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Old 1st May 2009, 15:44   #151
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as far as i have seen, nobody on mumbai roads are scared of an innova. even rickshaws & scooters cut into my lane abruptly. maybe they are aware that a denting job in a toyota is damn expensive. this does not happen with the 2 SUVs. other irritant i feel is the ORVMs. though they are the best i have seen in any car till date in terms of visiblity, they protrude too much out of the car. this makes it difficult to squeeze through small gaps in traffic. your bonnet may pass but your ORVMs will scrape the other car.

i feel, the innova is not as 'fun-to-drive' as the two SUVs. the 2 SUVs are not as comfortable as the innova. life's confusing, isnt it?
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Old 1st May 2009, 15:47   #152
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IMHO, take the Innova out (wonderful ride and comfort quality not withstanding, it simply isnt a looker - looks like something a Mom with 3 kids would need) ; its tough between the Scorp and the Safari so take your pick. If your driving is say 80% or more in the city, go with the Scorp.
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Old 1st May 2009, 15:49   #153
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Fun to drive. Safari and Scorpio?
Unless you term rollover as fun, both of them are worse than innova by a large margin when it comes to handling and drivability.
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Old 1st May 2009, 15:50   #154
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Thanks Tanvir, that's news to me! I used to think Innova does not shoo away traffic!
Right, Safari has that "flaunt" potential in Punjab. Your & a couple of others experiences with the Safari, scare me away from it. But it sells big time in Punjab, what's it? Aren't people aware of its problems or are ready to live with them!

In Punjab, Innova commands a prestigious image because of Politicos using it extensively. Whereas, Scorpio is the one perceived as a Taxi & shown "stop" signals at nakas.

Importantly, would you advice a Safari to someone still?
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Old 1st May 2009, 15:55   #155
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yes tanveer, handling- i agree. but drivability- i disagree.
scorpio's drivability is much better than the innova.
i mentioned fun to drive in terms of engine performance. compare an innova's roll-on timings to the scorpio/safari. compared to these two SUVs, the innova takes ages to gain momentum. be it any rpm or any gear- the scorpio instantly lurges forward with a prod on the accelerator. this quality is missing in the innova.
talking about roll, every SUV owner is aware of this limitation of his vehicle and these vehicles are just meant to be driven keeping this in mind.

@ bhp1: when you are spending 11 grands, why do you want to invest on something which is perceived as a taxi in your city? you should go for the innova if that is the case.

Last edited by raj_5004 : 1st May 2009 at 15:58.
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Old 1st May 2009, 16:19   #156
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@BHP1 > when do you plan to buy?
This thread was started on 23rd Nov. Or have you already made your purchase ? Im posting directly after reading your first post on this thread, so excuse me if this is no longer relevant.

For a bad back you need to have upright seating with good lumbar support. Secondly you also intend to drive mostly in the city. The Scorpio is a very nimble to drive in the city and since you will not be achieving high speeds in the city, body roll shouldnt be a concern either. Besides is the most compact suv available for quite less. It should fit your bill. The Safari is a mile muncher and will best be appreciated on the highway. The Innova will invite dents & scratches and it certainly isnt fun to haul a living room around the city.

If you are not inclined towards an suv then look at the Ford Fusion as an option.
Cheers,
J

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Old 1st May 2009, 16:54   #157
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Raj, according to you Innova doesn't enjoy benefit of size compared to the other 2 in terms of shooing the traffic. Maybe its because of its car like looks & lack of macho/rugged appeal.
Innova is slower in 0-100 sprints but ones it gains momentum, it achieves & coasts very well at higher speeds & keeps up with most sedans.
Scorpio surely carries that Taxi tag in Punjab, but I want the best out of the 3 & if Scorpio is the one, I don't mind the Taxi image!

Thanks Takumi, I agree with you, Innova feels like a soccer mom vehicle!
My usage will be equally divided among City & Highway. Maybe a little more in the City, but I can't write off highway stints.

Yes Tanvir, Scorpio is pretty prone to roll overs which are unheard of in the Innova under normal driving conditions.
Also, I do not subscribe to what Raj says "talking about roll, every SUV owner is aware of this limitation of his vehicle and these vehicles are just meant to be driven keeping this in mind". Let me say,these vehicles are rolled over by their owners only!

Thanks Jays, I haven't made a purchase yet & its primarily due to the fact that I was waiting for a 4x4 Scorpio 2.2L, but since that hasn't happened, now I plan to make a purchase soon & have dropped the idea of 4x4's & would be sticking to 4x2's.
Also, it partly depends on the confusion Im in on deciding 1 among the mentioned 3 -Scorp/ Safari/ Innova.

Since you missed the in between posts, I shall lay down a summary for you:
Scorpio - I do not like the limited leg room for the driver & relatively bumpy ride.

Safari - was the natural choice for a comfortable vehicle considering back problems, but the horror stories heard/read about it are alarming. I keenly followed your & Tanvir's threads & must salute your spirits about still not abusing the vehicles.
I do not want to frequent garages apart from regular services/accident repairs(God forbid). Also, as I drive alone most of the time, won't want to be stranded at times.

Innova - lack of SUV image, I not sure whether its able to scare away traffic on the roads. This may sound dumb but the Psyche behind this is that Im really attached to my rides & do not like pedestrians/rickshaws/autos, scratching/denting them.

