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Old 6th January 2006, 15:48   #16
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[quote=rangarajbut all around the world, the unofficial positioning of the Skoda is a poor man's VW. [/quote]

Yup ,thats how skoda is looked at .. having said that ,the Hondas and toyotas are way ahead in kinda respect and image they get ,here in india , even they are a comman man's car out there in the global markets ...

Buddy ,we are living in india and here the Skoda is rated ,if not higher then at par with the hondas and toyotas .
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Old 6th January 2006, 15:57   #17
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Talking Limping Laura!

A runner may look good with the best running shoes available, but that alone does not mean he stands a chance at winning the race. With the sorry 1.9PD engine, the Laura is lame, but well decorated... I mean imagine a 12.5lakh so called new Corolla beating the 18.85 Laura... Most of us forget that a powerful engine is even useful for safe overtaking in our traffic conditions and not just top-speed.
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Old 6th January 2006, 16:05   #18
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Quote:
Most of us forget that a powerful engine is even useful for safe overtaking in our traffic conditions and not just top-speed.
In that case look beyond the horsepower figures on paper and look at the torque. We all heard similar views on the Octavia when it was launched with just 90 bhp. Both these cars should (saying should as I don't have any specs in front of me) trounch the Corolla in the in-gear roll on tests. And thats shows their passing power best.
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Old 6th January 2006, 16:13   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rtech
In that case look beyond the horsepower figures on paper and look at the torque. We all heard similar views on the Octavia when it was launched with just 90 bhp. Both these cars should (saying should as I don't have any specs in front of me) trounch the Corolla in the in-gear roll on tests. And thats shows their passing power best.
Very valid point, but are you saying the 1.9PD diesel is quicker than the 1.8VVTi petrol engine for city overtaking? Two points for you and I to keep in mind to further discuss this point and learn from each other 1. The Corolla is more aerodynamic 2. The Corolla is lighter.

Not saying, who is right or wrong, but I found your point to be very interesting... Hope we or at least I learn from this discussion.

Last edited by MrBoombastic : 6th January 2006 at 16:15.
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Old 6th January 2006, 16:40   #20
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Again, I don't have the figures in front of me, but I own a 1.9TDi and have driven more than 4,000k's across India in a Corolla. Yes, the Corolla has more than a 20hp advantage, but in real world driving, you just don't find that anywhere.

common sense says that 21kgm@1,900 rpm is far better in city driving than 16.8 kgm @ about 4,200rpm!

Remember, that push you feel in the back is always from torque, not from bhp.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the Octi is a faster car, its not, but its real world performance far exceeds its on paper performance.

Last edited by Rtech : 6th January 2006 at 16:46.
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Old 6th January 2006, 17:10   #21
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Default Nice to have a mature discussion on cars...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rtech
Again, I don't have the figures in front of me, but I own a 1.9TDi and have driven more than 4,000k's across India in a Corolla. Yes, the Corolla has more than a 20hp advantage, but in real world driving, you just don't find that anywhere.

common sense says that 21kgm@1,900 rpm is far better in city driving than 16.8 kgm @ about 4,200rpm!

Remember, that push you feel in the back is always from torque, not from bhp.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the Octi is a faster car, its not, but its real world performance far exceeds its on paper performance.
Again, very valid and agreed . I have no problem with the Octavia getting a 1.9 for it's price... In fact I think that's wonderful, but I was talking of the Laura. I think you would agree with me that at a price of 18.85 the Laura deserved the 2.0 engine. That's why I compared the Laura to a Karela... oops!... I mean Corolla in my earlier post.

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Old 6th January 2006, 17:26   #22
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While on the Torque thingy .. A layman's Q if you please.
Are petrol engines more revv happy than comparable diesel ones ?
I mean 1900rpm and 4200rpm are way apart but how would the driver perceive it ? Does he feel it takes the same time to reach 1900 in a diesel compared to 4200 in a petrol ?

I think I'm kinda confused about what I want to ask. The Q is probably not clear to me even !
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Old 6th January 2006, 17:26   #23
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Is the Octavia II (sorry, can't bring myself to call it laura!) overpriced in India. I don't think there is a person on this forum who thinks otherwise. Even if it was sold with the 140bhp ECU, I would still call it overpriced.

However, you seem to be saying that a car which is priced more than another must outscore the other car in every single area. I don't agree with that argument at all.

Each car has to be looked at individually as everyone has unique requirements for a car. Some people look at the C class and say its a waste as its too small. I look at it and say its the perfect size. My priorities in a car will be different from the next guy. Back seats to me are not a priority.

Not everyone wants the largest and biggest if he's paying more than the other guy.
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Old 6th January 2006, 17:32   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shuvc
While on the Torque thingy .. A layman's Q if you please.
Are petrol engines more revv happy than comparable diesel ones ?
I mean 1900rpm and 4200rpm are way apart but how would the driver perceive it ? Does he feel it takes the same time to reach 1900 in a diesel compared to 4200 in a petrol ?

I think I'm kinda confused about what I want to ask. The Q is probably not clear to me even !
torque is your pulling power. It is what gives you that sensation of thrust. Just because a vehicle produces its peak torque at a lower rpm does not mean it has to be slower revving. Thats down to the actual engine characteristics and its bore x stroke.

In the real world, you would percieve the Octi as being a faster car till a certain speed than the Corolla. It would not be faster, its just that the shove you feel in your back makes you believe its faster. It also means you don't have to downshift often as the power is always on tap.
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Old 6th January 2006, 17:39   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rtech
However, you seem to be saying that a car which is priced more than another must outscore the other car in every single area. I don't agree with that argument at all.

Each car has to be looked at individually as everyone has unique requirements for a car. Some people look at the C class and say its a waste as its too small. I look at it and say its the perfect size. My priorities in a car will be different from the next guy. Back seats to me are not a priority.

Not everyone wants the largest and biggest if he's paying more than the other guy.
Umm... We are not discussing super car performance here... I mean the power on a 2003 Corolla is very very basic and asking just that much/ a little more from the Laura is not asking a car which is priced more than another to outscore the other car in every single area... Also, the price difference we are discussing here is over 6 lakhs... Not to forget! The Laura being heavier and less aerodynamic than the Corolla.

Last edited by MrBoombastic : 6th January 2006 at 17:42.
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Old 6th January 2006, 17:58   #26
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I do agree that an 18 lac sedan ought to have a better 0 - 100 acceleration time than 13 seconds (the figure I remember from CAR Magazine last nite)

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Old 6th January 2006, 18:02   #27
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we seem to be going around in circles. Haven't we already concluded that the **ugh** laura **ugh** is overpriced?
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Old 6th January 2006, 18:08   #28
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Default Off Topic - Sorry, Gang!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rtech
we seem to be going around in circles. Haven't we already concluded that the **ugh** laura **ugh** is overpriced?
Just a tickle: Rtech, are you asking me to play Ringa Ringa Roses, Bhai?
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Old 6th January 2006, 18:16   #29
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With the sorry 1.9PD engine, the Laura is lame,
I disagree with that statement totally. I had a Golf Tdi with PD here for a month and as you know it has the same engine as the Laura. In fact, I believe the Laura has 104bhp(?) compared to my Golf that had 100bhp. I am sure you will agree that the roads here are more conducive to high speed driving for extended periods of time and at NO POINT did I feel that the Golf was underpowered or sluggish compared to the Corolla's or Civic's here. In fact, a few months back, I had a 2004 Jetta with the same engine and I was easily doing 140kmph constantly and even touched 160kmph. Never once was there any lag or diesel sluggishness. Don't dismiss the 1.9TDi so easily, it's a iconic engine and considering the "high speeds" we do constantly in India, I would say it's more then adequate for Indian conditions. Maybe the Laura is heavier then the Golf but then it also has 4hp more then the Golf/Jetta have here.

The 0-100 run comparo between Petrol and diesel engines is not correct according to me. Both the corolla and Laura have almost the same size engine and we all know a diesel engine develops lesser HP for the same engine size. My Palio S10 has a faster 0-100 then the Laura. Does that mean that the Laura is a mighty rip-off and that the Palio is a better car? Yes, if the Laura had the 2.0 140Hp TDi and was still slower then Corolla then we would had a discussable topic.

Last edited by amit : 6th January 2006 at 18:20.
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Old 6th January 2006, 18:27   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amit
I disagree with that statement totally. I had a Golf Tdi with PD here for a month and as you know it has the same engine as the Laura. In fact, I believe the Laura has 104bhp(?) compared to my Golf that had 100bhp. I am sure you will agree that the roads here are more conducive to high speed driving for extended periods of time and at NO POINT did I feel that the Golf was underpowered or sluggish compared to the Corolla's or Civic's here. In fact, a few months back, I had a 2004 Jetta with the same engine and I was easily doing 140kmph constantly and even touched 160kmph. Never once was there any lag or diesel sluggishness. Don't dismiss the 1.9TDi so easily, it's a iconic engine and considering the "high speeds" we do constantly in India, I would say it's more then adequate for Indian conditions. Maybe the Laura is heavier then the Golf but then it also has 4hp more then the Golf/Jetta have here.
As I stated in an earlier post... The 1.9 is great on the Octavia, but not on the Laura. You seem to forget that I compared the Laura to the Corolla when the Corolla is almost 2 lakhs cheaper than the Honda Accord while the Laura is 2 lakhs more expensive that the Accord. Amit Bhai, I am sorry, but for this price even the Corolla (sadela karela) makes the Laura lame. Do you think it is wise to compare other market scenarios when the Laura is priced differently here?
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