[R32_GTR]

Originally Posted by gsferrari

To prove that this was VERY doable, here is a Gypsy crossing with HT tires...no further discussion is needed. I'll post the video tomorrow (away from any usable bandwidth at the moment) so this series of frames from the video should do for now.

THAT is how it is done despite not having appropriate tires for off-roading. Steady throttle inputs that only increase through the obstacle - never backing off until he is clear of the water. Entering slowly to prevent a high bow wave and splashing inside the engine bay.

Technique + ensuring vehicle was on the right path - not a question of what vehicle/IFS/paper filter etc.

If we put this obstacle on EXAMM nobody would even talk about it 10 minutes later...lets not create a drama here.

@ Guru - You're the new "official photographer" - if you scroll through the pics real quick and view them in succession, you can actually see how it went and should have gone for some.

@ Soumya - you've been given a VRS.. You may continue to work pro-bono with Guru..

I think Amit was new to the group - atleast I had met him for the first time.

Lets go easy on speculations. Its a lot easier to just ASK a question and hope it gets answered rather than ASSUMING.

[speedy]

Originally Posted by R32_GTR

Paras/Ibu/Abhishek - Come on guys.. some of the self inflicted damages could have been easily avoided and should be avoided in the future! Nevertheless, now you know better..

Yes they could have but...were not and you dont clap with one hand, it takes two..

Originally Posted by V-16

I think a lot of you have taken my last line, strictly general upon yourselves. Well it was not meant for you or any individual alone.

Bhai anything you say is not taken personally by me, it is for my betterment.

Originally Posted by V-16

As i said above Abhi, i was not referring to You or any particular individual. Its when a group mentality takes over. Thats the time to get your bearings together and decide for yourself, whatever you want to decide so dont take this as personally.

Bhai you know me better, i blank out all other signs and voices except the spotters. Yes i chose to go in and dont blame anyone for the damage.

Originally Posted by V-16,2273244

What i meant for you, was when i said that you should have not started the Thar when it was clearly under water. Also with a capable vehicle like that one tends to get a little overconfident....about ones vehicle i mean. That cardinal mistake could have cost you your gasket. No worries, you have learnt from a mistake which could have been avoided. No lessons here, you know i will always call a spade a spade.

I did what the normal reflex action would be, start the car and drive out. When i was told not to i left it. It was not overconfidence bhai but the lack off knowledge i would like to say. Yes lesson learnt for the next time and now i know one more rule of the game.

Originally Posted by V-16

I know you didi what u were told to. Its them i blame for egging on and you for listening to them. Thats what i meant to control ones own self when there are others egging you to go on. Learning is great and we all learn through our own mistakes which is a great sign and i have seen this in you from the beginning which i respect a lot but i only think you gave the Thar too much credit (not discrediting it in any way) for clearing things on its own. One can see that the Thar is not built for purely off roading, it has to be converted to a more capable off roading vehicle. I think you put more confidence in your vehicle that yourself. See the difference when you off road in your Fortuner. There it is the Man and machine together. Here you need to get yourself back into the helm and take over and show tha Thar whos the Alpha guy. The Thar will not do wonders. Just my observation so please guys dont make this out to be a Thar bashing thread. Seriously if it were any better priced, i would have got one myself, i love the vehicle.!!

No bhai i did not listen to anyone. Now since Devang had done it with the Thar i wanted to try it too. I was asked to go from a certain part which i did and the front tyres has climbed a part of the steep bank too and was asked to back up and come with momentum, thats when the car shut down.

I have never once said that the Thar is a pure bred offroader on its own. I have always said with work done on it, it can be a good offroader. This was a test run on the offroading circuit for it, so that when work starts i know where to improve apon. I agree i have more confidence with the Fortuner as i know her well enough, but the initial otr's i was getting to know the Fortuner and same thing i was doing with the Thar. I had Zero confidence on the Thar and was prepared for the worst and even thought she would break a few bones too. Bhai you have one, why another then?

Originally Posted by V-16

Water and slush is always a part but that is always checked, chartered and tried. Slush or water on the other hand is never waist deep. A least not in the OTRs i have been to. Remember this is a fun thing not a competition. In a competition, its about competing, not in out otrs. At least not yet and i hope it remains this way. I have seen in almost all otrs there is always someone to try to do things from another angle and if they succeed, others will follow. Follow you must but when one gets stuck, then anther and then another, i think one must also learn not to take that route.

Yes bhai i agree, but when ur told to come from the right of where everyone has got stuck you listen. I think i trusted the Spotters way more than i should have, but yet i dont blame anyone. I had the option and i chose to go. Next time i shall wade in myself to check the water level and the soil below.

Originally Posted by gsferrari

To prove that this was VERY doable, here is a Gypsy crossing with HT tires...no further discussion is needed.

THAT is how it is done despite not having appropriate tires for off-roading. Steady throttle inputs that only increase through the obstacle - never backing off until he is clear of the water. Entering slowly to prevent a high bow wave and splashing inside the engine bay.

Technique + ensuring vehicle was on the right path - not a question of what vehicle/IFS/paper filter etc.

It was very doable and the Thar did it the first time on the same path the Gypsy took. The second one was a bit to the right and i'd like to see this gypsy do that one.

That means you should not listen to the spotters and check the path yourself, cause i followed the path told to me.

Originally Posted by genesis

I would not have attempted it on my CJ though. (I hate water and slush)

I dont think you would sir, but would love to see it at some point.

[gsferrari]

Abhi - who was spotting for you?

[Spitfire]

Originally Posted by speedy

I was asked to go from a certain part which i did and the front tyres has climbed a part of the steep bank too and was asked to back up and come with momentum, thats when the car shut down.

The spotter asked you to reverse half way while in the water? That's not a very bright idea.

[garrett_t16]

guru i was spotting , as no other spotter was on this side of the water body.

spitfire,abhi - your tyres never climbed the steep bank , they just dug in ,with the amount of power the thar has , once the turbo kicks in you just start wheelspinning and loose traction, thats what i think. you were on too much of throttle, and they were spinning out of control and going nowhere. i clearly remember me waiting for u to try right and left and when nothing happend and you couldnt come any further i told you to reverse a little and try another path with momentum as the steep bank had perfect 'slots' dug into them because of the wheelspin and your front tyres would perfectly go into them again and wheel-spin , going nowhere but would dig in even deeper.

[V-16]

Chalo guys let it be. Water fording is a pain and if it doesnt have a stone bed, it can turn disasterous any time, with other vehicles digging in further.

I am with Soumya, i would have never gone through this muck, purely for getting the CJ all dirty and stinky.

Wht im looking at another offroading vehicle? well i want to keep the CJ stock, with NDMS and all and we know the restrictions in some areas due to the tyres,otherwise its a no match SWB. If i can get my hands on another CJ with a diesel id gladly drop the idea of a MM 550 which i am nurturing now. Imagine a CJ with a XD3P, lifted to accommodate 31"-ers, power steering, a/c, and the works ...Killer on and off road!!

[fazalaliadil]

Originally Posted by V-16

Imagine a CJ with a XD3P, lifted to accommodate 31"-ers, power steering, a/c, and the works ...Killer on and off road!!

V-16,
For long I too imagined it, its a CJ 340,
XD3P
51" front and rear diffs.
Front: disc
Rear: LSD
A/C
Etc.
Status:WIP at a brisk rate.
Look out for the posting soon.
Regards,

[fazalaliadil]

Originally Posted by fazalaliadil

V-16,
For long I too imagined it, its a CJ 340,
XD3P
51" front and rear diffs.
Front: disc
Rear: LSD
A/C
Etc.
Status:WIP at a brisk rate.
Look out for the posting soon.
Regards,

Let me correct this error.
The 51" front and rear axles,
Front: disc
Rear: LSD
KMT-90 (army)
were suggested by Arka and it is his idea I built the Jeep upon.
Regards,

[ex670c]

Originally Posted by V-16

Wht im looking at another offroading vehicle? well i want to keep the CJ stock, with NDMS and all and we know the restrictions in some areas due to the tyres,otherwise its a no match SWB. If i can get my hands on another CJ with a diesel id gladly drop the idea of a MM 550 which i am nurturing now. Imagine a CJ with a XD3P, lifted to accommodate 31"-ers, power steering, a/c, and the works ...Killer on and off road!!

Hi Gogi,

Welcome to the Club
1) Baskar Keshavalu XD3P + 5.38 (FFRA)
2) Doc. Jones XD3P + 5.38 (51" Front Track) (FFRA)
3) Rajkumar.J XD3P + 5.38 (51" Front Track) (FFRA)
4) Zeal Siva XD3P + 5.38 (51" Front Track) (FFRA)
5) Venkat M XD3P + 5.38 (51" Front Track) + PS (FFRA)
6) Siddharth XD3P + 5.38 (51" Front Track) (FFRA)
7) GTO XD3P + 4.88
7) Suresh Stephen XDP4.9+5.38 (51" Front Track) (FFRA)
8) Patrick K XDP4.9 + 5.38 (51" Front Track) (FFRA)

I may be missing a out a few from the list.

But you are right about the combination, been kicking @&&, and taking names, since March 2006

Regards,

Arka

[headers]

Originally Posted by ex670c

Hi Gogi,

Welcome to the Club
1) Baskar Keshavalu XD3P + 5.38 (FFRA)
2) Doc. Jones XD3P + 5.38 (51" Front Track) (FFRA)
3) Rajkumar.J XD3P + 5.38 (51" Front Track) (FFRA)
4) Zeal Siva XD3P + 5.38 (51" Front Track) (FFRA)
5) Venkat M XD3P + 5.38 (51" Front Track) + PS (FFRA)
6) Siddharth XD3P + 5.38 (51" Front Track) (FFRA)
7) GTO XD3P + 4.88
7) Suresh Stephen XDP4.9+5.38 (51" Front Track) (FFRA)
8) Patrick K XDP4.9 + 5.38 (51" Front Track) (FFRA)

I may be missing a out a few from the list.

But you are right about the combination, been kicking @&&, and taking names, since March 2006

Hey Arka, How come you missed my name ? Just because I have a gypsy

BTW isnt 72 BHP on a SWB jeep an overkill?. Offroad it goes where others dare to.

The other combination I've witnessed is a Isuzu G1 in a SWB jeep with a 5 speed GB and 4WD. That was class purely in terms on NVH. [Ref: TADA 2007 OTR]

[Frankenstein]

Originally Posted by headers

Hey Arka, How come you missed my name ? Just because I have a gypsy

BTW isnt 72 BHP on a SWB jeep an overkill?. Offroad it goes where others dare to.

The other combination I've witnessed is a Isuzu G1 in a SWB jeep with a 5 speed GB and 4WD. That was class purely in terms on NVH. [Ref: TADA 2007 OTR]

Hi Headers, the isuzu 4FG1 with the isuzu MUA5 5 speed gearbox is an awesome combination provided it is using 5.38 crown pinion.

But the sad part is we have to move the GB cross member back by a few inches to plonk the isuzu gearbox which in turn kills the break over angle of the short wheel base which it is cherished for.

Another combination used among the HYD jeepers is the isuzu GI with the 4 speed Mitsubishi/Kia gearbox, which is slightly shorter than the 5 speed isuzu , with 43/8 crown pinion it rocks offroad, still it cant beat a petrol cj3b

[genesis]

Originally Posted by genesis

In retrospect, the last parts of the day was like watching the Indian cricket team in a batting order slide. No power on earth could save us on the path to self destruction

For those who saw the Indian team play against South Africa yesterday.
That is exactly what happened at the OTR.

Ibrahim putting his impaired 2WD gypsy into the pit at the very end was Nehra

[garrett_t16]

i am also running xD3p but with 4.22 diffs and 32'' tyres
still i dont feel any power-loss or incapability.

and i agree with gogi , nothing bears a swb

[motocamp]

Originally Posted by Tejas@perioimpl

Now you know why i penned the OTR code of conduct thread?

Since i wasn't there, i can't comment much except from what i have heard.

Anyways, next time protocol should be enforced!

No man we dont need protocol to be enforced,just common sense

Originally Posted by genesis

Root causes:

What can be done (Will we do it?)

1> Dont tow vehicles out when they get stuck if they dont listen

2> Exclude close friends who go nuts on an OTR

3> Wait 5/10/infinite more years for certain people to be responsible adults


If we cant do the above 3, I would just treat yesterday like a really bad day, learn from it and move on...

I agree Soumya, if people want to be immature and act silly,better to let them work it out for themselves.one guy towing everybody out is just not done man, hats off to him i would have towed out only the genuinely stuck guys, not worth ruining your jeep over people who dont care less or dont know any better.

[V-16]

Originally Posted by fazalaliadil

V-16,
For long I too imagined it, its a CJ 340,
XD3P
51" front and rear diffs.
Front: disc
Rear: LSD
A/C
Etc.
Status:WIP at a brisk rate.
Look out for the posting soon.
Regards,

Sirji, mere muh mein paani aa gaya

Seriously im in need of a Diesel off road warrior. Why? not because i find the Cj incapable but its unmatched because of its limited revs, torque and grip (NDMS) but like the feel and dont want to change anything on that. The Diesel Jee i want to make into a monster go anywhere vehicle (will still not venture into neck deep water or muck/dung slush pits). So please keep a look out for me and then advice me.

Originally Posted by motocamp

No man we dont need protocol to be enforced,just common sense

Kunal, trust me, with some of these lots, thats what you need to do as common sense is not very common with some of them.

I agree Soumya, if people want to be immature and act silly,better to let them work it out for themselves.one guy towing everybody out is just not done man, hats off to him i would have towed out only the genuinely stuck guys, not worth ruining your jeep over people who dont care less or dont know any better.

I dont believe you would have left anyone there in the lurch. In fact i dont think any one of us would have done that. Speak as much as we may, we are not built to do it, though i agree that this is what should be done.

I had suggested that if any over testosterone charged individual chooses not to follow the rules and due to that gets stuck then his vehicle should be rescued only after the entire OTR is done with. Till then he could choose to stand next to his vehicle or ride along as a passenger in someone else's vehicle, who prefers to follow the rules. This should be announced at the beginning and strictly enforced, even with some of the older and more matured off roaders. In this way he will learn a lesson and if he chooses not to attend the next one, so be it.