[GrayBerry]

All,
Any update from force on 4X4?

[4x4addict]

Originally Posted by GrayBerry

All,
Any update from force on 4X4?

Yes. The update is to head for the Mahindra showroom in a few months and grab a Mahindra Thar or wait for a couple of years for the Chinese Trax (possibly a Hummer H1 clone with an engine ripped off from an 82 Corolla).

[GrayBerry]

Originally Posted by 4x4addict

Yes. The update is to head for the Mahindra showroom in a few months and grab a Mahindra Thar or wait for a couple of years for the Chinese Trax (possibly a Hummer H1 clone with an engine ripped off from an 82 Corolla).

, sounds so true 4x4addict.
Am I the only one seeing so much potential of a Force 4X4 or is it a screen saver? How I wish we could compare and make a choose between Judo or Bolero - seeing them with CRDi & 4X4 - this is a unique class which would be a runaway success.

[4x4addict]

@GrayBerry:

The Gurkha/Judo is a vehicle with a lot of potential. But unfortunately the sleepy heads at Force Motors have no stomach to compete with Mahindra and Tata and are very content serving the taxi/commercial segement. The Trax/Gama/Judo is very superior to the Bolero in many ways. Why have they not capitalized on this??

The problem is that Mahindra/Tata and just about every UV maker in this country has left Force eating dust that assembling some knock-off chinese MUV and pricing it at 12 lakhs won't bring people flocking to Force motors show rooms. Partly cause most people don't know what Force Motors is and where the show room is.

[rhandle]

Originally Posted by 4x4addict

@GrayBerry:



The problem is that Mahindra/Tata and just about every UV maker in this country has left Force eating dust that assembling some knock-off chinese MUV and pricing it at 12 lakhs won't bring people flocking to Force motors show rooms. Partly cause most people don't know what Force Motors is and where the show room is.

So true and so sad. The credibility of company in this segment forces people to keep shut.

But there would be something in Force to be able to get collaboration going on with MAN/ Merc. / Tempo!!!

[4x4addict]

@Rhandle:

I am sure that Force does have the technical and engineering capability, but I don't think they have the drive/interest to compete in the private consumer segment, which is a shame as there is a lot of potential there.

Regarding collaboration with Merc, Force/Tempo made earlier versions of Mercdes products under licence to sell in india and some other parts of the world. The original Tempo Trax and Tempo Traveller are products that came out of this licensing agreement. Besides this, I believe they also make gear boxes for the army(basic) version of the G-Wagen. Guess now they may have obtained the license to make the earlier version of the OM611 and a newer gearbox. The latest Tempo Trax and Tempo traveller, no longer carry the mercedes engine. So it is pretty much parts of the body, gearbox and axles that are carried over from the original Mercedes license. As you know Mercedes has moved light years ahead of the the technology provided to Force. So I think colloboration is the wrong term, but more a licensee of older a hand full of older mercedes vehicles and power trains is the more apt term.

[Spitfire]

Originally Posted by 4x4addict

The Trax/Gama/Judo is very superior to the Bolero in many ways.

Not really.

Mechanically, engineering wise maybe superior to an extent but as a buying experince its worser then Sonalika.

I know of one Sonalika Showroom in Bangalore, I dont know where the TRAX outlet is.

[rhandle]

Originally Posted by 4x4addict

@Rhandle:

I am sure that Force does have the technical and engineering capability, but I don't think they have the drive/interest to compete in the private consumer segment, which is a shame as there is a lot of potential there.

I guess this is the only reason they are dying. If Gurkha would have been available easily, it still might have made enough in-roads in to market despite the initial shortcomings.

One of the reason why I do not recommend Gurkha to everyone, but people who are really ready to take up the pains initially for this vehicle.

[abhinav.s]

Originally Posted by 4x4addict

Yes. The update is to head for the Mahindra showroom in a few months and grab a Mahindra Thar or wait for a couple of years for the Chinese Trax (possibly a Hummer H1 clone with an engine ripped off from an 82 Corolla).

this had me rolling in splits. But yes the thar seems to be a capable vehicle going by the thread on thar in t-bhp! Its now a wait-n-see game till the prices and official launch date are announced!!

[GrayBerry]

4x4addict, rhandle & all,
I have given up on force motors, even though I see a Judo with OM611 CRDi, 4WD, AC, PS with 7 seating, 5 door option as the best on Indian roads. I would gladly pay 2 to 3 lakhs Rs extra for the above combo when compared to similar vehicle with the same config.
Sad, very sad force motors.
Life goes on, cannot wait for force anymore.

[4x4addict]

@GrayBerry:

The Thar launch is confirmed by various Mahindra officials including the man Mr. Mahindra himself. The specs of the Gurkha are great on paper, but for the off-road credibility there are various issues with the ergonomics fit and finish and overall build quality. Besides the front and rear diff lockers the suspension set up of the Thar is same as the Gurkha (Independent Front and Leaf Spring in the rear). GC can be bumped to 235 mm by using the same tire size as the Gurkha (7.50x16). Dana 44 lockers can be imported for the Thar if required. But for the small perceived off-road disadvantage a Thar will have it comes some major advantages including a awsome engine, good driving dynamics and Mahindra After Sales Support.

My suggestion is to spring for the Thar.

[GrayBerry]

4x4addict:

Yes, I am going for the Thar.

I need to start a thread to finalize a list of accessories that I can carry from here (USA). My list starts with free wheeling hubs (warn make) and would go on. List of accessories that is a must and optional for Thar.
Well not the correct thread to talk about it,.. so signing off.

[rhandle]

Though I would have voiced for Gurkha fiercely but then thinking rationale and being practical I would have given same advice as 4x4 addict!!

Wait on Gurkha might prove futile. Even the people with whom I am in touch are unaware of the outcome and situation.

I would though then go on to suggest that instead of spending money on thar and building it up, wont it be wise to buy a scrap and build it up with your choice of engine and everything.

Just Think what 6.5L ( expected money you would pay for thar) would do that machine, now add whatever money you would had put on mods for thar - I guess your machine would become invincible - in terms of comfort or offroad!

[4x4addict]

@rhandle:

The problem in building up an MM540 is that it ends up becoming a purely off-road vehicle which you cannot use to munch miles. This is one advantage that the Gurkha has clearly over the MM540. It is good off-road and much more usable than the MM540 for long distance cruising. In order to make an MM540 closer to the Gurkha in terms of long distance usability you have will have to upgrade, engine, gearbox, suspension, etc. Unless you have a very competent mechanic you will end up with an unreliable product. There is absolutely nothing like getting a brand new vehicle of the showroom which is good on road and good off-road.

To me, this was the main USP of the Gurkha. Buy a new vehicle that is very off-road capable and has some creature comforts for long distance driving. Buying a second hand mm540 and customizing assuming you have the time/resourced/mechanic will never give as reliable a vehicle as new one.

[rhandle]

I hope if not Judo they release Gama with 611 and 4wd :d

But then if there was something in their head, this idea would already have been drilled and fallen through :(