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Old 15th August 2016, 21:23   #31
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Default Re: Are tougher Runflat Tyres more durable on broken roads?

HI,

I own a 2013 F30 320d. I was running 255 55R16 Bridgestone RFT's which lasted for around 30,000 kms. In between I had upsized my rims to 18" and had installed 225 45 R18 RFTs which had developed bulges in two wheels with just 2500 kms thanks to hitting a pothole and a curb, respectively. Switched back to my original 16" RFTs which I feel are better equipped to handle our potholed ridden roads. Just switched to Pirelli P7s tubeless tyres as one of my 16 RFTs also had a sidewall cut after hitting a pothole. The ride is more comfortable and noiseless but feels a tad bit unsettled. I do a lot of highway driving, with luggage, so do not have space for a spare. Have brought a 17' wrench and a jack and hope..or rather pray for no puncture or at best a puncture near a puncture shop.
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Old 16th August 2016, 12:24   #32
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Default Re: Are tougher Runflat Tyres more durable on broken roads?

GTO, I'd say this is because of your sidewall width with the runflats. I've been cursing runflats since I got them. They bulge often and develop cuts too. And that's after extremely careful driving and not hitting any major potholes. I've also experimented with different air pressure to see how it affects the tires what. My car is running 225/45-18 and I usually run 34-36PSI

I'd say any tire with over 2 inches of sidewall is absolutely necessary with wheel sizes 18' and up. Runflats will give you horrid ride quality and grip. I'd reckon a tubeless tire with the same sidewall profile (or thicker if you want, but not sure if you can go over 245/45 at the front) will help prevent these issues to a big extent.
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Old 16th August 2016, 16:09   #33
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Default Re: Are tougher Runflat Tyres more durable on broken roads?

I will share my experience with low profile though not RFTs. It goes as below:

I have had a very bad experience with Michelin low profile tyre (245/45 R17) on my Mercedes E 220 (2012) which at that point had done 8000 Kms .

I was going at 50-60 Kmph over a railway crossing and heard a loud bang. To my shock both the tyres of left side were loosing pressure. I was lucky enough that the speed i was doing was controllable and was able to stop the car in time.

This happened late into the night and the only option was to call my friends car to use one of his spare tyre.

Thanks for reading and coming back to the point, i feel the durability of low profile is a very big question mark in our driving conditions.

I would prefer harder compound,which can give extra protection to the side walls in these kind of cases though it will be a compromise on ride quality.

Cheers
Sak
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Old 17th August 2016, 14:12   #34
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Smile Re: Are tougher Runflat Tyres more durable on broken roads?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Akshay1234 View Post
But I have also seen the opposite, runflats getting sidewall tears a lot
I get to see at least 12-15 cases of this a year, with the owners / driver stranded in the middle of nowhere as there is no spare. They have to cart the wheel to the nearest tire store to get it changed / dismounted.

My points in favour of a tubeless tyre :

1. Easier to dismount / repair in even remote locations. RFT (Run on Flat Technology) tyres need a RFT tyre changer machine to be dismounted without scratching or damaging your expensive wheel rims. With a non-RFT tyre changer the technician has to make of extreme physical force and 2 tyre levers to literally pry the tyre off the rim. On most of our highways you'll only find tyre shops outside dhabas that use crowbars to remove truck tyres.

2. In case of a sidewall tear, you can dismount a tubeless tire much more easily and put in a tube and be back on the road. With an RFT the roadside tyre shop guy will have to hammer away on those shiny rims and do an array of gymnastics to get the sidewall off.

3. Easier to source : Even in larger cities, seldom will you find a ready stock of RFT tyres with the retailer. And I know from experience that even the depots of the manufacturer do not carry stocks for many RFT sizes, it is all ordered on demand.

4. Comfort : As many people have already said, a tubeless is much more cushioned and soft vis-a-vis an RFT tyre. I had Run flats on my Civic (205/55/R16) for about 100 kms before switching back to tubeless tyres.

