Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP India > What Car?


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 19th October 2007, 19:51   #1
BHPian
 
Neel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 166
Thanked: 22 Times
Default Merc 240D : Is it worth it ?

Hi,

My friend at a local garage had bought this 240D to the workshop and called me to take a look.

Here are some pics..








More about the car :
- Imported from the gulf in 88 and has been with the same owner since then.
- Has a coat of paint (dunno when), possibly the original color, Note : the star on the boot is upside-down.
- engine bay looked decent, done 155K Miles. retrofit A/c works fine. New battery
- electricals looked fine including the clock.
- the original sunroof was in working condition
- seats had covers which were in bad shape. The seats underneath looked better on the sides. Seating was not very bad, but i could slightly feel the springs or some metal underneath.
- most of the wodden panel was intact, the left mirror was gone.
- the boot looked good, had some original air filter supplies and a fifth tyre (non alloy)
- there was a emergency health kit (almost unused) on the rear shelf : all in german. The rear sun screen was intact too.
- tyres were 50% worn out, belly looked dirty (couldn;t make out much)

I did take it out for a short drive :
- From the drivers sear : the gears were super smooth (better than my NHC), was able to move through traffic easily. Decent for a diesel engine.
- From the rear and passenger seat : the ride was comfortable.

Negatives :
- Some parts of the floor where the carpet was out, the floor was rusted.
- the seats were not in the best condition
- no left rear view mirror
- front dash needs some work

He was not very sure of price, but indicated that the owner was expecting about 1.8-2L.

Now my question, is it worth the price for 155K miles? Would a W124 be better (for a slightly more price)?
I am still trying to figure out a place to park such a car.

What more should i be looking at for this car at this age?

What do you say guys..

-Neel
Neel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19th October 2007, 20:03   #2
Team-BHP Support
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 11,892
Thanked: 9,729 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Neel View Post


What more should i be looking at for this car at this age?

What do you say guys..

-Neel
A genuine car no doubt and what kills it is the rust

Engine is same as in the matador 407

Old cars now. Must have 3,000-mile oil changes and a new timing chain every 100,000 km or 5 years

Differentials do go. If the big bumpers are damaged it means a heavy impact which may have deformed the structure.

Listen for rattles and look for oil smoke signifying valve guide wear.

Listen for noisy, clonky rear axle. Bounce the rear suspension to make sure shocks still absorb.

The car is slow, unless you are travelling on some bad roads and want a clunker to do it in, why would you look at it. Unless, you really want to put effort into restoring it.

w124 is much more superior to drive and parts will be easier to get
ajmat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19th October 2007, 21:13   #3
BANNED
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: London
Posts: 5,012
Thanked: 147 Times
Default

i just talked to speedy about a mercedes 123 and he was all praises about it..this car is a work horse and will just keep on goin on and on....

personally i think 2 laks is too much..get it down to around 1.5ish..
Cyrus43 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19th October 2007, 21:20   #4
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Mpower's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 10,432
Thanked: 1,682 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ajmat View Post
Engine is same as in the matador 407
Engine code is OM616 also used in Tempo Traveller for a long time.
Mpower is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19th October 2007, 21:41   #5
BHPian
 
Neel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 166
Thanked: 22 Times
Default

Yes, it is the same engine used in the 407.

For me, It's not just going to be a collectible. I would want to drive it around often in and around "Bangalore".

Practically, i can just about manage to squeeze in a third car at home.
Neel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19th October 2007, 21:44   #6
Senior - BHPian
 
JayD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Cochin! At last
Posts: 3,195
Thanked: 1,996 Times
Default

Since you already have two cars, i guess this is not going to be your commute car. Everyone i ask is of the opinion that this is a wonderful car to own. My personal favourite too. Way better than a 124 in my opinion. But if u dont fancy old cars much and want a merc for daily use, the 124 will be better.
Also, try to negotiate to around 1.5 or less.
JayD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19th October 2007, 21:54   #7
Team-BHP Support
 
karlosdeville's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pune
Posts: 9,628
Thanked: 8,107 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ajmat View Post
Engine is same as in the matador 407
Forgive my ignorance, but whats a matador 407? Theres a Matador, and theres a Tata 407. I doubt the 407 was ever offered with the OM 616.

Cheers.
karlosdeville is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19th October 2007, 22:43   #8
Team-BHP Support
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 11,892
Thanked: 9,729 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by karlosdeville View Post
Forgive my ignorance, but whats a matador 407? Theres a Matador, and theres a Tata 407. I doubt the 407 was ever offered with the OM 616.

Cheers.
It was offered in the matador, i may have got the 407 wrong though
ajmat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th October 2007, 01:09   #9
BHPian
 
egangsta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: thane
Posts: 365
Thanked: 5 Times
Default

Matador offered 2 engines the 305 and the 307. The 305 is found in the ambys.
egangsta is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th October 2007, 01:38   #10
Team-BHP Support
 
Rehaan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 22,381
Thanked: 22,603 Times
Default

Aaah... the W123 240D.

Its strange that this thread comes up right now, because i have been driving the BEST example of a W123 i have seen in my life for the past 3 days.

