Go Back   Team-BHP > Under the Hood > Modifications & Accessories > Tyre & Alloy wheel Section


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 17th July 2007, 13:11   #1
Team-BHP Support
 
tsk1979's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 22,953
Thanked: 15,648 Times
Default Tube-type to Tubeless conversion?!

Somebody recently told me that he converted the tube-type tires of his safari to Tubeless.
Not exchange, but conversion after paying 500rs for all 5 tyres.
At first I was skeptical, but more enquiry revealed that tire dealers have some kit from UK which does the trick.
I did some googling and found this.
| Freeborn.co.uk | Shop | Accessories | Stans Notubes Tubeless Conversion Kit |
I do not know which kit is he using but I have seen the vehicle myself(a safari) and though the tyre sidewall says Bridgestone Tube-type, there is no tube inside. Conversion cost was 100rs/tire.
So it works, and its working for 20,000+kms now.
The question is, is this kind of conversion safe??
I was very very skeptical whether this will work or not, but as they say "Seeing is believing!".
I am not sure about safety though.
tsk1979 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th July 2007, 13:34   #2
rks
BANNED
 
rks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: ??
Posts: 1,237
Thanked: 8 Times
Default

Would be interesting to know what Bridgestone or other tyre manufacturers have to say about this. If they authorize this conversion, it is definitely a boon. Would the speed/load rating of these tyres be affected? How about the life of the sidewalls, which will take more stress once the tubes are removed?
rks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th July 2007, 13:49   #3
Senior - BHPian
 
nitrous's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: UAE/Lon/Madras
Posts: 6,966
Thanked: 282 Times
Default

He must be using the tube type tyre with tubeless valves.
nitrous is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th July 2007, 13:52   #4
Senior - BHPian
 
esteem_lover's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Madras/Py
Posts: 7,554
Thanked: 445 Times
Default

The 100 bucks just went for the tubeless valves. i am not sure this is a good idea at all.
esteem_lover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th July 2007, 13:54   #5
Team-BHP Support
 
Rtech's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 5,769
Thanked: 212 Times
Default

Thing is, the construction of a tube type tyre is different that that of a tubeless tyre. While you could run a tube in a tubeless, it is not recommended, and probably illegal in some countries, for a dealer to let his customer run a tube-type tyre as tubeless.

However, I think we can only speculate as to what the real safety hazards might be. Any info given on a tyre manufacturers website will be very politically correct for obvious legal reasons. The same reasons why they recommend replacing a tyre incase of a puncture.
Rtech is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th July 2007, 13:56   #6
Senior - BHPian
 
iraghava's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Bhaiyyaland
Posts: 8,028
Thanked: 153 Times
Default

Well I don't think you need a kit for it Tanveer, to make a tube-type tyre into a tubeless oen all you need to do is remove the tube & change the valve of the tyre to a tubeless one. To make a tubeless into a tube tyre the opposite is needed.

However, there are some differences in both types of tyres, more specifically in the design of the tyre beads which in tubeless tyres ensures a proper fit with the rim & no air leak since there is no tube whereas, this job is done by the tube in the tube type tyres. This is also the reason that at times with older steel rims some people face a problem as the rim bends thereby creating an avenue for the air to leak out.

I have never used a tube type tyre as a tubeless one (even though I have had a couple of tubeless tyres running in spare with a tube in them without any problems) but for the aspect of safety wouldn't recommend doing that.

Last edited by iraghava : 17th July 2007 at 14:01.
iraghava is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 17th July 2007, 14:05   #7
Team-BHP Support
 
Rtech's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 5,769
Thanked: 212 Times
Default

Quote:
Well I don't think you need a kit for it Tanveer, to make a tube-type tyre into a tubeless oen all you need to do is remove the tube & change the valve of the tyre to a tubeless one. To make a tubeless into a tube tyre the opposite is needed.
Its not as simple as that. A tubeless tyre has its beading and sidewall constructed to act as the seal between the wheel and the tyre. Thats the POP you hear when inflating a new tubless tyre onto the wheel.

A tyre constructed to be used with a tube would not have had this design criteria in mind. Yes, it may seal. But will that seal hold good in all conditions and all speeds? Obviously it was not designed for that.

I'd say if it does, the person has got off lucky. I will certainly not want to conduct this experiment on the open road with my family and friends in the car. And I will also not recommend that to anyone on or off this forum.
Rtech is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th July 2007, 14:06   #8
Distinguished - BHPian
 
CrAzY dRiVeR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Bangalore / TVM
Posts: 8,974
Thanked: 16,767 Times
Default

have seen some guys riding on tubeless tyres with tubes inside them.

And they later convert their tyres to tubeless by buying the neck valves. Dont know why they didnt run tubeless first up!
CrAzY dRiVeR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th July 2007, 14:30   #9
rks
BANNED
 
rks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: ??
Posts: 1,237
Thanked: 8 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rtech View Post
Its not as simple as that. A tubeless tyre has its beading and sidewall constructed to act as the seal between the wheel and the tyre. Thats the POP you hear when inflating a new tubless tyre onto the wheel.