5. Claims : In case of a non-manufacturing defect claim (sidewall bulge / cut ,tear,having run the tyre underinflated etc) , the customer and dealer 'might' have some leverage with the tyre company to do it as a goodwill gesture to a regular customer (subjective, please don't assume it will be surely granted) but not so with RFT tyres since RFT tyres are very expensive and all of them being imported, it is time consuming and expensive to keep them in stock.
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Old 17th August 2016, 20:35   #35
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Default Re: Are tougher Runflat Tyres more durable on broken roads?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Durango Dude View Post
I think the best would be to down size those rims and add some high profile tyres in the interests of improvement in ride quality, sure those 18" rims and low profile RFT will look terrific but our roads would definitely take it's toll in the form of rim, tyre damage and suspension damage.
Many of these cars runs large diameter disc rotors which limits downsizing of the wheels. I am sure GTO's 530d will need a minimum of 17'' wheels to clear the brake calipers.

With manufacturer already specifying a larger overall tyre diameter, you do get more sidewall than a 328i, for example when going to 17'', but finding good matching tyres in 17'' with (say 245/50 R17 instead of 245/45 R18) will again prove to be difficult.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sidhu_hs View Post
[*]I presently drive an Elite i20 which has covered about 25000 kms, about 90% of which is highway driving. Now, 530d has 245/45(F) and 275/40(R) setup which translates to about 110 mm of sidewall height. The new breed of cars such as Verna, Elite i20, Ciaz, Baleno, Abarth Punto to name a few use 195/55 setup which translates to about 107 mm of sidewall height! Which is lesser than the mighty BMW.
Adding to these, on the same car running same tyres (say 225/50 R16), would't the width of rims also factor into probability of sidewall damage? You can fit a 225/50 R16 tyre on rims widths of 6.0-8.0J. The amount with which the tyres 'look' normal, curved in or stretched out often makes me feel that the stretched out one might just be more prone to damage, or is it just a bad visual hypothesis?
Quote:
Originally Posted by VeyronSuperSprt View Post
So the only real advantage for tubeless tyres are that they score heavily on practicality in Indian conditions in terms of ease of repair and having a stepney at hand.
Agree, I haven't felt significant loss in ride quality when I went from Michelin Pilot Sport 3 tubeless to Yoko Advan Sport Runflats, in our Laura (both 225/50 R16 tyres). Both have gone through rough roads in the similar way and haven't yet caused any sidewall issues. A regular tubeless spare tyre adds to the peace of mind. I had faced a puncture with the RFT, but since the vehicle was at home, there was a nearby dealer who had the right tools to handle the RFT tyre removal/refit. Only downside is that the Laura uses the basic ABS wheel speed sensor based tyre pressure monitoring system which are rendered useless by the stiffer sidewalls of RFTs. You end up checking the tyre pressure more often.
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Old 21st August 2016, 22:08   #36
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Default Re: Are tougher Runflat Tyres more durable on broken roads?

I do feel the stronger sidewalls on the RFTs resist bad roads and pothole impacts better. I've seen a lot of cars with bent rims or mildly damaged rims due to a pothole hit, but wth the tyre intact!

Since I've never actually used RFTs, my opinion might change on using it.
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Old 25th August 2016, 17:07   #37
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Default Re: Are tougher Runflat Tyres more durable on broken roads?

I would be facing the same dilemma with the 320d which has clocked 26k kms now and the tyres would be up for change sometime next year.

I honestly have had a psychological advantage with the RFTs while doing good speeds on highways. Whether it real or imaginary is anyone's guess. I have never faced excessive wear and tear or damage like bubbles in any of the sets of tube and tubeless tyres we have had on our cars ever since I can remember.

The bigger advantage to me is the ability to handle punctures. I am assured that I or any family member will not be stranded in the middle of the road or will be forced to change a flat. And trust me it is a huge plus point when you have the confidence that you can easily drive to the next puncture shop/fuel station and get the puncture repaired.

As of today, I am inclined to pick another set of RFTs rather than tubeless tyres when the times comes for a change.

Lastly whats the warranty status. I was told at my dealership that warranty related to suspension etc will be void if I opt for tubeless set up.
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Old 26th August 2016, 19:02   #38
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Default Re: Are tougher Runflat Tyres more durable on broken roads?

Quote:
Originally Posted by drmohitg View Post
I would be facing the same dilemma with the 320d which has clocked 26k kms now and the tyres would be up for change sometime next year.

Lastly whats the warranty status. I was told at my dealership that warranty related to suspension etc will be void if I opt for tubeless set up.
Hi Mohit,

How are the tyres holding up after 26k kms in terms of road noise and stiffness ?

My F30 Bridgestone Potenza RFT have done 17k kms so far and i am starting to feel the ride quality a little stiffer now.

There are many Bhpians who have changed to tubeless tyres including me on the X1 and havent heard or faced any warranty related issues after the swap.

If you have tyre coverage under insurance, they wont cover the tubeless tyre as far as i have been informed. RFTs are covered under tyre coverage of insurance if you get the new set endorsed with the insurance company.


Quote:
Originally Posted by karan561 View Post

Another friend & BHPian Manish (bhp) is a runflat fan who has an X1 and a F30 20d, until he changed his X1 tyres to tubeless Michelins & his car transformed. But he had 55 profiles in both & not a low profile so that would have helped him out. Just like F10 17" size being 225/55 R17 havent seen that size being a problem with Runflats.
Correction,
The X1 and F30 both running the same size 225/50/17.
The Pre-LCI F10 runs 225/55/17.

On the X1,
The car ran for 36k kms on the stock RFTs before both the left tyres burst at the under construction road on the Pune-Nashik highway at midnight. But the tyres were driven for another 50kms safely to Nasik. The tyres would have easily lasted for another 5k kms if the mishap did not take place. Thereafter, I changed all 4 tyres to tubeless Michelins and the low speed ride quality improved by at least 30%.

On the F30,
The car is running on stock Bridgestone Potenza RFTs since last 17k kms. The ride quality is very nice with the new generation RFTs. I doubt if there will be much difference even if i switch to tubeless on this car. Waiting to see if these tyres still perform the same way in later stage of their life.

The key for these tyres to perform flawlessly in our conditions is the right tyre pressure, I maintain 30psi in all tyres on both the cars and havent faced any problem yet.

BMW recommends really high pressure for our conditions and that is when most of people see bursts and bubbles on their tyres.
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Old 26th August 2016, 20:18   #39
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Default Re: Are tougher Runflat Tyres more durable on broken roads?

On my X1 (E84)Shifted to Tubeless from RFT after 3 sidewall bulges from 3 different set of tyres.after about 12,000 km the tyres always showed more propensity to develop side wall bulges when the car hit a pothole.especially at higher speeds on highway. However, i can see your driving in Mumbai and seem to have much better roads that are quite suited to the RFT. After moving to the tubeless from RFT the ride quality has improved and is much softer and the steering is lighter overall very happy after shifting to the tubeless since i haven't had a single side wall bulge incident.Total peace of mind now i don't have to be worried after every highway drive which was the case when i using RFT.Have had lower ball joint replaced under BSI ultimate despite using tubeless tyres.

Last edited by abishek2222 : 26th August 2016 at 20:20. Reason: Add info
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Old 27th August 2016, 09:01   #40
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Default Re: Are tougher Runflat Tyres more durable on broken roads?

Frankly no run-flat tyre is designed for our darling Indian broken potholed roads...
Probably only the traditional "run-flat" bullock cart wheel can handle these!

Jokes apart, it might actually be a good idea to change if possible to a tubeless tyre because of the sheer unpredictability of the surfaces we drive on.

I personally would not buy a car with run-flat tyres because it is simply not yet practical in India unless perhaps you live in Lutyens's Delhi and never take the car outside of those limits...
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Old 27th August 2016, 17:52   #41
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Default Re: Are tougher Runflat Tyres more durable on broken roads?

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Originally Posted by abishek2222 View Post
However, i can see your driving in Mumbai and seem to have much better roads that are quite suited to the RFT.
Sorry completely OT, but Mumbai and much better roads do not go together. They are possible worse than all other tier 1 cities in India.
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Old 27th August 2016, 18:31   #42
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Default Re: Are tougher Runflat Tyres more durable on broken roads?

I believe Profile will be important, Runflats with lower profiles are definitely a No-No for our Roads, whereas thicker ones can definitely take better. Now I won't have a definitive answer as any of RFT or regular have not taken a hit in recent past but regular ones are definitely quieter and comfortable. RFT does give you more confidence to complete or reach to nearest place in case of a puncture or cut, which essentially is what these are designed for. I remember an old incident where there was a side cut but I could still drive for another 50-60 Km.

However, of late at least on CKD, BMW has mostly found a balance between comfort,profile and practicality and none of my recent purchases had suffered any blowouts.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...ml#post2522505 (Run Flats could go Flat)
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Old 27th March 2017, 00:39   #43
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Default Re: Are tougher Runflat Tyres more durable on broken roads?

Hello GTO:

Curious to know what you finally decided.

I have done 38000kms on Bridgestone Potenza S001 which came with the car and I intend to replace them when the next service becomes due in 2000kms. The ride is still acceptable but doesn't feel the same as when the tires were new. Bumps and road imperfections are far more pronounced.

So far I have only faced 3 punctures in four years. I am inclined to stick to RFTs simply for the peace of mind they offer and am willing to compromise on some comfort for that. Trying to decide between Yokohama Advan Sport v103 ZPS, Pirelli Cinturato P7 RFT and Potenza S001 RFT.

Your inputs will be useful so please share.

Best regards,

Deep
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Old 2nd April 2017, 11:52   #44
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Default Re: Are tougher Runflat Tyres more durable on broken roads?

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Originally Posted by Deep_Shri View Post
Hello GTO:


So far I have only faced 3 punctures in four years. I am inclined to stick to RFTs simply for the peace of mind they offer and am willing to compromise on some comfort for that.

Deep
I fully second this...last sunday at 1 AM in the morning, i suffered a puncture on my RFTs...there was no petrol bunk or mechanic in sight...heck it was dangerous even getting down to change to the donut i have with the X5. Managed to drive for another 100 km on the runflat until i reached a BPCL bunk where i swapped the RFT with the donut. The peace of mind that you get about not stopping in the middle of nowhere to change the tyre is worth the RFTs
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Old 2nd April 2017, 16:13   #45
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Default Re: Are tougher Runflat Tyres more durable on broken roads?

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Originally Posted by Deep_Shri View Post
Curious to know what you finally decided.
As much as I wanted to go the tubeless way, it wasn't possible as the 275 mm rear size wasn't available with anyone in India. Quoting from my ownership report:

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
I got my tyres replaced. As much as I prefer tubeless tyres over runflats, I had to choose the latter. Reasons:

- Tubeless tyres aren't available for the 530d. No one in India has them. From one dealer, I found tubeless for the front tyres (245 mm), but not the rear (275 mm). Ordering from tirerack.com was a painful option. For one, the cost of Michelins (about $1000) + shipping to India (about $675) made it ridiculous, especially when you add local custom duties (about 40k) and Octroi. Then, refer to this excellent post and witness the associated headaches of importing. My last concern was, if & when there would be some sort of issue with the tyre (say, manufacturing defect), who would handle it? Certainly not tirerack thousands of miles away.

- My experience with the Continentals has been positive. The grip levels are awesome, ride quality is comfortable and most importantly, my tyres didn't develop a bulge or any sort of damage in 25,000 km. This was an important point considering the tyre size & the fact that I head out on the highway often. Tyre guru Nikhilb2008 also told me that runflats - with their firmer sidewalls - will be less prone to damage than low-profile tubeless rubber.

Yes, the ride with tubeless tyres would be even better and their life would be a little longer. The only area I'm unhappy with the Continentals is their quick wear rate (completely gone in 25,000 km).

- Shockingly, the tyres were cheaper at BMW authorised workshops than outside! Whatever tyres that were available outside were priced a grand higher, were of 2015 build and didn't have warranty. I got 2016 build tyres from Infinity, officially imported by BMW.

It was a no-brainer purchase.
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