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Old 18th December 2008, 11:13   #91
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Originally Posted by suman View Post
Are you serious?

I heard from fellow Bhpians that the Mahindra Getaway 4x4 that was kept in the specially prepared "track" at the Autocar event in Mumbai also fried its clutch trying to get out of the slush.
I believe it was cyrus and clutch was fired while TD
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Old 18th December 2008, 11:47   #92
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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
For example at Mahindra great escape all the scorpio 4x4s had their 4x4 systems failing(the vehicles were provided by mahindra)
ALL???

hey, the vehicles were provided my M&M? i think the owners brought the own vehicles.
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Old 18th December 2008, 11:50   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suman View Post
Are you serious?

I heard from fellow Bhpians that the Mahindra Getaway 4x4 that was kept in the specially prepared "track" at the Autocar event in Mumbai also fried its clutch trying to get out of the slush.
Yup, you can go and read Samurai's report.

Quote:
Originally Posted by raj_5004 View Post
ALL???

hey, the vehicles were provided my M&M? i think the owners brought the own vehicles.
2WD scorpios over there were "owner" vehicles. There were 3 4x4 scorpios provided by Mahindra and driven by partners from shell etc.,
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Old 18th December 2008, 12:05   #94
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yes maybe just three 4x4s were M&M provided, what about the other 4x4s? they were owner driven right? did their 4x4 system also fail, since you mentioned that all the scorpios had failed systems.
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Old 18th December 2008, 12:09   #95
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Originally Posted by raj_5004 View Post
yes maybe just three 4x4s were M&M provided, what about the other 4x4s? they were owner driven right? did their 4x4 system also fail, since you mentioned that all the scorpios had failed systems.
Which other 4x4s?
Who buys scorpio 4x4? IS it even sold anymore? We have maybe 2 on the forum.
All other scorpio's were 4x2s
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Old 18th December 2008, 12:12   #96
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no idea dude, but maybe there were more scorpio 4x4s at the great escape. yes, there were many who reached there with a 4x2, but i guess there will be many who own a 4x4 scorpio and must have participated.

and yes, FYI- the scorpio 4x4 is still available.
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Old 18th December 2008, 12:16   #97
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4 months waiting, and no mHawk. The world as moved on the 2.2(including Mahindra), however, somehow Mahindra feel that all 4x4 owners need to buy older tech. Thats why for somebody buying 4x4 I would not recommend Mahindra, however 4x2 is a different thing, and to each his/her own.
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Old 18th December 2008, 12:19   #98
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IMO, both the safari and scorpio 4x4 systems or for that matter a gypsy 4x4 can fail if driven under wrong conditions or by inexperienced drivers.

Both these vehicles are IMO 'soft-roaders' with a limited amount of serious offroading capability ( tsk, hrag dont shoot me! ). As rightly pointed out, their 4x4 systems can pull you out of a tricky patch of road, thereby giving you that additional peace of mind.

And we do have those bravehearts like hrag, who are pushing the safari to its 4x4 limits! keep it up my friend
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Old 18th December 2008, 12:20   #99
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@ tsk: yea buddy, completely agree to that point. its a shame that scorpio 2.2 buyers are not offered a 4x4, but the question here is-
1) is scorpio available with a 4x4 : yes, the 2.6.... sadly.
2) were there 4x4 scorpios at the great excape which were owner driven: most probably.
3) did ALL the scorpios suffer from failure of the 4x4 tranny: i dont think so.

maybe, i am wrong as i was not present at the great escape.
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Old 18th December 2008, 12:22   #100
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4x4 is available on the Scorpio SLX model as well as the Getaway of course. One has to order it specially, pay the advance and wait for delivery. Could take anywhere from 1 month to 3 months or so.

It costs about a lac or lac and half more than the plain normal 2WD SLX

The Scorp 4WD is a good vehicle - tough and reliable for most general, but not extreme situations. However, because it is a heavy and ponderous vehicle I personally would hesitate to take it into deep slush/ swampy terrain where I used to take my old Gypsy or my old MM540/550. I would even take a 4WD Bolero into some of those places because the Bolero is lighter than the Scorp and more basic in nature.


For extreme mud/ slush etc, I believe it is a pretty much accepted fact by most serious off-road people that the old traditional mechanical 4WD jeep type vehicles are better suited when compared with the newer electrical/ electronically operated systems available, except perhaps when it comes to the serious off roaders like the Land Rover, Pajero, Land Cruiser etc.

