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Old 11th March 2010, 17:59   #16
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You are legally permitted to replace the cars engine with the similar specs engine of the same model without change of Fuel type.
You can give an Undertaking that the engine bought by you was purchased legally and that the car which the engine was installed was scrapped much before.Then there should be no difficulty in getting that particular engine endorsed in the RC books.
ajay99
Thank you for the reply. I went to the Andheri RTO, today to find out about this. They have flatly refused to accept any undertaking from me which states that this is a legally purchased engine from a similar scrapped vehicle. They say that invoice of engine should be from a Authorised dealer who sells the same vehicle. Also that the engine should be fitted by them. I also asked an agent there to help me. He said he would try if the price was right. But he doesn't promise anything. What do you suggest I do now. I feel I am stuck, as there is no authorised dealer since the company has closed down so how do I purchse from them.

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Old 11th March 2010, 20:23   #17
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ajay99
Thank you for the reply. I went to the Andheri RTO, today to find out about this. They have flatly refused to accept any undertaking from me which states that this is a legally purchased engine from a similar scrapped vehicle. They say that invoice of engine should be from a Authorised dealer who sells the same vehicle. Also that the engine should be fitted by them. I also asked an agent there to help me. He said he would try if the price was right. But he doesn't promise anything. What do you suggest I do now. I feel I am stuck, as there is no authorised dealer since the company has closed down so how do I purchse from them.
kindly dont be dejected.There is always a legal way out
ask the RTO guys to give in writing why your engine is not being endorsed.
please enquire whether there is any rule in the Maharashtra MV rules which makes it mandatory to have an INVOICE for second hand engine installation.
You can also approach/appeal to the TC with all the facts,
being a genuine case, I think there will be a positive response.
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Old 11th March 2010, 21:38   #18
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hi guys why drag the fiat engine endorsement in the r.c book have your own MV ACT ask your work shop guy to puncth the old number on the new engine for geniune reasons you go by the MV ACT or the rules of the RTO in any state nothing is going to work except running from pillar to post in the rto office get things done the other way which ever way guys feel comfortable
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Old 11th March 2010, 21:46   #19
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hi guys why drag the fiat engine endorsement in the r.c book have your own MV ACT ask your work shop guy to puncth the old number on the new engine for geniune reasons you go by the MV ACT or the rules of the RTO in any state nothing is going to work except running from pillar to post in the rto office get things done the other way which ever way guys feel comfortable
Its plain and simple fact, RTO has no emotions towards your Vintage or Classic car. For them its just another vehicle.

There is no way to endorse a new engine other than punching the old engine number.
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Old 11th March 2010, 22:21   #20
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Thanks for starting this thread, it has such an impact on the preservation of our Vintage, & Classic & Custom/Hot Rod Cars

I have three issues that I am dealing with at the moment

First;
I saw a nice 62 Fiat 1100 in Assam, a one owner car in great shape and the 85 year old gentleman who would like to sell it to me to ensure that it is Well Loved and Restored.

I'm in the process of investigating what would be entailed to bring it to Calcutta and use on a daily basis, as I would prefer not to drive my 62 Fiat 1100 WBF-1 and keep it for special occasions.

The initial advice from some of the collectors here is,

1. The City of Calcutta will not transfer cars of this age that are not currently registered in Calcutta because of environmental regulations.
2. One suggestion is to keep it in the owners name and renew it's
licence & insurance in Assam and drive it here and ensure that I have a proper bill of sale.
Not sure that this is a good idea and have to do some serious research.
3. Have it transferred to an address outside Calcutta and drive it here. Difficult.

My first Fiat 1100 was a 1965, that I purchased 7 years ago, from the "owner" and it turned out that he had purchased a few years prior with a bill of sale but it was still in the original owners name. He provided me with a bill of sale and all the necessary documentation from the original owner to have the car transferred into my name.

Interested in seeing how the system worked, I undertook to handle the registration, an interesting process! Part of the process was to provide his address so they could check to ensure that the information was correct. It turned out he had moved so I had to find out his new address and submit a copy of his telephone bill or such which I did.

The last man in the process suggested that I come in early in the morning to have him look at the car to verify if it was the one. I questioned the necessity as I felt he was looking for some money, not that I mentioned that it him. He got in a huff and I was not able to go to his boss as I was returning to Toronto that week.

I left it with one of my Collector friends to process without success and on my return 10 months later I went to the same person and he said the documentation had been misplaced.
I had copies of everything so I continued to drive it until an Army truck side swiped me and it wasn't worth fixing so I scrapped it. The next year i was able to purchase my WBF-1 with no problems.

Here in west Bengal a car must have it's tax token paid every year. In buying an older, un-driven car, a 100% penalty is applied to every year since it's last paid tax token, making for a significant amount, some times in excess of what the car costs.

A lot of the Collectors don't bother to transfer ownership as they rarely drive them and it's not an issue.

Second;
WBF-1 is getting to a Concours condition and while the engine is running ok, the compression is down equally and I am burning oil so I am considering the following.
1. My first preference is to have the engine rebuild completely with a little more Zip and keep the car original. I dream of taking my wife and I on a long tour around India and it need it to be reliable and able to climb Mountains.
2. It has been suggested that finding a "good" used engine would be less expensive and "more" reliable than having the engine rebuilt and change the motor #.

I'd have Bumpu do the work either way and consider him the best mechanic here in Calcutta.

I've had the same policeman nail me for some minor traffic "violations" only to ask for and accept some money. He only asked to see my drivers licence, never the car registration so I am wondering if and when the Body and Engine numbers would be checked?

Life is Sooooo much simpler in N.A. for Car Lovers!

Third,
I have also had a yen to build a Custom and/or Rod and reading about the restrictions in documentation it doesn't seem possible. Any comments?

The more I read about how difficult it is for us to purchase and them restore our cars I feel we should lobby the Government as a Minority "untouchable" group of Citizens.

But that supposes that we are a United Group, which at this point we are NOT.
I sincerly hope that we can put our "Act" together.

"Vision without Action is Daydreaming" - "Action without Vision is Chaos", to quote another Team BHP Member

Last edited by john a milne : 11th March 2010 at 22:28.
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Old 12th March 2010, 03:41   #21
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Originally Posted by deutscheafrikar View Post
I went to the Andheri RTO, today to find out about this. They have flatly refused to accept any undertaking from me which states that this is a legally purchased engine from a similar scrapped vehicle. They say that invoice of engine should be from a Authorised dealer who sells the same vehicle. Also that the engine should be fitted by them.
System differs so much with RTOs. In 2008, the kine's chassis broke, RTO refused to accept the chassis change quoting that it's against the law. The RTO head's exact words were,"There is no provision for changing the chassis/engine. Get the bike exchanged from the company or dump the bike in Hussain Sagar." At the same time, an agent told me that if chassis were bought from with a bill from an authorized dealer, the RTO would permit the swap.
'was left with the option of welding the old chassis, and risk using it. Or to get a new chassis and stamp the old chassis number on it. So, got it replaced with a new one without the RTO's permission.
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Old 12th March 2010, 09:57   #22
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At least in kerala there is not much difficulty in getting endorsement for engine replacement .But you cannot replace a 1089 cc engine with a 1500 cc engine.
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Old 12th March 2010, 10:16   #23
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Great, now that pavan and ajay have "kissed and made up", im sure they can put their heads together and contibute some of their vast knowledge here to educate semi-educated folk( like me...)
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Old 12th March 2010, 11:03   #24
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Who is this Brat? I say
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Old 12th March 2010, 18:33   #25
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Who is this Brat? I say
I am also searching for him?
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Old 12th March 2010, 18:46   #26
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Note from the Team-BHP Support Staff : Slang and SMS Language are STRICTLY prohibited on Team-BHP. Please type in full and proper English for the benefit of other community members. We advise you to read the Announcements and Board Rules section before proceeding any further.

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Old 17th March 2010, 04:10   #27
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Another possibility would be;

1. To check if any advertisements could be found that refer to a price.
2. To see if any of the old car dealerships are still in business and might have some old records.
3. Check the internet to find what was the price of cars sold here in India or elsewhere. Don't know if would be accepted but might be considered.
4. Write or contact local newspapers & Car Publications requesting, as a public service, they do a display ad requesting pricing information on Classic & Vintage Cars being sold in India.

Last edited by GTO : 26th April 2012 at 13:29. Reason: Quoted post has been deleted
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Old 17th March 2010, 04:35   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by john a milne View Post
Thanks for starting this thread, it has such an impact on the preservation of our Vintage, & Classic & Custom/Hot Rod Cars

I have three issues that I am dealing with at the moment

First;
I saw a nice 62 Fiat 1100 in Assam, a one owner car in great shape and the 85 year old gentleman who would like to sell it to me to ensure that it is Well Loved and Restored.

Second;
WBF-1 is getting to a Concours condition and while the engine is running ok, the compression is down equally and I am burning oil so I am considering the following.
1. My first preference is to have the engine rebuild completely with a little more Zip and keep the car original.
2. It has been suggested that finding a "good" used engine would be less expensive and "more" reliable than having the engine rebuilt and change the motor #.

Third,
I have also had a yen to build a Custom and/or Rod and reading about the restrictions in documentation it doesn't seem possible. Any comments?
An update,
1. I have decided not to pursue purchasing the 62 Fiat 1100 in Assam. too much hassle an will look for a local Padmini. Could be a good car to have in one's collection just to look at and at some later time when the rules change, put on the road.
2. Will have the original engine rebuilt.
3. Will check some of the collectors here who have built Custom Cars.
Attached Thumbnails
RTO Documentation for Vintage/Classics-img_4659.jpg  

RTO Documentation for Vintage/Classics-img_4661.jpg  

RTO Documentation for Vintage/Classics-img_6107_2.jpg  

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Old 5th June 2010, 19:59   #29
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Why cant we file a PIL to amend the MV act to be more considerate towards classics? Maybe a PIL filed from teambhp's side?
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Old 5th June 2010, 21:01   #30
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Why cant we file a PIL to amend the MV act to be more considerate towards classics? Maybe a PIL filed from teambhp's side?
Motor vehicle act will have to be amended in each state to get benefit to all
also the definition of "classic"" will be prove to be a hurdle here

Last edited by ajay99 : 5th June 2010 at 21:02.
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