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Old 6th June 2009, 20:52   #31
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On doing some research i have learned the the points used for battery operated coil ignition systems are made of a tungsten alloy, whereas the ones used for magnetos are based on a platinum alloy, due to their properties of low resistance .
Am new here, so hello to all, and enough of that.

The story on the solution of a magneto problem, resolved by different sorts of points, is interesting, but not really clear. Different metals have different resistance, but in case of a part, that only has a few mm length, the difference in result of resistance is not large. Also after the points comes the spark plug cable and the plug itself. The former has larger length and the latter (usually) has an additional resistor up to kilo-ohms for certain purposes.

Could it be, the resolving of the problem actually explains by something else, that became missed to notice?

Dietmar

Last edited by Rudra Sen : 7th June 2009 at 10:56.
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Old 7th June 2009, 13:52   #32
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Hi Dietmar,

Let Magneto answer your question from technical point of view.
But I have an experience I can share. One of my cars is a 1926 Fiat Tipo 509 which has a Magneto Marelli magneto. We got the magneto serviced and it ran well for a couple of years till the point became bad. We could not find one, so we removed a point from a normal delco and fitted this. The car would barely start, I do not remember what happened to the point, burnt, erroded or what but it just did not work. After some time we found and original Magnetto Mareli point in original packing which I still have and there we noticed that it is a platinum point. My car has been firing correctly ever since.
BTW, where in Cologne are you? I was there for 2 weeks and came back last night. During the trip I met a small collector in Chorweiler, he had parts for my prewar Opel. I was at Neubrueck.

Cheers harit
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Old 7th June 2009, 22:30   #33
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Dear Dietmar,
It is mot the mm,s that matters but the metal used for its low resistance .

Platinum has a lower resistance than tungsten alloy, making it an ideal metal for a magneto because it has a low voltage and high current on the primary of the coil, which is generated with the rotation of a magnet or coil, as compared to a battery operated delco with a higher voltage and a lower operating current of a ignition coil.

Longer wires with a lower resistance can be used on the secondary side of the coil where the voltage is high 20 to 50 kv, but a very low current in milli amps.

The voltage is low on a magneto coil because of the limited window area in which a thick wire has to be wound, along with a very thin secondary which is thinner than a hair with about 14000 rounds, hence the compromise.

In a delco system platinum would be too expensive to produce as compared to tungsten, this was the reason why manufacturers opted out for the magneto and the coil/point was universally used.
Bye,
M.
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Old 24th June 2009, 22:32   #34
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Hi,
I have been busy trying to locate parts for a Wolseley 1919, which i am restoring.

My search took me to Buranpur, in MP and managed to get the starter, magneto, and a generator which were originally on the car.

The interesting part is that the manufacturer of the starter is BLIC, which stands for British Lighting ignition co Ltd . Which i am hearing for the first time.

The quality of the starter is far superior to a lucas or a miller unit used in later cars.

The magneto is manufactured by a company called Fellows London, and is also of very high quality.

Lastly the generator is CAV and is rectangular in shape and weighs almost 12 Kgs.

I will be working on these units and will put some pictures for your viewing.

I am a bit perplexed with the working of the generator, so will appreciate any information i can get to save on time and effort.

Bye,
Magneto.
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Old 25th June 2009, 10:24   #35
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Originally Posted by magneto View Post
Hi,
I have been busy trying to locate parts for a Wolseley 1919, which i am restoring.

My search took me to Buranpur, in MP and managed to get the starter, magneto, and a generator which were originally on the car.

The interesting part is that the manufacturer of the starter is BLIC, which stands for British Lighting ignition co Ltd . Which i am hearing for the first time.

The quality of the starter is far superior to a lucas or a miller unit used in later cars.

The magneto is manufactured by a company called Fellows London, and is also of very high quality.

Lastly the generator is CAV and is rectangular in shape and weighs almost 12 Kgs.

I will be working on these units and will put some pictures for your viewing.

I am a bit perplexed with the working of the generator, so will appreciate any information i can get to save on time and effort.

Bye,
Magneto.
Dear Sir.

Thats a very interesting car you are working on. Could you share its history and pictures of it ?

Interesting to know you were able to find its parts in UP. is this car from Buranpur ?

There is a wolsley from this period on display in Hyderabad with the Nizam's family.

Maybe DKG could help you in terms of comparision of both cars and other things.

Please do also add pics and narratives on the other cars you own or have worked on.

Wasif
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Old 29th June 2009, 16:50   #36
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Hi Wasif,
I was unable to reply due to the upgrade of the site.
To tell you about this car, it is a 1919 Wolseley, belonging to Late Mr Sorabji Havaldar, residing in Burhanpur in MP.
It has been owned by the family since they bought it brand new.

The only other thing i know about this gentleman is that he was a accomplished engineer in the cotton ginning business and maintained this car till he passed away maybe 10 or 14 years ago .

The car came to me in with the engine partially open with the electrics and handles missing.

The rest was in an unbelievable original condition. The paintwork, seats, canvas top, and yes the battery are still there as bought.

I immediately started ordering things necessary to get the car in working condition, like the tires, Artillery wheels and the electrics which were missing.

The engine is a different story, as it had many parts missing,mainly on the timing train.
I was lucky to have found a silent chain of the correct size in the scrap market totally rusted but could make my length by adding the good links.

The cam was totally worn out as the oil lines had been disconnected to the overhead cam section.
The cam and follower had to be recovered and reground.

After a complete overhaul engine is running smooth with temporary delco instead of the magneto.

I am adding a couple of pics for you to see and comment.

Bye. M.
Attached Thumbnails
Magneto blues? Get all your magneto info here...-image012.jpg  

Magneto blues? Get all your magneto info here...-image008.jpg  

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Old 30th June 2009, 11:21   #37
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Thanks for the post below with the details on the Wolsley you are currently working on.

Truly a project of epic proportion. Do keep adding more on it as work progresse.

What kind of lighting arrangment was featured on this car, carbide lamps or was it Lucas dynamo with bulb lighting.

would love to see pictures of the dash and the grille. That engine with OHC was definitely much ahead of its times.

Wasif
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Old 2nd July 2009, 17:16   #38
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Dear Wasif,
In fact i have already made a good lot of progress on the parts i retrieved.
This car came with BLIC electrics, one of the finest i have seen, puts Lucas to shame.
I will post some pics to show how i got them and after restoration.

Bye, M.
Attached Thumbnails
Magneto blues? Get all your magneto info here...-blic-starter.jpg  

Magneto blues? Get all your magneto info here...-blic-1.jpg  

Magneto blues? Get all your magneto info here...-cav-gen.jpg  

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Old 4th July 2009, 19:30   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magneto View Post
Dear Wasif,
In fact i have already made a good lot of progress on the parts i retrieved.
This car came with BLIC electrics, one of the finest i have seen, puts Lucas to shame.
I will post some pics to show how i got them and after restoration.

Bye, M.
Magneto, you are a damn lucky guy. These parts which you found of your own car are actually not available anywhere. I think that is also the reason you went back there though you knew that they would trouble you.
I wonder if that doctors coupe also available will ever run, having missing mechanicals too.
All the best!

Cheers harit
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Old 4th July 2009, 21:41   #40
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Harit you are damn right, i tried to find these all over the world and did not succeed for two years.
I gave it a chance and took the trouble on a hunch and got them.
have a look at the restored CAV generator, its interesting as it has no cutouts, relays,or controls, just a freewheeling pulley on the fanbelt, so when the rpm drops below charging speed the battery runs the dynamo like a dc motor, but do not forget to switch off the charge switch when leaving the car.
m
M
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Old 5th July 2009, 12:16   #41
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The magneto on this car is a Fellows London make, it is the only one i have encountered, nevertheless it is of excellent quality, and in a very clean condition.
It needed a complete overhaul,including the winding and condenser change.
To show the results i an posting a few pictures
Attached Thumbnails
Magneto blues? Get all your magneto info here...-mag-1.jpg  

Magneto blues? Get all your magneto info here...-mag-4.jpg  

Magneto blues? Get all your magneto info here...-mag3.jpg  

Magneto blues? Get all your magneto info here...-mag-parts2.jpg  

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Old 15th July 2009, 16:33   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magneto View Post
The magneto on this car is a Fellows London make, it is the only one i have encountered, nevertheless it is of excellent quality, and in a very clean condition.It needed a complete overhaul, including the winding and condenser change. To show the results i an posting a few pictures
Dear Mr. Magneto,
How many cylinders does this mag fire? Also what's in the upper portion of the unit? Is it possible to get a photo of the inside chamber of the upper unit?
Regards
Nigel

Last edited by deutscheafrikar : 15th July 2009 at 16:38.
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Old 17th July 2009, 13:49   #43
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The U part you see on the top is the magnet, this unit fires 4 cylinders, you can understand this by the no of holes meant for the HT wire.

I will take pictures of another unit as this is already assembled and ready for fitting .
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Old 4th August 2009, 23:02   #44
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Recently i took up a new challenge, to get a SU electric fuel pump to work without the problematic points. This is what i ended up with to get it going.

Winding the original coil.

Developing an electronic circuit to oscillate the pump with a auto stop when carburetor is full.
,
New diaphragms made from the correct grade of neoprene fabric reinforced rubber.

neoprene gasket for the bottom half.

The electronics sits in the original compartment, so that it looks the same.

As you all know that Ucal used to make electric pumps, which are quiet reliable and could be concealed under the chassis and a dummy su pump to look original for authenticity .

Now good electrical pumps are very rare and difficult to get, hence the development of the system to run the SU pump.

I will post pictures later how the pump looks from the inside and the conversion.

Bye,
M.
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Old 6th August 2009, 00:49   #45
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hi all

This piece of information is simply great

Thanks forthe same

Sushil
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