Last edited by shankar.balan : 18th December 2008 at 12:24.
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Old 18th December 2008, 12:25   #101
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long time no see shankar!

yes, the limitations of such vehicles are very apparent in such conditions.
the problems with the 3 scorpios which tsk said came into picture because an event like the great escape with such extreme terrains was organised in the first place!
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Old 18th December 2008, 12:26   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smsrini View Post
IMO, both the safari and scorpio 4x4 systems or for that matter a gypsy 4x4 can fail if driven under wrong conditions or by inexperienced drivers.

Both these vehicles are IMO 'soft-roaders' with a limited amount of serious offroading capability ( tsk, hrag dont shoot me! ). As rightly pointed out, their 4x4 systems can pull you out of a tricky patch of road, thereby giving you that additional peace of mind.

And we do have those bravehearts like hrag, who are pushing the safari to its 4x4 limits! keep it up my friend
There are 2 types of failures
First is the sensor failure, which means electrical failure. That should not happen. Nothing to do with soft/hard roader, thats a quality issue.
Second is usage failure. For example, using 4H when stuck and burning clutch, or wading in too deep water letting transfer case get wet(electronics). This failure can easily happen in "soft" roaders and not so easily in "off" roaders.
However clutch burn problem can afflict low torque or heavy off and soft roaders.


Quote:
Originally Posted by raj_5004 View Post
@ tsk: yea buddy, completely agree to that point. its a shame that scorpio 2.2 buyers are not offered a 4x4, but the question here is-
1) is scorpio available with a 4x4 : yes, the 2.6.... sadly.
2) were there 4x4 scorpios at the great excape which were owner driven: most probably.
3) did ALL the scorpios suffer from failure of the 4x4 tranny: i dont think so.

maybe, i am wrong as i was not present at the great escape.
At that particular great escape, due to the locale, it was mostly jeeps.
At Goa escape there are quite a few 4x4 scorpios.

Another point against 4x4 scorpio is the VFM.
Look how much extra you pay for 4x4 scorpio and 4x4 safari ( same variants as 4x2)
Then see what safari gives you extra for 1.2L
1. 4x4
2. LSD
3. Alloys.
What extra does 2.6 give you, and whats the cost increase.... 1.5L I presume
Just 4x4. No LSD, and no Alloys.

However Scorpio 2.2 4x4 is under test by Mahindra, which means its coming sooner or later. The guestion is, is there going to be a 1.5L increase in price and 4 months waiting?

Last edited by tsk1979 : 18th December 2008 at 12:28.
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Old 18th December 2008, 12:37   #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
At that particular great escape, due to the locale, it was mostly jeeps.
At Goa escape there are quite a few 4x4 scorpios.

Another point against 4x4 scorpio is the VFM.
Look how much extra you pay for 4x4 scorpio and 4x4 safari ( same variants as 4x2)
Then see what safari gives you extra for 1.2L
1. 4x4
2. LSD
3. Alloys.
What extra does 2.6 give you, and whats the cost increase.... 1.5L I presume
Just 4x4. No LSD, and no Alloys.

However Scorpio 2.2 4x4 is under test by Mahindra, which means its coming sooner or later. The guestion is, is there going to be a 1.5L increase in price and 4 months waiting?
why are we comparing the safari with the scorpio here buddy? i am not interested in the safari 4x4 even if its a lakh or two cheaper.

we can know the true abilities of the safari only after it participates in an event like the great escape. infact the biggest problem with the safari is its kerb weight- 2520 kgs, the scorpio with 1850 kgs is much better. anyways, lets not get into that as this is a sensitive issue on T-BHP.

what we were discussing here is- how reliable are scorpio 4x4s? apart from the 3 scorpios, how many 4x4 scorpios participated? how did they fare? someone who was present there can give their kind inputs pls!
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Old 18th December 2008, 12:40   #104
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I am not saying 4x4 scorpio is worse. Since bhp1 wants a comfortable 4x4, I am telling him that whether he buys a safari or a scorpio 4x4, there is not much difference except for the money part and availability part
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Old 18th December 2008, 12:45   #105
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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
I am not saying 4x4 scorpio is worse. Since bhp1 wants a comfortable 4x4, I am telling him that whether he buys a safari or a scorpio 4x4, there is not much difference except for the money part and availability part
yes, i agree.
for bhp1, safari is better since he gets the 2.2 engine, 4WD on lower variants and safari is very comfortable on highways.

but i would not agree to the scorpio's relibilty aspect you mentioned.


cheers:
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