequented by many knowledgeable boarders like dadu, who could help with technical issues promptly.

Don't loose heart. Safari is a great vehicle. I am sure, soon she will be back on the road to take you places. Good luck.

-BJ

Last edited by bj96 : 1st January 2010 at 21:24. Reason: minor change
bj96 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st January 2010, 22:24   #13
Distinguished - BHPian
 
4x4addict's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Chennai
Posts: 3,973
Thanked: 2,496 Times
Default

@Srisha:

If you have spend enough time on this forums, you surely understand by now that buying a Safari is a coin toss. Anways, now that you have taken the plunge, your best bet is to stay the course and get your problem fixed. Tata seems to be pretty good at replacing most of the car under warranty.

Don't be carried away by some member suggestions about consumer court etc, unless you or your family lawyer has a lot of time on their hands. Manufacturer will definitely be given a chance to fix the car under warranty. Just imagine if Tata had to honor replacement claims against Tata vehicles? They would be broke now !!. They will fight a replacement claim with all their might to prevent a precedent for other cases. Your best bet is to work with Tata to rectify the issues.

The key is to escalate the pressure. Ask them to change out the whole wiring harness which is suspect and they claimed is *loose*. As bj96 pointed out, it looks like may not have kept within the specified rpm/speed in the run-in-period. But either way, your issue doesn't seem to be related to that.

I also would refrain from taking any long trips with family until you get to root of the issue. Also keep a tow rope handy in the car as TASS generally starts to replace irrelevant parts until they hit the faulty part, sometimes by sheer luck !!

Last edited by 4x4addict : 1st January 2010 at 22:27.
4x4addict is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd January 2010, 12:28   #14
BHPian
 
srisha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 165
Thanked: Once
Default

I visited the workshop yesterday and met the manager, and the problem seems to be with the wiring harness which connects to the engine and the ECU. This has to be checked by Delphi who is the OEM, and this will now happend on Monday and will have to wait for another 3-4 days before the vehicle can be delivered.

I also spoke to the technical head for Bangalore from Tata Motors and for the first time experienced some good customer service. He also offered me a loaner vehicle till this one was rectified.
srisha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd January 2010, 13:24   #15
BHPian
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 170
Thanked: 12 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by srisha View Post
I visited the workshop yesterday and met the manager, and the problem seems to be with the wiring harness which connects to the engine and the ECU. This has to be checked by Delphi who is the OEM, and this will now happend on Monday and will have to wait for another 3-4 days before the vehicle can be delivered.
The situation here again points to eaither inadequate QC or a definite problem with the ECU harness. Let us wait and see what Delphi comes back with.


Quote:
Originally Posted by srisha View Post
I also spoke to the technical head for Bangalore from Tata Motors and for the first time experienced some good customer service. He also offered me a loaner vehicle till this one was rectified.
Did you take up on this offer?
adits is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
My Grande Punto MJD : 1 year & 2 months young and has already surfed 28,000+ kms Kaustav Long-Term Ownership Reviews 13 18th December 2010 17:59
Which bike I should go in for (I already have a Shogun) rb2399 Motorbikes 15 26th February 2007 01:52
Got myself a new ride..... Banged it already Vivek Shifting gears 7 4th May 2005 10:21
Fiat Spa has already closed India ops DRC The Indian Car Scene 15 2nd April 2005 14:04
Dramas Already At Japanese GP F50 Int'l Motorsport 16 9th October 2004 22:56


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 10:04.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks