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Old 3rd May 2011, 15:33   #481
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Default Re: Michelin XM1+

I upgraded from 165/80 R15 JK Tornados to 185/70 R14 Michelin Energy XM1+.

Reason for upgrade:
Car (Ritz Diesel) would be difficult to control at more than 30-40 kmph on any curved roads. Strangely enough, it is perfectly easy to cut in and out on city traffic or take sharp turns (albeit at a slower speed). Where it got scary was taking sweeping curves like on a flyover or highway where you cant slow down easily.

Secondary objectives were better braking, grip and comfort, in that order.

So far I see the improvements as:
Noise - 20% improvement
Comfort on good roads - 20%

Comfort on average to bad roads - 5% (I am pretty disappointed with this since I have been reading all the hype about the improvement in ride quality. Maybe this has to do with me keeping the manufacturer's recommended tyre pressure Front 36, Rear 33 instead of lesser pressure, but that was the same pressure I used to keep on the JKs and the improvement has been only marginal. Also I do a lot of highway driving so cant really under-inflate the tyres, besides, the manufacturer's recommendation is there for a reason).

Braking distance - Around the same as before but less noise and skids less.
Marginal improvement in grip.
Steering slightly heavier at city speeds but not a problem.

Handling:
On a straight line, regular highway and city driving, I dont see any improvement from the JKs, which did a decent job.
Stability while doing curves, as described: Huge improvement from before, though the 'tall-boy' handling limits still need to be respected.

Overall conclusion: 90% of the improvement comes from the wider tyres (it is criminal of Maruti to not include them as stock ). 10% perhaps due to Michelin XM1+. If I was to upgrade again and had the option of JKs or other cheaper tyres at the upgraded size, I would go for those. I feel that a lot of the credit that people who upgraded their tyres give to the make or brand of tyre, should really go to the improved tyre size when compared to stock.

Last edited by chncar : 3rd May 2011 at 15:46.
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Old 3rd May 2011, 16:54   #482
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Default Re: Michelin XM1+

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Originally Posted by chncar View Post
I upgraded from 165/80 R15 JK Tornados to 185/70 R14 Michelin Energy XM1+.
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I see you have down sized your tyre (R15 -> R14) or its a typo?
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Old 3rd May 2011, 18:18   #483
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Default Re: Michelin XM1+

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Originally Posted by devrajman View Post
I see you have down sized your tyre (R15 -> R14) or its a typo?
Sorry thats a typo, stock tyres on Ritz are 165/80 R14.

Last edited by chncar : 3rd May 2011 at 18:32.
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Old 3rd May 2011, 18:47   #484
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Default Re: Michelin XM1+

Quote:
Originally Posted by chncar View Post
I upgraded from 165/80 R15 JK Tornados to 185/70 R14 Michelin Energy XM1+.

Comfort on average to bad roads - 5% (I am pretty disappointed with this since I have been reading all the hype about the improvement in ride quality. Maybe this has to do with me keeping the manufacturer's recommended tyre pressure Front 36, Rear 33 instead of lesser pressure, but that was the same pressure I used to keep on the JKs and the improvement has been only marginal. Also I do a lot of highway driving so cant really under-inflate the tyres, besides, the manufacturer's recommendation is there for a reason).

Handling:
On a straight line, regular highway and city driving, I dont see any improvement from the JKs, which did a decent job.
Stability while doing curves, as described: Huge improvement from before, though the 'tall-boy' handling limits still need to be respected.
You have upgraded the tires but are still using manufacturers recommended air pressure for the 165 width tires. How can you expect any comfort? Get the tire pressure down to that recommended for the ZXi model of your car. Read the tire pressure sticker located in your front right side door sill and fill accordingly. In case it is not there reduce pressure to 29psi, that is what is recommended for the Swift Zxi equipped with the 185 profile tires.

JK in themselves are not bad. Not as grippy as the Yokos or Michelins but comfort levels are up there with any other brand. My Swift zxi are equipped with the same and I have seen no reason to change them prematurely. Another friend who is also a forum member has travelled far and wide on and off roads in his 185/70R14 JK Vectra equipped Swift zxi and no complaints at all.

Last edited by khoj : 3rd May 2011 at 18:48.
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Old 26th November 2011, 19:03   #485
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Thumbs down Poor life of XM1 (Not plus)

I changed to Michelin XM1 (not XM1+) 155/65R13 on my Wagon R about 20,000KM ago (in early 2009). I think XM1+ were launched a few months afterwards in 155/65R13 category. In less than 20K KM, the tread is almost gone. It has gone bald way too earlier than even Sehwag. The tires have been well maintained, being rotated every 5,000 KM and the alignment always maintained.

Here is the picture of the tire with best tread. The poorest one is almost bald. I just rotated this "good" treaded tire to the front axle. As you can see, it is brimming to the point of being worn upto the tread indicator.
Michelin XM1+-imag0204.1.jpg

Is such a short treadwear (ab)normal for XM1s? I have read other stories of XM1s going kaput within 20K KMs (Here (Michelin XM1+) is one story of XM1+ fubar'ed at 16K) .

Upon enquiry with Michelin they told me that the tyres that I have are grey-market ones (Made In Thailand) and hence carry no warranty and they can't really do anything about it. But my tyre dealer DID give me a warranty card when I had insisted at the time of purchase (which he probably illegal to do on a grey-market stock). The dealer could get into big trouble if I pursue a case against Michelin over not honoring warranty'ed tire lasting so short, because then Michelin would wash their hands off and instead go after the dealer for giving warranty on grey market tire (I'm old time customer of the dealer, that's why he might have given me a warranty card when I had insisted on getting one, probably thinking that it would go into my dustbin anyway, but it went straight to my car file. I don't want him to get into trouble, but his response to this episode has been a bit non-chalant).

I'm otherwise a satisfied customer of Michelin. I'm running XM1+ 180/70R13 on another car (Swift) which has not even been detreaded 1/3rd after 26,000 KM, looks like it will easily last 50K-55K+.

I'm wondering if the short life of my tires have been due to XM vs XM1+ thingy, or has it been due to the difference between build quality of 155/65R13 as opposed to 180/70R14 (I believe it is former).

I was thinking about changing these 4 bald ones on my Wagon-R to XM1+, this time. I inquired with a few Michelin authorized dealers, and one of them showed me XM1+ with ISI mark (ISI Mark on tyres - A requirement from 17th May 2010 onwards?), but manufactured in Thailand. "Made in Thailand" tag is making me cringe, bringing horrifying images of another set of baldies in their 20s!

Q1. Are all genuine, FRESHLY STOCKED (like at most 2-3 month old manufacturing date) Michelins with ISI mark being sold by authorized dealers, made in Thailand? I don't remember the XM1+ running on my Swift being made in Thailand (I will have to un-mount the tire to verify that on the inside). If there is some stock which is "Made in India", I would rather go with it. Is it correct that all white-market Michelins are either manufactured in Thailand or China?

Q2. Even the ones which have de-treaded so fast have not had even 1 puncture, EVER, in its 20K life. Also, they have been silent when being driven, and comfortable, that's why my inclination is still with Michelins.

I know there are dedicated threads for Yoko A-Drives and Apollo Aceleres, and that this question has been beaten to death, but is it good idea to stay with Michelins or is it worth trying Yokos/Aceleres once?
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Old 27th November 2011, 11:57   #486
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Default Re: Poor life of XM1 (Not plus)

Quote:
Originally Posted by gsbhatia View Post
I changed to Michelin XM1 (not XM1+) 155/65R13 on my Wagon R about 20,000KM ago (in early 2009). I think XM1+ were launched a few months afterwards in 155/65R13 category. In less than 20K KM, the tread is almost gone. It has gone bald way too earlier than even Sehwag. The tires have been well maintained, being rotated every 5,000 KM and the alignment always maintained.

Here is the picture of the tire with best tread. The poorest one is almost bald. I just rotated this "good" treaded tire to the front axle. As you can see, it is brimming to the point of being worn upto the tread indicator.
Attachment 847771

Is such a short treadwear (ab)normal for XM1s? I have read other stories of XM1s going kaput within 20K KMs (Here (Michelin XM1+) is one story of XM1+ fubar'ed at 16K) .

Upon enquiry with Michelin they told me that the tyres that I have are grey-market ones (Made In Thailand) and hence carry no warranty and they can't really do anything about it. But my tyre dealer DID give me a warranty card when I had insisted at the time of purchase (which he probably illegal to do on a grey-market stock). The dealer could get into big trouble if I pursue a case against Michelin over not honoring warranty'ed tire lasting so short, because then Michelin would wash their hands off and instead go after the dealer for giving warranty on grey market tire (I'm old time customer of the dealer, that's why he might have given me a warranty card when I had insisted on getting one, probably thinking that it would go into my dustbin anyway, but it went straight to my car file. I don't want him to get into trouble, but his response to this episode has been a bit non-chalant).

I'm otherwise a satisfied customer of Michelin. I'm running XM1+ 180/70R13 on another car (Swift) which has not even been detreaded 1/3rd after 26,000 KM, looks like it will easily last 50K-55K+.

I'm wondering if the short life of my tires have been due to XM vs XM1+ thingy, or has it been due to the difference between build quality of 155/65R13 as opposed to 180/70R14 (I believe it is former).

I was thinking about changing these 4 bald ones on my Wagon-R to XM1+, this time. I inquired with a few Michelin authorized dealers, and one of them showed me XM1+ with ISI mark (ISI Mark on tyres - A requirement from 17th May 2010 onwards?), but manufactured in Thailand. "Made in Thailand" tag is making me cringe, bringing horrifying images of another set of baldies in their 20s!

Q1. Are all genuine, FRESHLY STOCKED (like at most 2-3 month old manufacturing date) Michelins with ISI mark being sold by authorized dealers, made in Thailand? I don't remember the XM1+ running on my Swift being made in Thailand (I will have to un-mount the tire to verify that on the inside). If there is some stock which is "Made in India", I would rather go with it. Is it correct that all white-market Michelins are either manufactured in Thailand or China?

Q2. Even the ones which have de-treaded so fast have not had even 1 puncture, EVER, in its 20K life. Also, they have been silent when being driven, and comfortable, that's why my inclination is still with Michelins.

I know there are dedicated threads for Yoko A-Drives and Apollo Aceleres, and that this question has been beaten to death, but is it good idea to stay with Michelins or is it worth trying Yokos/Aceleres once?
gsbhatia, sorry to know about the early wear out of XM1.
For your information, I have been using the same XM1 on WagonR for the last 4.5 years and logged 40,000 KMs during this time.
There is still enough thread on the tires to last at least another 7 to 10,000 KMs. Will take picture of the thread and post them soon.
Though I do not know the reason for the early wear out in your case, I wanted to share my good experience with you.
Also I have Michelin Energy XM1 on my Honda City which I specifically opted for during the PDI.
If I am not mistaken Michelin plant is yet to produce tires in India and until such time the tires would be imported from other countries such as Thailand, China etc.,


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Old 27th November 2011, 12:33   #487
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Default Re: Michelin XM1+

@gsbhatia and Habanero City, what tyre pressures were being generally maintained by you, and how frequently were the tyres being aligned ? Would be very interesting to hear from both of you on this
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Old 27th November 2011, 15:57   #488
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Default Re: Michelin XM1+

Pressure of 33 psi on all 4, checked at every tankful. Alignment done every 5000 KM, during tire rotation.

Tyres running on 13" 5.5JJ Prestige alloys (100 PCD, 38 ET) [code#234 on Prestige Design ... alloy gallery page]. Ideal wheel size for 155/65R13 tire is 5J, but according to Michelin website, it can fit wheel width sizes from 4.5 through 5.5, so, I wouldn't imagine it to cause tires to eat up any faster.
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Old 27th November 2011, 16:51   #489
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Default Re: Michelin XM1+

gsbhatia: I believe your's might be a one off case. My swift had the XM1's (and not the XM1+)and they lasted for approx 46000 Kms (and still had life for approx 2000 Kms more) when I changed it.
LIke you, I used to get alignment/balancing/rotation done every 5000 KMs.
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Old 27th November 2011, 17:49   #490
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Default Re: Michelin XM1+

Quote:
Originally Posted by mooza View Post
@gsbhatia and Habanero City, what tyre pressures were being generally maintained by you, and how frequently were the tyres being aligned ? Would be very interesting to hear from both of you on this
mooza, Tire pressure is maintained at 33 psi and alignment is done every 5,000 KM, but balancing and rotation is done at 10,000 KM which is according to Michelin's recommendation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gsbhatia View Post
Pressure of 33 psi on all 4, checked at every tankful. Alignment done every 5000 KM, during tire rotation.

