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Old 3rd July 2010, 17:12   #16
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Hi Gaurav,

I understand your frustration and I believe I would have reacted in the same way if something like this happened to me and all the more if I did not get help and respect from the representative of a reputed brand like Yokohama.

However, as Nikhil has rightly pointed out, one cannot blame the manufacturer alone as we cannot remember where and how we have driven in the past. I suggest you speak to Mr. Sanjay Chatterjee and take it from there.

Here's my story. I have personally used a set of 195/60/R15 Goodyear Eagle F1 tires on my Swift in the past and believe me, as they got older, they bacame tremendously noisy. I used them for a good 28k kms. Even I complained at that time about the noise but realised that this is normal with a high performance tires. However, when I changed my tires, I still went in for a high performance tire and this time the 205/55/R15 Yokohama S-Drives (same size and make as yours) and you may not believe me if I tell you this but a month after I had fitted them, I drove from Bandra West to Belapur and back. The roads on that stretch are fine and even better once on the Palm Beach Road which is like a runway. This is a total of around 90kms of driving. On my return I decided to get my tire air pressure checked and the guy filing the air spotted a nail in my tire. So I immediately got the tire checked and we found 3 nails at different areas in the tire. Air was leaking out very very slowly so I could not see or feel any difference in the tire pressure. I was shocked but happy that the tire lasted the whole 90km drive with 3 nails in it. I applaud the tire and the manufacturer!! But I am sure, that if the tire did give way, I would have probably abused the tire and manufacturer for making a tire that is so prone to punctures and that too when the tire was just 1 month old. Now, anyone from Mumbai who has driven on the stretch mentioned by me would agree with me, when I say the road is like a runway so technically I have not driven over any bad roads but little did I know that even on a runway kind of road, there would be nails, and that too 3 of them which would pierce my tire and almost damage them completly.

I had got all 3 punctures repaired and still using my S-Drives with no issues what-so-ever. Its been over 12k kms after the incident. However, they have become a bit noiser than before but Im not complaining :-)
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Old 3rd July 2010, 23:13   #17
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Originally Posted by MutantX View Post
actually i planed to either get a A drive or an S drive for my i10. Now on seeing this problem, i would need suggestion from you guys on which set of tyres are best suited if i want to cut out on the cabin noise. I want grip, stablity @ high speeds and less noise. I dunt mind if it lasts only for 25-30K which I am perfectly OK with!
Go for Yokohama A539, you shall not repent. Road noise is low, excellent grip even on wet surfaces and amazing tread pattern, I couldn't have asked for anything better at such a competitive price for my Xing.

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Originally Posted by maglev View Post
Warranties on almost all tires irrespective of brand or tire type are pretty much a joke, hardly ever one see's a person getting a claim from the tire manufacturer.
Its best to have a trusted dealer and to ensure that the tire's are not more than 5 months old in the worst case, as rubber ages with time so if a tire has not been used for a long period of time it is rather useless. My advice is not buy such tires even if you get them cheaper or at a discount.

The following case is more than a decade old. My dad got Apollo Amazers for his 800 and they started wearing out at a fast pace. He took the car to Apollo guys who were trying to wash their hands off the matter until they got some Gyan on rubber from an industry veteran. They eventually agreed on the manufacturing flaw and some discount was offered on the new set. Having radials those time was like having Advans now.

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Originally Posted by Epic View Post
Hi Gaurav,

I understand your frustration and I believe I would have reacted in the same way if something like this happened to me and all the more if I did not get help and respect from the representative of a reputed brand like Yokohama.

However, as Nikhil has rightly pointed out, one cannot blame the manufacturer alone as we cannot remember where and how we have driven in the past. I suggest you speak to Mr. Sanjay Chatterjee and take it from there.

Here's my story. I have personally used a set of 195/60/R15 Goodyear Eagle F1 tires on my Swift in the past and believe me, as they got older, they bacame tremendously noisy. I used them for a good 28k kms. Even I complained at that time about the noise but realised that this is normal with a high performance tires. However, when I changed my tires, I still went in for a high performance tire and this time the 205/55/R15 Yokohama S-Drives (same size and make as yours) and you may not believe me if I tell you this but a month after I had fitted them, I drove from Bandra West to Belapur and back. The roads on that stretch are fine and even better once on the Palm Beach Road which is like a runway. This is a total of around 90kms of driving. On my return I decided to get my tire air pressure checked and the guy filing the air spotted a nail in my tire. So I immediately got the tire checked and we found 3 nails at different areas in the tire. Air was leaking out very very slowly so I could not see or feel any difference in the tire pressure. I was shocked but happy that the tire lasted the whole 90km drive with 3 nails in it. I applaud the tire and the manufacturer!! But I am sure, that if the tire did give way, I would have probably abused the tire and manufacturer for making a tire that is so prone to punctures and that too when the tire was just 1 month old. Now, anyone from Mumbai who has driven on the stretch mentioned by me would agree with me, when I say the road is like a runway so technically I have not driven over any bad roads but little did I know that even on a runway kind of road, there would be nails, and that too 3 of them which would pierce my tire and almost damage them completly.

I had got all 3 punctures repaired and still using my S-Drives with no issues what-so-ever. Its been over 12k kms after the incident. However, they have become a bit noiser than before but Im not complaining :-)
Buddy, few have the courage to say something like this. I appreciate your logical take, drive safe.
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Old 4th July 2010, 22:41   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nikhilb2008 View Post
Unfortunately, no imported tyre can be driven like MRF/Apollos/Bridgestones on our roads. YOu have to take care.
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They are more prone to damage on our Indian roads.
I'm sorry, but I don't buy this at all. Some of the roads in Boston were as bad as / worse off than what Bombay has to offer (including jarring potholes). And, unlike India, tyres in Boston have to cope with extreme temperature changes too (super cold in winter, warm in summer). This thing about Indian driving conditions being the worst in the world is a myth. I don't remember Bangalore roads that well, yet can state that the condition of roads from Mumbai / Delhi / Chennai is not bad at all. Took a long road trip around Kerala last year and was very impressed with the highways. Fact is, our highway network has also tremendously improved. The Bombay - Nasik, Bombay-Pune and Bombay-Goa roads are excellent (these three are my regular routes). Get this, my daily 13 km drive to work does NOT have a single pothole.

So, lets stop blaming our roads for fragile tyres giving up. Not only have our road conditions improved, but other countries have massive potholes too. If a tyre fails because of a pothole, lets call it just that. There is nothing Indian or international about potholes. They exist everywhere.

Last edited by GTO : 4th July 2010 at 22:46.
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Old 4th July 2010, 23:30   #19
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Originally Posted by maglev View Post
Warranties on almost all tires irrespective of brand or tire type are pretty much a joke, hardly ever one see's a person getting a claim from the tire manufacturer.
JK replaced my tyre in a warranty claim - my tubeless tyre had leaks. I went to Sai Service, Pune with my warranty claim - because these were the OEM JK tyres. Sai Service called the JK guy. The JK guy took me to a nearby JK dealer - tested my tyre & agreed with my claim, gave me a brand new tyre from the same dealer. It took around 1 to 1.5 hours totally.
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Old 5th July 2010, 00:07   #20
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Originally Posted by tsk13 View Post
The following case is more than a decade old. My dad got Apollo Amazers for his 800 and they started wearing out at a fast pace. He took the car to Apollo guys who were trying to wash their hands off the matter until they got some Gyan on rubber from an industry veteran. They eventually agreed on the manufacturing flaw and some discount was offered on the new set. Having radials those time was like having Advans now.

Times have changed buddy, getting warranty claims now is very difficult especially with the kind of bills one usually gets.



Quote:
Originally Posted by carboy View Post
JK replaced my tyre in a warranty claim - my tubeless tyre had leaks. I went to Sai Service, Pune with my warranty claim - because these were the OEM JK tyres. Sai Service called the JK guy. The JK guy took me to a nearby JK dealer - tested my tyre & agreed with my claim, gave me a brand new tyre from the same dealer. It took around 1 to 1.5 hours totally.

Even I got my OE JK radials (Zen VX) changed under warranty, but buddy try getting this done on non OE tires and then you'll see what I am talking about.

P.S.: I am not saying its not possible, but near it none the less.

Last edited by maglev : 5th July 2010 at 00:09.
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Old 5th July 2010, 00:46   #21
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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
I'm sorry, but I don't buy this at all. Some of the roads in Boston were as bad as / worse off than what Bombay has to offer (including jarring potholes). And, unlike India, tyres in Boston have to cope with extreme temperature changes too (super cold in winter, warm in summer). This thing about Indian driving conditions being the worst in the world is a myth. I don't remember Bangalore roads that well, yet can state that the condition of roads from Mumbai / Delhi / Chennai is not bad at all. Took a long road trip around Kerala last year and was very impressed with the highways. Fact is, our highway network has also tremendously improved. The Bombay - Nasik, Bombay-Pune and Bombay-Goa roads are excellent (these three are my regular routes). Get this, my daily 13 km drive to work does NOT have a single pothole.

So, lets stop blaming our roads for fragile tyres giving up. Not only have our road conditions improved, but other countries have massive potholes too. If a tyre fails because of a pothole, lets call it just that. There is nothing Indian or international about potholes. They exist everywhere.
Hmm i do not buy what's said here.

I've not been to boston , so can not comment on boston roads. But have been to lot of cities in US, Canada and roads you simply can not compare them with INdia. They are absolutely pleasant to drive.
To back my theory, in US Interstates avg speed is around 60MPH, and what's avg in INdia hardly 55-60 KMPH.
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Old 5th July 2010, 01:28   #22
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^^ Akas, Boston really does have terrible road infrastructure. I agree that overall, American roads are amongst the worlds best (Boston is an exception). However, the fact remains that no tyre manufacturer can sell a tyre in the USA that states "Will work in all cities except Boston".
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Old 5th July 2010, 02:19   #23
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Interesting thread; i am planning on getting Yoko S-Drives or Michelin PP3/2 for my lancer, and road noise is a major factor in my driving experience. Seeing the title of this thread, i really wondered what was the matter with the S-drives. And now i am thinking if i should cancel my S-drives and get the Michelin instead. I was totally unaware that performance tyres are noisier than other 'normal' tyres. Should I?

wrt roads, india and internationally, i doubt anyone can really comment on them in the perspective of tyres. I agree sure, roads DO make a lot of difference on the characteristics of a tyre but essentially, what really factors in is HOW someone drives. I can kill a couple of brand new tyres driving Pune-Mumbai but also drive there and back in 8 year old super hardened, super noisy tires.
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Old 5th July 2010, 08:26   #24
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There were at least 1.5m potholes on British roads...news guardian.co.uk.
Isn't it interesting to find out no of potholes / sq mile ?
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Old 5th July 2010, 10:33   #25
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I think Gaurav's primary concern is " Road noise " which has increased considerably all of a sudden.
IMHO, Sidewall bulge after hitting a pothole is a matter of luck & the angle at which you hit the pothole. Sometimes after hitting a big pothole there won't be any damage & sometimes u hit a small one and end up with damaged tire/ rim.

Gaurav has had a problem with S drives within 10k kms but there are many ppl here who have done more than 50k kms and never had any issues with it.

So, I don't thinking discussing on road conditions and tire compound without any tech data would conclude anything here.

Gaurav - Regarding the road noise, Is it possible for you to test the car with some set of tires other than the stock Bstones which makes humming noise anyways? May be yours cousin's Goodyears ?
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Old 5th July 2010, 11:12   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ph03n!x View Post
By loud, if you mean as loud as a truck's tyre - then you are already there! They dont get any louder than that!!
I have driven any truck yet or may be I have if you consider a Tata sumo as one. But yes, the noise is loud enough to confuse you as if your wheel bearing is about to go kaput.

Quote:
Originally Posted by maglev View Post
Its best to have a trusted dealer and to ensure that the tire's are not more than 5 months old in the worst case, as rubber ages with time so if a tire has not been used for a long period of time it is rather useless. My advice is not buy such tires even if you get them cheaper or at a discount.
I checked the tyres when I bought them and it was a fresh stock. They are november or decemeber 2009 make.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Epic View Post
I understand your frustration and I believe I would have reacted in the same way if something like this happened to me and all the more if I did not get help and respect from the representative of a reputed brand like Yokohama.

However, as Nikhil has rightly pointed out, one cannot blame the manufacturer alone as we cannot remember where and how we have driven in the past. I suggest you speak to Mr. Sanjay Chatterjee and take it from there.

...So I immediately got the tire checked and we found 3 nails at different areas in the tire. Air was leaking out very very slowly so I could not see or feel any difference in the tire pressure. I was shocked but happy that the tire lasted the whole 90km drive with 3 nails in it. I applaud the tire and the manufacturer!! But I am sure, that if the tire did give way, I would have probably abused the tire and manufacturer for making a tire that is so prone to punctures and that too when the tire was just 1 month old.
I had got all 3 punctures repaired and still using my S-Drives with no issues what-so-ever. Its been over 12k kms after the incident. However, they have become a bit noiser than before but Im not complaining :-)
Thanks Epic. I am marking a mail to Yokohama cutomer supportand will have a word with Mr. Sanjay too.

Secondly, tubeless tyres wont give you any trouble until the punchure is on tyre wall. We had 4 punchures on our kumho tyres when we drove from Jaipur to Delhi in the lancer with 4 adults on board. Our average speed at that time was more than 80-100kms. Tyre going bust is the last thing one expects but I know it does happen. Driving on clean roads certainly dont assure that you wont find any nails up there but it may assure that atleast your tyre wall wont bulge.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
I'm sorry, but I don't buy this at all. Some of the roads in Boston were as bad as / worse off than what Bombay has to offer (including jarring potholes). And, unlike India, tyres in Boston have to cope with extreme temperature changes too (super cold in winter, warm in summer). This thing about Indian driving conditions being the worst in the world is a myth. I don't remember Bangalore roads that well, yet can state that the condition of roads from Mumbai / Delhi / Chennai is not bad at all. Took a long road trip around Kerala last year and was very impressed with the highways. Fact is, our highway network has also tremendously improved. The Bombay - Nasik, Bombay-Pune and Bombay-Goa roads are excellent (these three are my regular routes). Get this, my daily 13 km drive to work does NOT have a single pothole.

So, lets stop blaming our roads for fragile tyres giving up. Not only have our road conditions improved, but other countries have massive potholes too. If a tyre fails because of a pothole, lets call it just that. There is nothing Indian or international about potholes. They exist everywhere.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kutlee View Post
There were at least 1.5m potholes on British roads...news guardian.co.uk.
Isn't it interesting to find out no of potholes / sq mile ?
Absolutely, when I was in London, most of the inner lanes were worse than what I find in inner localities in Delhi. The city roads have patches throughout that are to fill in the potholes. Roads here in Delhi are far better than what I found in that part of London. I dont know how long the myth of Indian roads being worse exist and how long will it take for people to accept that our road conditions atleast in Delhi and Mumbai (I havent been to any other metropolitan cities) are of international standards. Still, most of the cars in the UK drive on low profile tyres and tyre companies do stand up to their warranties. It may be because the claim incase they are sued is too high.

Our national highways have improved dramatically and good for cars including Lamborghinis, Ferraris, R8s etc all of which have performace tyres and I hope that are not very noisy. Because, if I pay that money I would love hear a loud engine note rather than a loud tyre note.
Quote:
Originally Posted by thewhiteknight View Post
Interesting thread; i am planning on getting Yoko S-Drives or Michelin PP3/2 for my lancer, and road noise is a major factor in my driving experience.
I wont recommend the S-Drives.


Quote:
Originally Posted by kpzen View Post
I think Gaurav's primary concern is " Road noise " which has increased considerably all of a sudden.

IMHO, Sidewall bulge after hitting a pothole is a matter of luck & the angle at which you hit the pothole. Sometimes after hitting a big pothole there won't be any damage & sometimes u hit a small one and end up with damaged tire/ rim.

Gaurav has had a problem with S drives within 10k kms but there are many ppl here who have done more than 50k kms and never had any issues with it.
Certainly, Thanks for getting it right!

Quote:
Gaurav - Regarding the road noise, Is it possible for you to test the car with some set of tires other than the stock Bstones which makes humming noise anyways? May be yours cousin's Goodyears ?
Changing to Goodyears to check for tyre noise is a nice idea, will do it over the weekend. Thanks!

Last edited by gaurav_chopra04 : 5th July 2010 at 11:28.
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Old 5th July 2010, 11:29   #27
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Originally Posted by gaurav_chopra04 View Post
Absolutely, when I was in London, most of the inner lanes were worse than what I find in inner localities in Delhi. The city roads have patches throughout that are to fill in the potholes. Roads here in Delhi are far better than what I found in that part of London. I dont know how long the myth of Indian roads being worse exist and how long will it take for people to accept that our road conditions atleast in Delhi and Mumbai (I havent been to any other metropolitan cities) are of international standards.
Maybe London roads are not of international standard, whatever an international standard is. I have driven extensively in Washington State, California & Bombay. Bombay roads aren't any comparison at all. They are not even in the same ballpark to be compared.

Actually, if you ignore the signals, I find the the El Camino Real drive from say Menlo Park to San Jose is as good as the Bombay-Pune Expressway. And this stretch of El Camino Real isn't a freeway or an expressway - it's a just big arterial road.

Last edited by carboy : 5th July 2010 at 11:32.
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Old 5th July 2010, 11:43   #28
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Originally Posted by carboy View Post
Maybe London roads are not of international standard, whatever an international standard is. I have driven extensively in Washington State, California & Bombay. Bombay roads aren't any comparison at all. They are not even in the same ballpark to be compared.

Actually, if you ignore the signals, I find the the El Camino Real drive from say Menlo Park to San Jose is as good as the Bombay-Pune Expressway. And this stretch of El Camino Real isn't a freeway or an expressway - it's a just big arterial road.
Right, I haven't been to Washington State & California but in Delhi atleast I have a blast driving and that what most people who live in Mumbai report too. I havent driven in Mumbai but have certainly visited the place a few times and didnt find problem with the roads. Also, if you believe our roads are not of International standard, then why does Yokohama bother to sell S-Drives or their ADVANS in an underdoc country, which may have more than 50% of the worlds billionaires in a few years according to Forbes!

If these companies need revenues from us, they need to provide proper customer support, the way they provide in the Washington State & California, which have the roads of so called international standard.

I didnt get the edited thing, certianly its some drive from El Camino (isnt that a muscle) Real drive from Menlo Park to San Jose, haven't been to States you know.

Last edited by gaurav_chopra04 : 5th July 2010 at 11:50.
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Old 5th July 2010, 15:38   #29
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Hmm, I see comments like Indian Driving conditions are tougher than the west, and if you want tires to last longer buy apollo/MRF etc.,
I have a question, when you go to buy these tires, does the company paste a sticker anywhere on the tires that they are not suited to Indian Driving conditions? Do the dealers tell the buyers that these tires are not suitable for Indian Driving conditions?
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Old 5th July 2010, 15:51   #30
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Originally Posted by gaurav_chopra04 View Post
Also, if you believe our roads are not of International standard, then why does Yokohama bother to sell S-Drives or their ADVANS in an underdoc country, which may have more than 50% of the worlds billionaires in a few years according to Forbes!

If these companies need revenues from us, they need to provide proper customer support, the way they provide in the Washington State & California, which have the roads of so called international standard.
My comment was only about quality & condition of roads. I didn't say anything about the tyres.

FWIW, I believe that more expensive the tyres, the sturdier they should be against bad driving conditions, unless they are very specialized products meant to be driven only on racing tracks or something like that.

Likewise, engines also -> If a Maruti 800 engine is able to handle bad quality fuel, there is no reason why a more expensive car shouldn't be able to handle it.

If any car or tyre isn't meant for Indian conditions/fuel whatever, it should either not be sold in India, or clearly marked as such.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gaurav_chopra04 View Post
I didnt get the edited thing, certianly its some drive from El Camino (isnt that a muscle) Real drive from Menlo Park to San Jose, haven't been to States you know.
I am sorry - I don't understand what are you are saying above.

Last edited by carboy : 5th July 2010 at 15:53.
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