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Old 9th March 2011, 22:30   #16
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Default Re: Quick First Drive: Tata Indica E-V2 CR4 LS

thanks Sid for the quick inputs !

I feel this will be a runaway success in the Cab/Taxi segment, I dont see making any dent on Figo sales.
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Old 9th March 2011, 23:29   #17
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Default Re: Quick First Drive: Tata Indica E-V2 CR4 LS

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Originally Posted by sidindica View Post
Don't expect figo levels of finish. The interior colour is at least "good", Its a no nonsense approach.
Perhaps the car is for those who want a basic, no frills, full of utility diesel car with maximum fuel efficiency and withstand abuse.
I think that the LX offers a lot more VFM. For only 20K over the LS, you get Alloy wheels, a BT/USB/MP3 player, Remote Locking, Front PW and F/R fogs. That's a great deal!

Plus you're getting a very modern, DOHC 16V common rail diesel engine with VGT! The only other hatches with similar engine are the Punto 90 and i20 CRDi which are priced way higher. The body shell may be old but it is still solid. And parts are cheap.

P.S. I think the brochure was rushed. The front console shows four PW switches, but the front door still has a window winder!

The chassis might be old, but it is still a very good one in terms of safety, space and comfort. And it was ahead of its time when launched. There's no other hatch with rear independent suspension.

IMO you also have to look at it from the manufacturer's perspective. Tata remains the only Indian company which has designed and manufactured cars and engines from ground up. The Indica and DiCOR represents a lot of investment in tooling and R&D. The car passes current emission and safety standards, gives great mileage, is spacious and cheap to run. To stop making it simply because it's 12 years old is absurd.

The Qualis was a 25 year old design when it was introduced in India. I detest the thing, but I will concede that it was a real workhorse that put function over form. I hated the 14 inch wheels (which made it easy to steer) and the boxy looks (cheaper to fix dents). But people were willing to overlooks the minor faults because it was a Toyota and very, very reliable and functional.

This applies to the Indica too. It might not be a good handler, and it might be old, but the bottom line is, you spend less on fuel/spares than any other car. Plus it's not that bad to look at. Invariably, the biggest takers for this car will be taxi operators, who will abuse this car to its limits.

Hopefully, this launch means that Tata has ironed out the faults of the DiCOR and it will find its way into the Vista/Manza platform. A Vista DiCOR will be cheaper than a Vista QJD, right?

Quote:
Originally Posted by harimakesh View Post
No engine immobilizer, Rear Demister, Rear Wipe+wash? on any model?
Good question. I think The old DLX had all these. Truthfully, I'd rather have rear wash/wipe/demist than alloys which I can fit outside.

Quote:
Originally Posted by harimakesh
Door pockets should have been modified for holding 1L water bottles.
True, but that would have involved redesign, which Tata won't bother with on such an old platform. Pity.
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Old 10th March 2011, 01:28   #18
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Default Re: Quick First Drive: Tata Indica E-V2 CR4 LS

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Originally Posted by vivekgk View Post
I think that the LX offers a lot more VFM. For only 20K over the LS, you get Alloy wheels, a BT/USB/MP3 player, Remote Locking, Front PW and F/R fogs. That's a great deal!
yup, the LX looks like a vastly better deal, only relatively though.

Quote:
Plus you're getting a very modern, DOHC 16V common rail diesel engine with VGT! The only other hatches with similar engine are the Punto 90 and i20 CRDi which are priced way higher. The body shell may be old but it is still solid. And parts are cheap.
Calling the CR4 engine a modern engine is like calling this eV2 a contemporary hatch. While the features may be present, its still a hack job on an age old engine. Apart from the head, its not significantly different. I hope the new gasket design has better luck keeping the head and the block together, and the traditional dicor problems dont manifest here.


Quote:
The chassis might be old, but it is still a very good one in terms of safety, space and comfort. And it was ahead of its time when launched. There's no other hatch with rear independent suspension.


This applies to the Indica too. It might not be a good handler, and it might be old, but the bottom line is, you spend less on fuel/spares than any other car. Plus it's not that bad to look at. Invariably, the biggest takers for this car will be taxi operators, who will abuse this car to its limits.
entirely agreed, but i still think the figo should begin to make sense to cabbies.


Quote:
Good question. I think The old DLX had all these. Truthfully, I'd rather have rear wash/wipe/demist than alloys which I can fit outside.
You can retrofit the rear wash/wipe/demister. Cost me about 12k
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Old 10th March 2011, 03:14   #19
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Default Re: Quick First Drive: Tata Indica E-V2 CR4 LS

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Originally Posted by vivekgk View Post
The body shell may be old but it is still solid. And parts are cheap.

The chassis might be old, but it is still a very good one in terms of safety, space and comfort. And it was ahead of its time when launched. There's no other hatch with rear independent suspension.

The car passes current emission and safety standards, gives great mileage, is spacious and cheap to run.

This applies to the Indica too. It might not be a good handler, and it might be old, but the bottom line is, you spend less on fuel/spares than any other car. Plus it's not that bad to look at. Invariably, the biggest takers for this car will be taxi operators, who will abuse this car to its limits.

Hopefully, this launch means that Tata has ironed out the faults of the DiCOR and it will find its way into the Vista/Manza platform. A Vista DiCOR will be cheaper than a Vista QJD, right?
In some cases though, parts are neither cheap nor is the Indica cheap to run. Check out rock18's shock on March 9 when the Tata service centre 'OMR checkpoint' at Perungudi (Chennai) called him to say that he would have to shell out Rs 27,000 (yes, rupees twenty seven thousand only) to service his car that has logged just 25,000 kms. Read his post at:

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-d...ml#post2271669 (My Xeta - An Initial ownership report EDIT: 25000kms report on Pg.2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by greenhorn View Post
Calling the CR4 engine a modern engine is like calling this eV2 a contemporary hatch. While the features may be present, its still a hack job on an age old engine. Apart from the head, its not significantly different. I hope the new gasket design has better luck keeping the head and the block together, and the traditional dicor problems dont manifest here.
As far as Tata is concerned, the best way to know if "the new gasket design has better luck keeping the head and the block together, and the traditional dicor problems dont manifest here" is to wait for about a year or or so. If Tata continues to rely on its dubious QC, the problems would start within a few months.

Having said that, the Indica without the wheel arches does look nice.
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Old 10th March 2011, 04:22   #20
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Default Re: Quick First Drive: Tata Indica E-V2 CR4 LS

Quote:
Originally Posted by greenhorn View Post
Calling the CR4 engine a modern engine is like calling this eV2 a contemporary hatch. While the features may be present, its still a hack job on an age old engine. Apart from the head, its not significantly different. I hope the new gasket design has better luck keeping the head and the block together, and the traditional dicor problems dont manifest here.
AFAIK the CR4 engine is the same from Indigo eCS. From its launch till now I guess the complaints against the engine weren't big enough(like older dicor problems or gasket design flaws, etc.) for most of us here to not notice. Anyways, my point is that this version of the Engine is not new. It has been tried and tested in eCS.
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Old 10th March 2011, 06:08   #21
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Default Re: Quick First Drive: Tata Indica E-V2 CR4 LS

From the pictures, it looks to be built for the cab sector. For example, the switches (AC, blower etc) look worse than on my 2006 V2. It seems to match the Indicab switch gear.

Further notice that the car does not have hot/cold knob setting for AC. This means it has one of the most basic AC systems, and is similar to the V2. I hope the top end has better switch gear and HVAC.

Overall - looks like Tata is stress testing CR4 engines. They can get really good quality feed back very soon with the cabbies who easily get it past 50k km in a year.
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Old 10th March 2011, 10:11   #22
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Default Re: Quick First Drive: Tata Indica E-V2 CR4 LS

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Originally Posted by deep_bang View Post
Further notice that the car does not have hot/cold knob setting for AC. This means it has one of the most basic AC systems, and is similar to the V2. I hope the top end has better switch gear and HVAC.
Good observation. I'm rather surprised that the Indica does not have a hot/cold knob setting for AC, especially in light of the fierce competition in the Rs 5 lakh segment. Suppose the driver needs a hot air blower, how does one go about this in the absence of a hot/cold rotary knob? Also, it would make it nearly impossible for someone to use the AC in a mild position (less cool) but with a faster blower (2 or 3 speed). Or am I missing something here? I think that the knob to allow inside air was quite unnecessary and a waste of money. A simply on/off button would have served the purpose. Instead, Tata could have used the space for the hot/cold rotary knob.

Last edited by misquitas : 10th March 2011 at 10:15.
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Old 10th March 2011, 10:31   #23
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Default Re: Quick First Drive: Tata Indica E-V2 CR4 LS

HVAC (Heater) is standard on LX models.
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Old 10th March 2011, 10:47   #24
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Default Re: Quick First Drive: Tata Indica E-V2 CR4 LS

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Originally Posted by safari_lover View Post
If the prices are correct then they are too close to the entry level variant of Vista and Figo. I don't think even the features differ too much since ac and power steering are standard on the Vista across variants. Wonder if it makes sense to go for this instead of the Vista!