Tyres running on 13" 5.5JJ Prestige alloys (100 PCD, 38 ET) [code#234 on Prestige Design ... alloy gallery page]. Ideal wheel size for 155/65R13 tire is 5J, but according to Michelin website, it can fit wheel width sizes from 4.5 through 5.5, so, I wouldn't imagine it to cause tires to eat up any faster.
gsbhatia, the tires are mounted on OE rims, I am not sure what J the OE rims are.
My car is 2002 model and 155/65/R13 is an "upsize" actually as the OE size is 145/70/R13.

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Old 27th November 2011, 18:20   #491
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Default Re: Michelin XM1+

Quote:
Michelin plant is yet to produce tires in India
As I understand it for some time, most of the tyres that Michelin sells in India are going to be from Thailand plant except some of the high-end tires that come from Europe. By law, all Michelin tyres sold in the country and imported through the correct channel will have the ISI mark, whether or not they are produced in India.

Michelin does not produce any of its tyres in India, it's all imported stock. They don't have a plant yet, but it's coming up.

Michelin Tamilnadu - www.michelin.in

As you can see, the focus will be on Truck and bus tires, so not sure it will answer local stock questions about car tires.

Michelin India TamilNadu Tyres Pvt. Ltd. (MITTPL) / News / News & Promotions / Home - www.michelin.in

The wear is indeed abnormal for 20k kms but a lot depends on the car, the batch the tyres came from, how long they were on the shelf, the steering behaviour (of the car/driver) etc. For example, my T-Jet came with NCT5 and the fronts already look like they need a change - at 5k kms. The rears look fresh as a daisy, it's the aggressive surface, hard braking and stop-and-go traffic of Gurgaon along with an enthusiastic driving style that is taking its toll.
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Old 10th December 2011, 23:05   #492
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Default Re: Poor life of XM1 (Not plus)

Quote:
Originally Posted by gsbhatia View Post
Here is the picture of the tire with best tread. The poorest one is almost bald.
The very fact that you have tyres with different wear means your alignment was not right. I have the same tyres on my esteem and they have run 60000 kms and they are on their last legs, but still have enough tread. But after, the last time i did the alignment, the rear tyres just disappeared in front of my eyes. I could see them wearing out EVERYDAY. I went back to the person who did the alignment and he immediately apologized and gave me 2 tyres which had similar wear as my front tyres.
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Old 17th July 2012, 13:10   #493
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Default Re: Michelin XM1+

My Swift Zdi with Michilin XM1+ has done around 44000 now and still good enough to go
an another 10000.

No doubt, XM1+ is great in every aspect.
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Old 30th October 2012, 19:43   #494
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Default Re: Michelin XM1+

I had my left front XM1+ tire cut this morning. Stopped the vehicle and changed to spare tyre.

Got it verified with Michelin guys, they are suggesting a tyre change.

My concern, i have used the current ones for close to 40k kms with tyre rotations including the spare at 5k kms interval. Life on the tyre is still about 25k kms. With the new tyre if i purchase will there be uneven wear and tear? If yes, how do I manage without a spare :(

Am I left with no choice but to buy 5 new ones or buy 1 new one and always use it as spare or can I get a decent seconds XM1+ with still some life left in it.

Please suggest
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Old 31st October 2012, 08:18   #495
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Default Re: Michelin XM1+

Quote:
Originally Posted by deepakchiniwal View Post
My concern, i have used the current ones for close to 40k kms with tyre rotations including the spare at 5k kms interval. Life on the tyre is still about 25k kms. With the new tyre if i purchase will there be uneven wear and tear? If yes, how do I manage without a spare :(

Am I left with no choice but to buy 5 new ones or buy 1 new one and always use it as spare or can I get a decent seconds XM1+ with still some life left in it.

Please suggest
How old are your current tires?
If you have used them for 40k KM, then you may consider replacing them if your use involves highway rides.
If you plan to continue with the current set, then you may buy an old spare tire (not more than INR 500) and manage until the next replacement of 5 tires.
Buying a single new tire with others having done 40k KM does not make much sense, unless you plan to change the remaining 4 within a month or so.
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