A tyre constructed to be used with a tube would not have had this design criteria in mind. Yes, it may seal. But will that seal hold good in all conditions and all speeds? Obviously it was not designed for that.
It looks like the modification would work even if the bead lock seal is broken. Quoting from the cited website:
Quote:
Stan's Tubeless System offers two sealing points on the tyre versus other tubeless systems which use only the bead lock as their sealing point. First the bead lock is sealed, as well as the lower portion of the tyre and rim to create a second inner seal. This unique design allows you to break the bead lock seal without losing air pressure. Secondly, the inner seal flexes inwards with the tire to maintain air pressure.
Apparently this is a patented process.

But the question in my mind is regarding the high-speed handling of the converted tyres, especially while cornering hard. Tubetype tyre sidewalls will flex a lot more than those of tubeless tyres because the pressure is held inside the tubes. Once the tubes are removed, the tyre sidewalls have to be more rigid and presumably take more of the load from the sideways forces that would occur during high-speed cornering. The question is whether there is sufficient margin in the design of tubetype tyres for the conversion to go through in general (as opposed to a few specific cases).
rks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th July 2007, 14:45   #10
Senior - BHPian
 
iraghava's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Bhaiyyaland
Posts: 8,028
Thanked: 153 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rtech View Post
Its not as simple as that.
I know that Robin, that's why I already posted this in my post. Please see below:

Quote:
Originally Posted by iraghava View Post
However, there are some differences in both types of tyres, more specifically in the design of the tyre beads which in tubeless tyres ensures a proper fit with the rim & no air leak since there is no tube whereas, this job is done by the tube in the tube type tyres. This is also the reason that at times with older steel rims some people face a problem as the rim bends thereby creating an avenue for the air to leak out.

I have never used a tube type tyre as a tubeless one (even though I have had a couple of tubeless tyres running in spare with a tube in them without any problems) but for the aspect of safety wouldn't recommend doing that.
iraghava is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th July 2007, 14:49   #11
Team-BHP Support
 
Rtech's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 5,769
Thanked: 212 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by iraghava
I know that Robin, that's why I already posted this in my post. Please see below:
You edited your post after I read it and while I was replying to it. Anyways...
Rtech is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th July 2007, 14:54   #12
Team-BHP Support
 
Jaggu's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 17,752
Thanked: 7,475 Times
Default

WOULDN'T RECOMMEND THE BELOW

lol i have my spare which is tubed but converted to tubeless.

When i bought the non directional spare after the first Ventura tore, the tyre wallah asked me if i wanted to keep the tube separate? for use in case of any emergency with the other 4 venturas.

So i agreed and put the MRF on my OE rim with the tubeless tyre valve and kept it as spare tyre (anyway it is going to be used as a spare coz of thread difference), while the tube is in my dicky for emergency use.

Funny part the MRF hold PSI better compared to Venturas, yup i havent used the spare yet (TOUCH WOOD)

Last edited by Jaggu : 17th July 2007 at 14:56.
Jaggu is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 17th July 2007, 14:58   #13
Senior - BHPian
 
iraghava's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Bhaiyyaland
Posts: 8,028
Thanked: 153 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rtech View Post
You edited your post after I read it and while I was replying to it. Anyways...
Aaahh, sorry about that I was typing in the quick post window & instead of clicking on the "Go Advanced" button accidentally clicked on the "Post Quick Reply" button. So, I had to again edit the post to complete it.
iraghava is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18th July 2007, 00:42   #14
Team-BHP Support
 
tsk1979's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 22,953
Thanked: 15,648 Times
Default

Hmm, its not just the valve, they also did some "rim setting". Could not find out the details.
The tires retain pressure pretty good, and have run for 20000kms+.
Lots of highway driving, and its a safari.
Jaggu, what all changes were made for your conversion?

I am curious to know about safety implications. Could not find anything on google, and info from manufacturers will never be reliable due to legal reasons.
tsk1979 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18th July 2007, 11:14   #15
Team-BHP Support
 
Jaggu's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 17,752
Thanked: 7,475 Times
Default

zilch mods whatsoever, this is the biggest MRF dealer in JC Road, i asked him if it will work, he said dont worry it will.

OE rim, OE JK tyre - tubeless valve and MRF Zigma VTS 195 70 14 Tyres.
Jaggu is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Bikers Beware: Tube Type, Tubeless and Tire conundrum! Shivank Motorbikes 27 23rd September 2016 15:06
Tube-Type Tyres Converted to Tubeless - Is it safe? bhp Tyre & Alloy wheel Section 46 7th March 2010 20:52
Tubeless or tube type for wagonR without PS english Tyre & Alloy wheel Section 15 29th July 2008 19:20
"Tube type" tubeless tyre vRS Tyre & Alloy wheel Section 4 8th March 2006 23:39
Tube inside tubeless tires... Samurai Tyre & Alloy wheel Section 1 25th February 2005 16:32


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 01:59.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks