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Old 7th January 2007, 20:00   #76
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Originally Posted by v1p3r View Post
not a jaunt from Bhopal to Meerut.
Have you been from Bhopal to Meerut? It's a bloody long journey!!

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Originally Posted by Sam Kapasi View Post
I'd really like to know what positive offset is and what is correct PCD. Or is that too much info?
Here you go (Whether it's too much info for you - I think yes!) :
Wheel Information.

Okay. If you want to change the wheels on your car, you need to take some things into consideration.
  • Number of bolts or studs
    It goes without saying that you can't fit a 4-bolt wheel onto a 5-bolt wheel hub. Sounds obvious, but people have been known to fork out for an expensive set of wheels only to find they've got the wrong number of mounting holes.
  • Pitch Circle Diameter
    Right. So you know how many holes there are. Now you need to know the PCD, or Pitch Circle Diameter. This is the diameter of the invisible circle formed by scribing a circle that passes through the centre point of each mounting hole. If you've got the right number of holes, but they're the wrong spacing, again the wheel just won't fit.
4 stud (bolt) PCD 5 stud (bolt) PCD
  • Inset or outset
    This is very important. Ignore this and you can end up with all manner of nasty problems. This is the distance in mm between the centre line of the wheel rim, and the line through the fixing face. You can have inset, outset or neither. This determines how the suspension and self-centring steering behave. The most obvious problem that will occur if you get it wrong is that the steering will either become so heavy that you can't turn the car, or so light that you need to spend all your time keeping the bugger in a straight line. More mundane problems through ignoring this measurement can range from wheels that foul parts of the bodywork or suspension, to high-speed judder in the steering because the suspension setup can't handle that particular type of wheel. This figure will be stamped on the wheel somewhere as an ET figure.
1. No offset 2. Inset wheel 3. Outset wheel


Source: carbibles.com

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Originally Posted by Sam Kapasi View Post
Edit: Just read Steeroid's post too. Now I'm getting worried. Any Verna users here with 205? Or am I gonna be the bakra?
No Sam I've seen someone's car recently & he was running 205's. He said there were no issues with it, but to answer the question on the forum yes you'll be the first one! But it's not that big a deal, a few small tests like loading the car up with the Lucky & a couple more people should confirm if there is any touching.

Also KP can you give us the PCD & offset for the Verna please??

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Originally Posted by Steeroid View Post
Put several fat men in the car when you do so. You dont want a wheel that doesnt touch in the shop to start scraping your fenders when full up.
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Originally Posted by vid6639 View Post
Yeah the front may not touch it's the rears I was worried about when fully laden.
I have a feeling the poor guy is gonna be more confused that he's ever made anyone in the ICE section!!

Last edited by iraghava : 7th January 2007 at 20:03.
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Old 7th January 2007, 20:09   #77
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Originally Posted by Sam Kapasi View Post
He said he will have to check availability of Yokohama 185/165. It should be available.
That's available?? Wow that should be one hell of a tyre

Good atleast 205's out so some less confusion for you Sam! Congrats on the new car, wheels & tyres keep us updated with pictures!

PS: Even though Samurai disagrees I would still go for 195/60! It's a matter of just half a centimetre!

Last edited by iraghava : 7th January 2007 at 20:12.
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Old 7th January 2007, 20:23   #78
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I would still go for 195/60! It's a matter of just half a centimetre!
Yeah Even i would go for these. They are easily available. I have seen these on several VGT vernas here in bangalore. They look pretty good and fill up the wheel wells pretty nicely.

185/65 is the same as the petrol Verna.

PS: Good thing your doing Sam changing upsizing the Verna tyres. I went to a hyundai service centre a few days back and saw quite a few dented Vernas. When I asked the service guy how come so many already in for repairs he told me most of the cars werent able to stop skidded lost control and hit something or the other. Around 8 vernas with front accident repair.
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Old 7th January 2007, 20:31   #79
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A general question. The 205/60 tyre is 0.5mm more in radius, but 30mm more in width when compared to stock tyre.

Therefore, if it is touching, it has to be touching the sides while turning the wheels. The height of the tyre is practically same as stock. So what is this fat people test going to prove? Does the wheel well slope from the inside, thereby decreasing the height available for wider tyres?

BTW, we discussed all the these tyre sizes, but what about offset? How do you calculate that for a new car? That can make so much difference.
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Old 7th January 2007, 20:34   #80
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BTW, we discussed all the these tyre sizes, but what about offset? How do you calculate that for a new car? That can make so much difference.
Samu, i guess that the 205's were touching on the side then. Now what is this offset business?
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Old 7th January 2007, 20:37   #81
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Samurai the fat people test is for the rear tyres. When you load the car with luggage and people in the back the tyre will go into the wheel well. Even when you hit a bump hard the tyre goes into the wheel well.

Now if it's 30mm more wider when fully laden instead of going into the wheel well it will hit the body of the car.

Hope you got what I'm trying to say.
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Old 7th January 2007, 20:52   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Kapasi View Post
Samu, i guess that the 205's were touching on the side then. Now what is this offset business?
Sam, checkout the info posted by iraghava. Outset is positive offset, inset is negative offset.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vid6639 View Post
Samurai the fat people test is for the rear tyres. When you load the car with luggage and people in the back the tyre will go into the wheel well. Even when you hit a bump hard the tyre goes into the wheel well.

Now if it's 30mm more wider when fully laden instead of going into the wheel well it will hit the body of the car.

Hope you got what I'm trying to say.
Now if you have a wheel with the right offset that maintains the original distance from the body, would that matter?
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Old 7th January 2007, 20:56   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Kapasi View Post
Samu, i guess that the 205's were touching on the side then. Now what is this offset business?
Sam bhai,
look at this pic it will help you explain what an offset is.


usually stock oem steel rims are at zero offset so if you put 205 on stock rims chances it wont touch only, but when you change to alloys they have a different offset depending upon design they are positioned outwards so with 205 wider tyres it scrapes from underside cause the wheel well cannot accomadate that, if offset is more than 35+ than even an 185 size tyre will touch cause the wheel itself is facing more outwards. try getting alloys of zero or close to zero & that will be fine.
Conclusion:If your alloys offset is zero even 205 wont touch & if offset is more than normal than even an 185 will touch.
P.S : most of the tyre wallas dont know what an offset is they just know the numbers +35 +40 etc etc
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Old 7th January 2007, 21:33   #84
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Now if you have a wheel with the right offset that maintains the original distance from the body, would that matter?
To bring the tyre inside the wheelwell you need negative offset or zero offset depending on the car's OE offset rim(I'm not sure of the Verna's OE rims offset).

The right offset will work but you cant have too much negative offset cause then you risk the tyre touching the suspension components on the inner side.
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Old 7th January 2007, 21:39   #85
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I understand now. Thank you Jitu and vid, I've learned something.

I could not see the pictures in iraghava's post. Strange.

OK I'm going to ask for alloy wheels with as little offset as possible. Since I'm not getting 205's I wont have to worry that much about a little offset. Right?
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Old 7th January 2007, 22:14   #86
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Originally Posted by Sam Kapasi View Post
I understand now. Thank you Jitu and vid, I've learned something.

I could not see the pictures in iraghava's post. Strange.

OK I'm going to ask for alloy wheels with as little offset as possible. Since I'm not getting 205's I wont have to worry that much about a little offset. Right?
I think you have to find the offset in the OEM (stock) rims of your car and then get alloys that have an offset that is as close as possible to that figure. You cannot take it for granted that your stock rims have zero offset. E.g. the offset in my Santro's stock rims is close to +40 mm (crude figure).

Last edited by rks : 7th January 2007 at 22:21.
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Old 7th January 2007, 22:17   #87
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OK I'm going to ask for alloy wheels with as little offset as possible. Since I'm not getting 205's I wont have to worry that much about a little offset. Right?
Since your going for 185/65-R14 now all you have to do is find out the offset for the Verna petrol Alloys and try getting alloys with the same. You cant go wrong that way.

Last edited by Vid6639 : 7th January 2007 at 22:19.
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Old 7th January 2007, 22:22   #88
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I am quite satified with 184/65/14 on my Verna...Overall its best if you want to stick with same stock rims
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Old 7th January 2007, 22:25   #89
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You know something, it struck me also. 5mm is not so much. And If I'm getting 175s with the car, why am I spending time and money for 185?

I may as well go with 195/60/14 with nice alloys. Speedo error toh error ya. And if the ground clearance changes by 4mm, does that really change the car, or (as I am beginning to suspect) is Samurai San a stickler for perfection?

Last edited by Sam Kapasi : 7th January 2007 at 22:28.
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Old 7th January 2007, 22:34   #90
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Yup Sam, you can go for 195/60-R14 easily. Thats what Ishan and me are thinking of. 195/60 will not pose any problem for sure and will look good.

The ground clearance will reduce by 5.5mm which is not very big unless you are in bangalore with huge humps.

Speedo error will be marginal.

The yokos are available easily in 195/60-14 which is a very popular upsize for majority of cars.

Infact Samurai san has 195/60-14 yokos on his baleno. check out his garage.

Last edited by Vid6639 : 7th January 2007 at 22:37.
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