BTW, Fusion is not my cup of tea!
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Old 1st May 2009, 17:57   #158
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Performance is very overrated. Unless you want to be first at all traffic lights, you will be equally happy with innova, safari and scorpio.
As for my recommendations, if you have a TASS near you, safari should not be a problem. Our 3.0 (LX) back home in ludhiana as broken down twice since purchase(both times when vehicle was relatively new), and last 15K kms have been uneventful(she's done 35 in 3 years 6 months)
As for mine, I have been unusually unlucky.
If you buy a safari, be prepared for some sensor going kaput(cam sensor is favorite, though I havent had that misfortune yet), sometime in the early life of vehicle,that said tata will replace everything under warranty.
For example, my another of our close relatives 2.2 had a timing belt snap at manali. Tata towed it to ludhiana at their expense, and did all the repairs also.
So in the end its your call.
For some people niggles are not problems at all, other except not even rattles. So in the end you have to make choice
Ownership reviews can just give objective reports, but a car is an emotional thing.

that said, if you go for safari, expect problems. Whether the sensor that fails means the thermometer stops working, or engine stops working is entirely your luck , but something will fail. 90% of safari owners have had something failing(AC/thermometer etc., etc.,), almost all have had the AC fuse blown.

So entirely your call, how much of an adventurer you are.
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Old 1st May 2009, 18:17   #159
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@ bhp1: yes, you are right bhp. scorpios that topple are driven by owners only. but you missed something here, they were driven by over-enthusiastic owners who thinks their 10 lakh scorpio can beat a CRV! i have been driving a scorpio for 6 years regularly at triple digit speeds & have never had an accident till now, touch wood! on the other hand, i have seen an innova topple right in front of me on the expressway. so it all depends on how the driver is & not how the car is.

another point i missed here is that the scorpio is more refined at higher speeds than the innova, in terms of engine/wind/tyre noise inside the cabin. suprisingly, some here find this hard to digest that a mahindra can be more refined than a toyota. but thats a fact!

u said you need the best among the three. the innova is no doubt the best among the three. i will only & only recommend the scorpio to you if you drive yourself. you will enjoy driving a scorpio or even a safari more than an innova.

i will list out the pros & cons of the scorpio & innova for you, these are when compared to each other:

scorpio mHawk:
+ more powerful, drivable & refined engine
+ SUV appeal & hence commands more respect on road
+ tougher build & hence not too prone to scratches & dents

- cramped interiors
- bouncy rear seat
- low mounted rear AC vents

innova D-4D:
+ luxurious & spacious interiors
+ good ride quality
+ toyota brand image & great A.S.S.

- paint & build quality is pathetic, very much prone to scratches & dents
- engine is not too refined
- repair & service bills are high

@ tsk: tanveer, by far you are the most honest safari owner i have seen on T-BHP, i mean it!

Last edited by raj_5004 : 1st May 2009 at 18:24.
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Old 1st May 2009, 19:32   #160
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Tanvir, Tata A.S.S is just around the corner but I hate going to garages frequently, there are other things to do!
I've heard that the old 3L Safari was more reliable than the present 2.2.
Actually, I've used cars like 1st gen. Honda City, Corolla, etc. & these cars have kind off spoilt me. Yes, even rattles would appear as problems now!

After paying a reasonable sum of money & overlooking options like Innova/Scorpio, I would not want to be facing problems. Atleast a reliable, trouble/problem free vehicle is a minimum requirement to be filled by every vehicle today. Now, Im not sure whether Safari ownership is going to be an adventure or a misadventure!

Reading your experiences with the Safari was an eye opener & the 90% thing you mentioned is extraordinary! Is a new updated Safari with problems taken care off, around the corner?

@Raj, I got your point but just compare the ratios of toppling of Innova's with Scorpio's, the later would come out with flying colors!
The pros/cons mentioned by you are informative & as always, after reading your posts, Scorpio tops the list.

BTW, on long drives, are you able to stretch your legs on the driver seat of a Scorpio? I have always found the front seats really cramped.
Also, how's the getting in & out in all the three? Does one have to pull oneself up to enter Scorpio/Safari?
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Old 1st May 2009, 20:28   #161
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bhp1 View Post
@Raj, I got your point but just compare the ratios of toppling of Innova's with Scorpio's, the later would come out with flying colors!
The pros/cons mentioned by you are informative & as always, after reading your posts, Scorpio tops the list.

BTW, on long drives, are you able to stretch your legs on the driver seat of a Scorpio? I have always found the front seats really cramped.
Also, how's the getting in & out in all the three? Does one have to pull oneself up to enter Scorpio/Safari?
bhp, i am suggesting you the innova, not the scorpio since reliability & space is your main priority. the scorpio tops only if driving pleasure is your priority.

i am 6'1" & i cannot stretch my legs in the scorpio. again, because of my height, getting in & out of the 3 cars is not an issue for me. but my parents like the innova more than the scorpio & safari for its ease of ingress.
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Old 1st May 2009, 20:40   #162
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My priorities are pretty varied, reliability should be the order of the day, drivability & space are personalised options.
I just need space in the front seats & drivability.

Im also 6.1 feet tall , when I tried Safari/Scorpio, found that one has to lift oneself up to get in & egress also needs help!
Whereas Ingress/egress on the Innova was a cakewalk.
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Old 1st May 2009, 22:54   #163
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Innova is the best bet for you. this is the vehicle which will keep you the happiest. If I was not in for a 4x4, I would have bought the innova
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Old 1st May 2009, 23:32   #164
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bhp1 - which models of the innova, safari and scorpio are you looking at?
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Old 2nd May 2009, 12:17   #165
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bhp, since you want a trouble free performer, an interesting website for you- the indian consumer complaints:

12 complaints have been registered for the innova whereas the numbers are much higher for scorpio (31) & safari (48) :-

Indian Consumer Complaints Forum | toyota innova
Indian Consumer Complaints Forum | mahindra scorpio
Indian Consumer Complaints Forum | tata safari

i thought this may help you!
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