Maruti Gypsy MG413W - King Pin Bearing issue

gsferrari · 8th March 2011, 12:15

@Vikram - I think the front end is too stiff now. Arka also said that the extended shackles induce yaw in the axles. I will try stock shackles and see if I am able to drive around with the trepadors. Otherwise I will try 1" shackles instead of the 2" I am using now. Lets see...

Leaf count - can't remember off the top of my head - will update after I get to Allan's.

Jaggu · 8th March 2011, 14:54

What size Trepadors do you use, if its 235's it should be easily manageable. Or do the body lift, simple, clean and cheap upgrade to increase the clearance.

gsferrari · 9th March 2011, 11:15

I use 235s and I have a 2" shackle lift and negative offset tires. Working very well. The trouble is I am not able to point my finger at these mods as the cause of the issue because others are driving with these mods without any problems. Why my car?

I'll truss the current axle housing properly and then see if it recurs.

starter · 9th March 2011, 11:43

Exactly my thoughts too Guru.
Finally, what is the conclusion? Is it because of the extended shackle or because of the stiffer suspension 'coz of the additional leaves added?
Wouldn't it be better to undo one after the other than both at the same time?
Cheers,
Deepak

gsferrari · 9th March 2011, 13:39

starter - I am running only 5 leaves all around re-cambered. There are people running 7-8 leaves without any issues. I think the two factors for the damage to my vehicle are:

1. The Gypsy is my daily drive and gets a lot of mileage on the bad roads in Mumbai (horrid roads on EEH) with the vertical steps in the concrete and the paver-brick patches etc.

2. My driving style off-road is too fast and I am not yet able to gauge the amount of throttle required to avoid jumping around.

Jaggu · 9th March 2011, 14:45

How about negative offset rims, do they harm?

starter · 9th March 2011, 15:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaggu

How about negative offset rims, do they harm?

Not sure Jaggu. We both know of folks running on negative offset rims, spacers, recambered/additional leaves.
Maybe am wrong, but the amount of yaw a SPOA would induce on axles would be much more than what a 2" shackle would, right?
I haven't heard of any KP failures from Shan, have you?
So, i am wondering why it is giving issues to Guru.
Cheers,
Deepak

gsferrari · 9th March 2011, 15:16

@Jaggu and Starter - Arka and Headers are dead against the offset rims and shackles. I completely agree with them that the suspension steering geometry gets altered and this can cause the kind of problems I am facing.

What I am not able to understand is why I am the only one. You think my 110 kilos acting on one side of the front axle is causing these issues?

I am the first to admit I have a flawed driving style and I will be more careful in future. This weekend I am tackling the same obstacle that did me in the last time.

livyodream · 9th March 2011, 16:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by gsferrari

starter - I am running only 5 leaves all around re-cambered. There are people running 7-8 leaves without any issues. I think the two factors for the damage to my vehicle are:

What is the necessity of having 5 leaves all around? i dont think gypsy needs 5 leaves other than carrying load on it. Im running on 3 leaves re-cambered and have jumped couple of times without an issue.

With 3 leaves I feel i am driving a road roller

. I just cannot imagine with 5 leaves.

BTW, how many of them are running on negative offset rims here? Mine? i don't think they are negative offset.

gsferrari · 9th March 2011, 16:37

I need more leaves because of bigger tires and differential locks. With 3 leaves I could not get the cambering I needed to lift the body clear of the tires. I also broke 3 leaves with stock tires on one of the OTRs so I am not hugely optimistic about them surviving with the current configuration of my vehicle.

Sudarshan · 9th March 2011, 16:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by gsferrari

I'll truss the current axle housing properly and then see if it recurs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gsferrari

I need more leaves because of bigger tires and differential locks. With 3 leaves I could not get the cambering I needed to lift the body clear of the tires. I also broke 3 leaves with stock tires on one of the OTRs ===

Hmmm , 5 leaves + fortified axle tube

Guru , don't feel offended but IMHO this IS a wrong way out , you are strengthening ( stiffening ) those parts & leaving chassis exposed for the shock ( the weak link then ) to get hurt .

What I mean is you CAN afford another set of leaves & may be another tube ( axle housing ) but certainly not chassis .

Seriously there is something wrong with your driving style OR the Gypsy is not suitable for it .

One Q , do you brake hard when you touch down ? I mean at the same time of touch down from a jump .

Look these vehicles are not suitable for what you( people ) are doing ( the kind of off roading ) that's why the reliability is going down .Either you back down two steps OR the vehicle needs to be prepared for some more strength & that includes some serious redesigning thing & mods . In short some kick A mods .

Sudarshan

livyodream · 9th March 2011, 17:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by gsferrari

I need more leaves because of bigger tires and differential locks. With 3 leaves I could not get the cambering I needed to lift the body clear of the tires.

We both are running on same tyres. Im running on 3 cambered leaves and 7.5J rims. So 235/75/R15 can fit into 3 leaf setup.

BTW how is Diff lock is related to extra leaves..

EDIT : Gypsy boy is running on the same (5 leaf) setup and not heard any issues from him.

8th March 2011, 12:15	#76
gsferrari Senior - BHPian Join Date: May 2009 Location: Chennai Posts: 1,014 Thanked: 1,809 Times	Re: Maruti Gypsy MG413W - King Pin Bearing issue @Vikram - I think the front end is too stiff now. Arka also said that the extended shackles induce yaw in the axles. I will try stock shackles and see if I am able to drive around with the trepadors. Otherwise I will try 1" shackles instead of the 2" I am using now. Lets see... Leaf count - can't remember off the top of my head - will update after I get to Allan's.
	() Thanks

8th March 2011, 14:54	#77
Jaggu Team-BHP Support Join Date: May 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 20,215 Thanked: 15,907 Times	Re: Maruti Gypsy MG413W - King Pin Bearing issue What size Trepadors do you use, if its 235's it should be easily manageable. Or do the body lift, simple, clean and cheap upgrade to increase the clearance.
	() Thanks

9th March 2011, 11:15	#78
gsferrari Senior - BHPian Join Date: May 2009 Location: Chennai Posts: 1,014 Thanked: 1,809 Times	Re: Maruti Gypsy MG413W - King Pin Bearing issue I use 235s and I have a 2" shackle lift and negative offset tires. Working very well. The trouble is I am not able to point my finger at these mods as the cause of the issue because others are driving with these mods without any problems. Why my car? I'll truss the current axle housing properly and then see if it recurs.
	() Thanks

9th March 2011, 11:43	#79
starter Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Bangalore Posts: 1,127 Thanked: 903 Times	Re: Maruti Gypsy MG413W - King Pin Bearing issue Exactly my thoughts too Guru. Finally, what is the conclusion? Is it because of the extended shackle or because of the stiffer suspension 'coz of the additional leaves added? Wouldn't it be better to undo one after the other than both at the same time? Cheers, Deepak
	() Thanks

9th March 2011, 13:39	#80
gsferrari Senior - BHPian Join Date: May 2009 Location: Chennai Posts: 1,014 Thanked: 1,809 Times	Re: Maruti Gypsy MG413W - King Pin Bearing issue starter - I am running only 5 leaves all around re-cambered. There are people running 7-8 leaves without any issues. I think the two factors for the damage to my vehicle are: 1. The Gypsy is my daily drive and gets a lot of mileage on the bad roads in Mumbai (horrid roads on EEH) with the vertical steps in the concrete and the paver-brick patches etc. 2. My driving style off-road is too fast and I am not yet able to gauge the amount of throttle required to avoid jumping around.
	() Thanks

9th March 2011, 14:45	#81
Jaggu Team-BHP Support Join Date: May 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 20,215 Thanked: 15,907 Times	Re: Maruti Gypsy MG413W - King Pin Bearing issue How about negative offset rims, do they harm?
	() Thanks

9th March 2011, 15:16	#83
gsferrari Senior - BHPian Join Date: May 2009 Location: Chennai Posts: 1,014 Thanked: 1,809 Times	Re: Maruti Gypsy MG413W - King Pin Bearing issue @Jaggu and Starter - Arka and Headers are dead against the offset rims and shackles. I completely agree with them that the suspension steering geometry gets altered and this can cause the kind of problems I am facing. What I am not able to understand is why I am the only one. You think my 110 kilos acting on one side of the front axle is causing these issues? I am the first to admit I have a flawed driving style and I will be more careful in future. This weekend I am tackling the same obstacle that did me in the last time.
	() Thanks

9th March 2011, 16:37	#85
gsferrari Senior - BHPian Join Date: May 2009 Location: Chennai Posts: 1,014 Thanked: 1,809 Times	Re: Maruti Gypsy MG413W - King Pin Bearing issue I need more leaves because of bigger tires and differential locks. With 3 leaves I could not get the cambering I needed to lift the body clear of the tires. I also broke 3 leaves with stock tires on one of the OTRs so I am not hugely optimistic about them surviving with the current configuration of my vehicle.
	() Thanks