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Old 2nd May 2009, 12:27   #1
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Default Problems with worn out Tyres

My tyres are due for replacement and I am trying to get the maximum out of the worn out tyres before replacing it. In the meanwhile, I could observe some discomfort in the ride and was worried if there could be problems associated with my suspension as well.

I feel a braking effect when the car runs over a speed bump. I also feel waddle effect mostly when drving on the cement drive ways. When I was looking through the Workshop Manual of SWIFT, I could observe the following, which seem to be the case for me.

Quote:
"Waddle is side to side movement at the front and/or rear of the vehicle. It is caused by the steel belt not being straight within the tire. It is most noticeable at a low speed, 8 to 48 kph (5 to 30 mph). It is possible to locate the faulty tire by road testing the vehicle. If it is on the rear, the rear end of the vehicle shakes from side to side or “waddles”. To the driver in the seat, it feels as though someone is pushing on the side of vehicle. If the faulty tire is on the front, waddling is more visual. The front sheet metal appears to be moving back and forth and the driver feels as though he is at the pivot point in vehicle. Waddle can be quickly diagnosed by using Tire Problem Detector (TPD) and following the equipment manufacture’s recommendations."
I am not sure if the workshop manual I referred to is applicable to the SWIFT models in India (The manual states the following with respect to its applicability - SWIFT (RS415) vehicles on and after following vehicle identification numbers (VINs) - JSAEZC21S00100001). However the above seems to be generic statement and should be relevant for all vehicles.

I would like to hear from experts as to what other problems the worn out tyre(s) may lead to.

Thanks in advance.
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Old 2nd May 2009, 15:19   #2
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My tyres are due for replacement and I am trying to get the maximum out of the worn out tyres
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as to what other problems the worn out tyre(s) may lead to.
Goldsun, my apologies if I sound too upfront, but this is a classic case of "penny wise, pound foolish". For all the seatbelts, airbags & ABS that we rave about, safety crucially depends on those 4 little palm-sized contact patches that your tyre has on the road. I frequently ridicule taxi & truck drivers for driving on worn-out tyres. But c'mon, you are on Team-BHP and surely know better?

By trying to get the maximum out of your worn out tyres, you are putting your life, and that of others on the road, in danger. Our roads aren't safe to begin with; it will require just one emergency manouveur before you are knocking on heaven's doors.

There is only one thing you need to do : Go out and buy some brand new tyres! NOW
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Old 2nd May 2009, 15:42   #3
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+1 to whatever GTO said.

I made the same mistake of trying to extract as much as possible from existing tyres and that resulted in a couple of mishaps. Remember worn out tyres offer you the least braking assitance and nobody would want that.

Keep all other things as lower priority and immediately change to better rubber and once clad, you'll know the difference.
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Old 2nd May 2009, 15:47   #4
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Worn tyres (with minimal or next to nil tread depth... not ones with inner chord or other innards showing!) do not pose any kind of risk on dry roads normal roads! In fact handling may improve.

Last edited by Raccoon : 2nd May 2009 at 15:48.
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Old 2nd May 2009, 15:51   #5
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Originally Posted by Raccoon View Post
Worn tyres (with minimal or next to nil tread depth... not ones with inner chord or other innards showing!) do not pose any kind of risk on dry roads normal roads! In fact handling may improve.
No ways! I hope you aren't assuming them to become slicks (a la F1). Remember, bald tyres have effectively lost the grippy rubber and are a recipe for disaster.
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Old 2nd May 2009, 16:01   #6
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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
...There is only one thing you need to do : Go out and buy some brand new tyres! NOW
GoldSun,

Do not under-estimate this advice! You really need to do this ASAP. For you own goodness, Please!

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Worn tyres (with minimal or next to nil tread depth... not ones with inner chord or other innards showing!) do not pose any kind of risk on dry roads normal roads! In fact handling may improve.
Raccoon, good one! But seriously, I hope you do not follow your advice.
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Old 2nd May 2009, 18:26   #7
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The guy knows he's got next to nil life left on those tyres, experiences all kinds of problems on them and actually looks up the terminology for the cause,and then starts a thread to ask how much more he can squeeze from them !! Search me Add to that he's not a newbie but an active BHP'ian
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Old 2nd May 2009, 19:36   #8
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...Add to that he's not a newbie but an active BHP'ian
Joined on Dec 2005 and post count 173: active is it?

Maybe that is the reason why he is trying this.
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Old 2nd May 2009, 23:08   #9
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Quote:
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No ways! I hope you aren't assuming them to become slicks (a la F1). Remember, bald tyres have effectively lost the grippy rubber and are a recipe for disaster.
Yes you could say that! Please note that I clearly said worn means there is still rubber on the tyre... not the chord and stuff starting to show as is visbile mostly in some comercial vehicles... that is dangerous, for sure.

I have personally driven on nearly bald tyres on my car. No loss of grip on dry tarmac! I'd say you guys are scaring the guy! But monsoon is around the corner, so a change should be on the cards.
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Old 3rd May 2009, 19:58   #10
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Quote:
Please note that I clearly said worn means there is still rubber on the tyre
The Goodyear Eagle F1s on my C220 (at about 35,000 kms) & the Bridgestone S322s on my Vtec (in the high 40,000) still had rubber on the tyres when I got them replaced. And no, they didn't have any of the chords and stuff showing either. Butttttttttttttttttttt either car STILL used to slip and slide all around. Here is why:

In a typical Indian driving cycle, tyres will start balding at about 35000 - 45000 kms and / or 3 - 5 years.

1. Tyre rubber hardens with use, you will see the contact patch getting less grippy at this point.

2. Rubber deteriorates with age. As a rule, I'd never use tyres that are over 4 - 5 years in a high speed car.

3. Tyre structurally wears out. You can bet that a tyre that's run 5 years + 40,000 kms is pretty much weak on the insides.

4. Worn out tyres suffer from heat buildup. This is the reason why they are more likely to blow out.

Thus, most likely, by the time that you have bald / wornout tyres on your car, the rubber has hardened, deteriorated, is structurally weak, will run hot and has lost most of the grippy stuff. Further, bald tyres will also puncture more easily.

I am much too concerned about my safety & that of others on the road to be driving around on worn-out / bald tyres. Whether in the wet or in the dry, the above-mentioned points clearly show them as a risky proposition.

Lastly, bald (from wear & tear) road car tyres & the slicks on racing cars are NOT the same. Racing slicks are specifically manufactured using soft (read grippy) rubber and for, most likely, a standard driving condition. They don't even consider the million heat + cool cycles that a road tyre is designed for. One of the few road tyres that I'd compare to racing slicks is the rubber on the BMW M3 CSL. Again, that is a slick tyre, NOT bald.
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Old 3rd May 2009, 20:17   #11
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Yes I know rubber will degrade with age and loose some grip. Anyway, he hasn't mentioned the age of his tyres... so I was kinda assuming they aren't too old.

All this will also depend on his driving style. If hes a moderate driver, it may not matter much. For someone who does fast highway driving (or even in city), it would matter. You gotta know the current capabilities of your rubber... I'd say thats slightly more important. If you can't gauge that well, you can crash with the best new rubber as well.
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Old 3rd May 2009, 20:51   #12
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GTO - DQ. For a car that should hopefully end the year with about 30-35k km, should the tyres last longer - because by the above logic - they've had less hardening due to age?

Just a DQ - even if it means another 3k more without replacement, so be it. Whatsay?
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Old 3rd May 2009, 21:39   #13
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What is the minimum tread in millimeters required as per law?
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Old 3rd May 2009, 22:09   #14
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Originally Posted by janitha View Post
What is the minimum tread in millimeters required as per law?
Does India have a regulation on this? Driving a transport vehicle (yellow number plate) vehicle with worn out tyres is an offence. I doubt if it is mandated on non-transport (white number plate private) vehicle. Thwak me if I am wrong.
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Old 3rd May 2009, 23:23   #15
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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Go out and buy some brand new tyres! NOW
I guess yours is a VXI model and take this replacement opportunity for upgrading the size from 165/80/R14 to 185/70/R14 either with Michi or BS Potenza GIII's

Your signature says it all
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