If only they put this engine in the Vista and price it at their current Vista TDi + 10K, and advertise it as 25KMPL!
+1 to that. I dont think this pricing makes any sense. Let aside Figo, for any buyer, taxi or otherwise Vista Terra Quadrajet could be a much better buy from the same Manufacturer. A much more modern platform and better engine too.
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Old 10th March 2011, 11:03   #25
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Default Re: Quick First Drive: Tata Indica E-V2 CR4 LS

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Originally Posted by misquitas View Post
I think that the knob to allow inside air was quite unnecessary and a waste of money. A simply on/off button would have served the purpose. Instead, Tata could have used the space for the hot/cold rotary knob.
Well. The higher end models of V2 do exactly what you mention. Just that the lower end ones have a mechanical open/close valve to make it simpler.
While this might have been acceptable 5 years back with the V2, now it just seems to indicate Tata is keeping the V2 barely alive, just trying to make more money and testing its new engines.

In a different kind of a way, this car is a great move by tata, and positioning it marginally below Vista, will make sure all the cabbies go for V2 (or eV2). For the cabbies, 5 seater + good mileage is all what matters.
This serves the purpose of Vista being an exclusive owner driven vehicle rather than have a taxi image.
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Old 10th March 2011, 11:17   #26
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Default Re: Quick First Drive: Tata Indica E-V2 CR4 LS

Nice review/scoop Sid!
Here are some of my observations:
1) The Vista Mjd costs Rs 4,57,571 Ex-Delhi, so I doubt the Indica CR4 would be priced the same, or even less than 20k less than the Vista.
2) Due to the missing side claddings, the (D)LS looks similar to the bread and butter Indicab from the side profile.
3) The front end looks great, but I feel the Indigo TDi's bumper would've looked better.
4) The beige interiors are nice, but I don't see why Tata did not use the Indigo's interior door handles. Even the V-series door handles would've been a better touch.
5) As someone else rightly pointed out, the lack of the Hot/Cold air knob is a GLARING emission.
6) It is claimed that the Indica CR4, as reported in the other thread by GTO, might be India's most FE car, but, IIRC, Autocar was able to achieve 30 kpl + on the TDCi Fiesta, so that gives us something to think about.
7) Provided it is priced at, say, 4 lakh, I might consider buying one myself! :stupid

@Harimakesh: I'm pretty sure the Indica (D)LX will come with:
1) A heater.
2) Central Locking + Immobiliser
3) Power windows
4) Rear Wash/wipe + Demister
5) Fabric on the door pads
6) Fog lamps

@Vivekgk: Mind telling me where you found an (e) brochure of the Indica CR4?
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Old 10th March 2011, 12:00   #27
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Default Re: Quick First Drive: Tata Indica E-V2 CR4 LS

The brochures of e-v2 are openly distributed a all tata dealerships, at least in delhi. Go and get one if you want arkin.
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Old 10th March 2011, 12:13   #28
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Default Re: Quick First Drive: Tata Indica E-V2 CR4 LS

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The brochures of e-v2 are openly distributed a all tata dealerships, at least in delhi. Go and get one if you want arkin.
Oops. Just checked out the brochure here: https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/india...-pg-3-a-3.html

So the features I guessed would come are not fully correct.
Oh boy, alloys are a nice touch!

Mods please delete this post and edit my previous post if need be.

Last edited by Arkin evoisrevo : 10th March 2011 at 12:17.
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Old 10th March 2011, 14:24   #29
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Default Re: Quick First Drive: Tata Indica E-V2 CR4 LS

Am not really an Indica person myself, but just to comment on this.

E-V2 CR4 LS

That sounds like one of Sam Kapasi's made-up variant names.

As it is, "Indica Vista" confuses one (why not just Vista?) Now you have Indicas with a stream of initials & numbers tagged along. Confusing!
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Old 10th March 2011, 19:17   #30
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Default Re: Quick First Drive: Tata Indica E-V2 CR4 LS

Quote:
The Tata Indica eV2 is in the range of Rs. 3.95 lakhs and Rs. 4.77 lakhs, ex-showroom Delhi for the CR4 diesel engine and in the range of Rs. 2.95 lakhs and Rs. 3.58 lakhs, ex-showroom Delhi, for the MPFI petrol.
As reported by GTO - http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...ml#post2273665 (BS-IV Tata Indica to topple Nano as the FE champion? EDIT : Brochure on Pg. 3)
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