My uncle (living in california) bought a 240D a few months back. It has done 100k miles (160k-km) and runs great. My family had a W123 200 in bombay and it was plagued by rust, but its amazing how good the condition of this car is! (As they say, california cars are in much better condition because of the climate).

Yesterday my uncle told me that his mechanic said they used the 240D engine on ships as generators (the mechanic used to work on a ship), and they had a way to change the oil while the engine was running. The average life of a 240D engine running at a constant 2,000RPM was 20 years !!!

Also, when he bought the car, the mechanic put in a 50-50 mix of petrol and deisel and made my uncle drive it. The car ran absolutely terribly for that period, but once it was switched over to only deisel there was a noticable improvement. Apparently the petrol cleans off impurities and buildup inside the engine.

My uncle has a choice between a 240D and an E55 to drive to work, and chooses the 240D everyday Beat that.

Neel, if the guy was asking 1.8-2L for a petrol 123 i would say no way. But given the deisel literally runs forever, im not sure what the price should be...

Check if there is any black smoke coming out of the exhaust when you rev the engine, also check the engine oil (color and for particulate matter) > a good trick is to check the inside/underside of the oil filler cap.
If the engine seems to run well, your concern should be with the condition of the body, suspension, AC, interiors etc.

I truly love the W123s, but having owned one in bombay i can say that it was a partial nightmare (mostly petrol-engine and auto-transmission related issues though). Even for a deisel the price seems a bit much ?

Take a look through this thread if youre interested
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/what-c...ries-w123.html

cya
R

ps - just took this picture outside the window>>


Last edited by Rehaan : 20th October 2007 at 01:43.
Rehaan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th October 2007, 01:49   #11
Senior - BHPian
 
speedy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Mumbai Meri Jaan
Posts: 6,197
Thanked: 926 Times
Default

the price that the person is asking for is too high.
my personal ride was a 240d and trust me like i mentioned to cyrus is a real work horse. the parts are cheaper than the 124. the engine is the same as the ones used in the tata 407.
the car once done up is a hassle free car with pleasure with each drive you take. i would practically live in my car and loved every minute of driveing it. powerwise the car is very good enough punch for a diesel have raced a modified esteem and beaten it with my car ( street racing format). seats are very comfortable feels like you are in your house sofa. the gears are smooth and hassle free. even in traffic conditions you dont feel as though you are driveing a diesel car.
speedy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th October 2007, 10:58   #12
Senior - BHPian
 
AMATMO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Bangalore\GOA
Posts: 1,456
Thanked: 2 Times
Default

where was the pic taken rehaan? its not in bombay os it? it that your uncles ride
AMATMO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th October 2007, 14:13   #13
GTO
Team-BHP Support
 
GTO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 47,749
Thanked: 89,386 Times
Default

Well, its a 20 year old Benz and will undoubtedly lead to frequent garage visits. Bargain and buy only if you have a soft spot for the 123.

Quote:
Now my question, is it worth the price for 155K miles? Would a W124 be better (for a slightly more price)?
Spot-on! The W124 is way superior in each aspect.
GTO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th October 2007, 15:03   #14
Senior - BHPian
 
V-16's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: mumbai
Posts: 4,575
Thanked: 844 Times
Default

Hi Neel, since you have considered buying a Mercedes 123, let us address your queries one by one;

Quote:
Originally Posted by Neel View Post
Hi,
- Imported from the gulf in 88 and has been with the same owner since then.
- Has a coat of paint (dunno when), possibly the original color, Note : the star on the boot is upside-down.
- engine bay looked decent, done 155K Miles. retrofit A/c works fine. New battery
Its a RHD so was obviously bought in from another country more likely the UK as it has a MPH speedo. The car might have been imported through the Gulf which was very common for TR cars in those days.
The car from the look of it is in good condition and an 84 which I presume it is due to its two square lights in the rectangular headlamp assembly, unless it was upgraded.

Another point which tilts the cars UK origin is that the A/C was fitted here as a lot of cars till mid 90's bought in form the UK had no A/cs. The job could've been done in a much better way using the original switches instead of the tell tale Unicla-Superking fan and compressor switch plonked obscurely anywhere

Quote:
Originally Posted by Neel View Post
Hi,
- electricals looked fine including the clock.
- the original sunroof was in working condition
- seats had covers which were in bad shape. The seats underneath looked better on the sides. Seating was not very bad, but i could slightly feel the springs or some metal underneath.
Nothing goes wrong with the electricals in these and the 124. The electric Gremlins came all out in and from the late 90s W210 models
Re the sunroof make sure it does not leak and that it travels its full path. I presume its an electric sunroof. Please check for rust on the inner path o fthe sunroof.
It has run 155K Miles which is almost 257K kms. Yu cannot expect the seats to last their bounce and stature fo rso long. That not an issue and is not expensive to do.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Neel View Post
Hi,
- most of the wodden panel was intact, the left mirror was gone.
- the boot looked good, had some original air filter supplies and a fifth tyre (non alloy)
- there was a emergency health kit (almost unused) on the rear shelf : all in german. The rear sun screen was intact too.
- tyres were 50% worn out, belly looked dirty (couldn't make out much)
I did take it out for a short drive :
- From the drivers sear : the gears were super smooth (better than my NHC), was able to move through traffic easily. Decent for a diesel engine.
- From the rear and passenger seat : the ride was comfortable.
The Alloys are not the regular W123 alloys.
Do not get exited about the untouched First Aid kit as most Mercs will have them intact. Tell you nothing about the condition of the car.
It is best to change the tyres if not sure how long back they have been shod on the car.
If you have driven a W123 earlier the shifts should be comfortable and should go in directly into the selected gear with a slightly notchy feel about it. If its super smooth and the lever has a lot of travel then you might have to fix the linkages too. Again, a minor and not an expensive job.
The engine is rather responsive specially since its a manual and slightly noisy as compared to the newer engines. Look for the Blue or Black smoke for tell tale valve or piston ring problems as have been pointed out by other members in their previous posts.
The ride is rather comfortable but check for any rattles and thuds going over slight potholes. The best way to check for sounds like these is to take the car in a narrow uncrowded lane and run the car gently with the windows rolled down. Any slight noise will echo through to your ears.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Neel View Post
Negatives :
- Some parts of the floor where the carpet was out, the floor was rusted.
- the seats were not in the best condition
- no left rear view mirror
- front dash needs some work
Ah! Rust my dear is the culprit in old cars and unless you strip it completely you will never know or imagine the kind of rust one can see then.
The rest can be taken care of

Quote:
Originally Posted by Neel View Post
Hi,
He was not very sure of price, but indicated that the owner was expecting about 1.8-2L.
Thats way too high. A mint condition car with no work should cost you around 1.75 max. This car should not be more than 1.0-1.25 max as its a very high mileage car and needs all kinds of work. I would not buy it for more than that.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Neel View Post
Hi,
Now my question, is it worth the price for 155K miles? Would a W124 be better (for a slightly more price)?
No its not worth it and yes a W124 would be definitely better but it wont come for slightly more. A good very well kept, no work required W124 will set you back by at least 4.25-4.5 lakhs which is almost twice the asking amount for the above 240D and thats for a 220. for the 250 add .75 K more, other things remaining the same. Do not be lured with low priced W124s as the replacement parts (A/c and Wire harness, both common complaints) will set you back by a lakh each.
One has to see what one wants here, a W123 or a W124!!



Quote:
Originally Posted by Neel View Post
Hi,
I am still trying to figure out a place to park such a car.
What more should i be looking at for this car at this age?
What do you say guys..
Didn't you say you could squeeze in a parking spot?
The W123 is almost built like a tank; reliable, strong, built to last amongst other things. If well kept and cared for no matter what the ODO shows, it is a good car to have.
Look for any oil on the valve cover any peculiar noise from the engine or suspension. Check for originality of the fabric on the seats (loos original in the pics) Check for accident marks. Misaligned door panels, bonnet, bumpers, boot etc. Look for tell tale damage signs. Check for vibration as that would mean bad or worn out engine mounts. Check for gear slippage and check the clutch. The oil pressure seems good too so you may have a healthy engine on your hands. Get an expert to check it out. Any merc dealer will gladly check the car and give you a written report. It costs peanuts to get this checked out.
The W123 is not exactly a collectible as of today as there are a lot of these cars available, some at throw away prices but the good examples are getting scarce and their prices will rise....soon so if you spot a great and exceptional car grab it even if you have to pay slightly more, the key word here being slightly, not unreasonably more. I just bought a 1884 LHD W123 300 turbodiesel, the american spec and paid a good amount for it. One thing, there are not many such cars with such specs left to buy now and these come loaded as they were American models and came with auto transmission, leather seats, extended bumpers, cruise control and most important a very powerful five cylinder 300D engine which is Turbocharged. Try to locate one like that or even a regular 300D.


Quote:
Originally Posted by speedy View Post
the engine is the same as the ones used in the tata 407.
No Its not Speedy. As Karl pointed out, no Tata product came with an OM-616 engine. It was the Matador/Trax which in fact used the particular engine, but im sure you meant that only as I know, that you know your cars and that was a typo.
V-16 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th October 2007, 15:29   #15
Senior - BHPian
 
nitrous's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: UAE/Lon/Madras
Posts: 6,966
Thanked: 282 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gogi
I just bought a 1884 LHD W123 300 turbodiesel,
Wow!
This car is 123 years old.
nitrous is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Me, My buddy and his Mercedes W123 240D -1984 vinayvtec Super-Cars & Imports in India 25 10th January 2014 13:11
Help Needed With W123 240d benzbala Post-War 35 21st March 2013 13:53
A single owner '85 W123 Mercedes 240D Ricky_63 Luxury, Imports & Niche 9 16th November 2010 23:02
Original Mercedes 240D 123.. Ramanna Post-War 17 6th May 2010 09:53
Mercedes W115 240D Restoration inmate Post-War 13 1st April 2010 18:04


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 02:13.

Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks