[4x4addict]

Dear Mr. Behram, Do you think there is a reason, why no one in Mahindra top management drives around in an MM540/MM550 or Thar DI? Some of us do and when we do that, we need to make the vehicle more easy to live with, so we will customize it within reasonable limits.

[gthang]

Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM

[b][u]
Dear gthang - Thar DI and Thar CRDe rear end of the chassis belong to the same family but there are subtle changes. For one vehicle, you can fit the MM540 pintle hook channel but I cannot guarantee reliability of the system unless it goes through the due diligence of design and CAE. By the way, as your name details indicate that you are based in Coimbatore, please PM your contact number to me. I visit Coimbatore quite regularly in relation with "work". We can catch up.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

Sir,

What are the changes in the two models as far as the chassis goes? Will reinforcement by welding "K" or any other type foul with gas tank? Will a stronger new bumper suffice?

We might have seen each other already as I often see lightly disguised Safari Storme test mules on our Superbike rides on the Coimbatore - Palladam - Dharapuram route. Thanks for the invite but please excuse my fondness for anonymity.

Cheers

[tsk1979]

Originally Posted by 4x4addict

Dear Mr. Behram, Do you think there is a reason, why no one in Mahindra top management drives around in an MM540/MM550 or Thar DI? Some of us do and when we do that, we need to make the vehicle more easy to live with, so we will customize it within reasonable limits.

LOL. Do you believe anybody in the Mahindra top management would be aware what's a MM550 or MM540.
They only know Jeep, bolero, scorpio, XUV

For those who want 7 seater tractor = Jeep
For those who want 7 seater tractor with AC = Bolero
For those who want 7 seater SUV = scorpio
For those who want 7 seater SUV with price more than 12L = XUV.

MM540,550,800,900,Thar,DI,BI,LI,CJB all = Jeep

[DHABHAR.BEHRAM]

Originally Posted by 4x4addict

Dear Mr. Behram, Do you think there is a reason, why no one in Mahindra top management drives around in an MM540/MM550 or Thar DI? Some of us do and when we do that, we need to make the vehicle more easy to live with, so we will customize it within reasonable limits.

Dear 4*4 addict - what a million dollar question, of course I know. HaHaHa. Tanveer has already replied partially, so HaHaHa once again. Here goes.

Buzz gets around within the "corporate types" that "Sir, this is not the correct way to make a vehicle Sir", "Sir, these people just don't understand, you know Sir", "Sir, just see how useless the fit and finish is, I tell you Sir, we just cannot enter the market like this". Guy - "Blah Blah Blah"! Sir - "Hmmm". Guy - "Yes Sir, Yes Sir, Yes Sir"! Corporate ladder in grasp!

So the guys whose only agenda in the company is to climb the corporate ladder (they are a dime a dozen in there at all levels and they can do only this as they cannot actually make the vehicle, there are always idiots who do it so that they take the credit), make it a point to subtly show that they are not interested, lest they be branded as traitors amongst clones of themselves. The clones follow suit, the doom loop gathers momentum which becomes an avalanche. Anyways, "Sir, we can sell only a few of these Sir. These are in any case brand building exercises, so it is really not important Sir"! Now you know?

Anyways, today I am having the last laugh. I visited a showroom in Maharashtra 15 days back (incognito of course, had a very "interesting" conversation on "what is the meaning of 4*4", had a hearty laugh which would not stop but that's another story!) and I have a proforma invoice informing me that Thar CRDe has a waiting period of six months! Game over! The damn thing is selling much more than its projected volume and they did not even have a contingency plan to make enough of them. The thing costs Rs.8,35,000/- on road in Mumbai! HaHaHa. .

Reality - it still makes my head turn when I see one! I still smile quietly when I see one! If there is one in front of me, I make it a point to stand next to it at the next traffic signal and give it a flying kiss! After all, that's all that matters, isn't it? Amen!

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

[Sudarshan]

Tini Sir ; Sorry for the

Originally Posted by Sudarshan

2) Occasional trailer pulling ( 1.3 tons gvw trailer , with run-over brakes ) - On & off highway

Originally Posted by gthang

Would be interested to know how you will achieve this with a Thar CRDe.

Cheers

Originally Posted by gthang

I'm just curious if that bumper is good enough for your load, and if not, what reinforcement will you do? How good a job can you do welding reinforcements as far as trueness to chassis is concerned since you will not be welding in a jig. What, if any, effect on the chassis might happen after loading, etc. Trailer towing is of interest to me as well.

Assume Thar DI chassis rear end is same.

Cheers.

Here it is , these are pics from this thread , Just for the Reference
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/4x4-te...-database.html

The Plate





Army 550 NGCS ( a friends Jeep )





If I am not wrong this is a well known CRDe on the forum
nothing can go wrong here at least


Dear Mr gthang What do you think ? I think It will work .

Sudarshan

[gthang]

Originally Posted by Sudarshan

Dear Mr gthang What do you think ? I think It will work .

Sudarshan

I think you have shown me some nice pictures of the mounting plate. Thank you.

If you follow the thread that you linked, there was some discussion about the missing K member. Distinguished member ex670c pointed out that post 1993 the K member was discontinued, and that some vehicles had a reinforced rear section.

I just wanted to confirm that the Thar, either CRDe, or MDI has that reinforced chassis or not. The 521 Thar you showed, apparently violates every CMVR regulation there is, so I dont know if that is the right example to use.

If you feel it will work for you, Great!! I would rather measure twice and cut once.

Cheers.

[Sudarshan]

Originally Posted by gthang

I just wanted to confirm that the Thar, either CRDe, or MDI has that reinforced chassis or not.

OK Point Noted , K or No K ( member ) , this should concern me too .

The 521 Thar you showed, apparently violates every CMVR regulation there is, so I dont know if that is the right example to use.

If you go by the book , more than half of the current off roader's Jeeps will not fit the ( said ) criteria , but thats a different topic all together .

If you feel it will work for you, Great!! I would rather measure twice and cut once.
Cheers.

Now Back to topic , Thanks for the concern , Yes I need to be concerned too & I am . wont be doing it without taking due care .

I am not doing this for Fun or weekend trips with a bike loaded in trailer for fun , there is some serious work & money involved & the requirements will grow by day , I will be running a loaded trailer at least twice a month ( regular schedule without trailer may be twice a week ) on a highway that is always busy & on internal ' roads ' ( or even no roads ) & on farm tracks in all seasons .

Thats the only reason I aske Tini Sir , as there are very few guys who do Jeeps for daily basis

vinod_nookala
Sudarshan,
Barring the requirement of your father being comfortable, from what you have written i suggest you should go for THAR Di 4x4 purely because your requirement is utility and not lifestyle. THAR Di is cheaper, lot cheaper to repair if things go wrong. Gives fantastic mileage.

If you need a vehicle for self drive, for city use and need basic comfort cost being no bar go for CRDe. Please be clear in terms of your requirement - Utility or lifestyle.

Vinod Ji there are many 'Unlike' things with the Di -- starting from tyres to seats , yes its a great utility vehicle , but a guy living with a 89 model 540 for 23 years certainly 'Needs & deserves ' more .

when I saw the Rolling chassis of the CRDe with DB Sir ,I felt like its my dream Jeep , the Jeep that I would have 'Put together ' ( barring FFRA ) , I am still stuck there

But its Nice to see people like you take note of Tini sir's observations , please also see that the products make life easier . in daily use


Sudarshan

[vinod_nookala]

Originally Posted by 4x4addict

So the million dollar question is should you the Thar DI instead of the Thar CRDe. The simple answer from a jeeper who has owned and driven almost all jeeps made by Mahindra is a resounding NO. Pick the Thar CRDe and get the DI only if you can check the most of boxes below

___ You cannot afford the CRDe Thar.
___ You plan to use it 80% off road and 20% on road.
___ You have the knowledge, resources and patience to alter the diff ratio, seats, tyres, etc.
___ You use your vehicle for work to carry load/workers etc..

If you look at the On road price of the DI and CRDe AC there is almost 2 Lakh difference on the road, but when you look the extras the CRDe provides, it is well worth the difference.

Thanks tini for your unbiased review. I guess you remember our detailed conversation before you made your choice. You have precisely mentioned that I had told you then. THAR Di is nothing but MM550 with Di engine and better chassis in BS 3 format. Hence the expectations from this vehicle needs to be kept simple. Use it like a utility vehicle and it will not let you down.

Noted your comments on the vehicles basic essentials.

Originally Posted by ex670c

Hi Tini,

Please do SHOW-OFF your vehicle, its always a treat to checkout a new JEEP.

Regards,

Arka

So Arka, When are you going to show off?

Originally Posted by 4x4addict

Dear Mr. Behram, Do you think there is a reason, why no one in Mahindra top management drives around in an MM540/MM550 or Thar DI? Some of us do and when we do that, we need to make the vehicle more easy to live with, so we will customize it within reasonable limits.

People like me & Behram (then) lived with this product and THAR CRDe was born. Essential changes like A/C and immobilizer among other things happened which is why the waiting period is soaring. This is not the end of the road, there are many more things happening. So, rest assured there is somebody in M&M who is taking this forward and driving and living with it day in & day out.

Originally Posted by tsk1979

LOL. Do you believe anybody in the Mahindra top management would be aware what's a MM550 or MM540.
They only know Jeep, bolero, scorpio, XUV

For those who want 7 seater tractor = Jeep
For those who want 7 seater tractor with AC = Bolero
For those who want 7 seater SUV = scorpio
For those who want 7 seater SUV with price more than 12L = XUV.

MM540,550,800,900,Thar,DI,BI,LI,CJB all = Jeep

LOl...good one! it is the same tractor+A/C+7 seats+killer pricing+ DI+ Bi giving competition jitters

Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM

Dear 4*4 addict -
Anyways, today I am having the last laugh. I visited a showroom in Maharashtra 15 days back (incognito of course, had a very "interesting" conversation on "what is the meaning of 4*4", had a hearty laugh which would not stop but that's another story!) and I have a proforma invoice informing me that Thar CRDe has a waiting period of six months! Game over! The damn thing is selling much more than its projected volume and they did not even have a contingency plan to make enough of them. The thing costs Rs.8,35,000/- on road in Mumbai! HaHaHa. .

Reality - it still makes my head turn when I see one! I still smile quietly when I see one! If there is one in front of me, I make it a point to stand next to it at the next traffic signal and give it a flying kiss! After all, that's all that matters, isn't it? Amen!

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

dhabhar sir.... Btw I feel there is lot more potential to this product as a brand. So preserve your laughs & kisses. You may need more than you think.

Originally Posted by Sudarshan

OK Point Noted , K or No K ( member ) , this should concern me too .



If you go by the book , more than half of the current off roader's Jeeps will not fit the ( said ) criteria , but thats a different topic all together .



Now Back to topic , Thanks for the concern , Yes I need to be concerned too & I am . wont be doing it without taking due care .

I am not doing this for Fun or weekend trips with a bike loaded in trailer for fun , there is some serious work & money involved & the requirements will grow by day , I will be running a loaded trailer at least twice a month ( regular schedule without trailer may be twice a week ) on a highway that is always busy & on internal ' roads ' ( or even no roads ) & on farm tracks in all seasons .

Thats the only reason I aske Tini Sir , as there are very few guys who do Jeeps for daily basis

Sudarshan

Sudarshan,
Barring the requirement of your father being comfortable, from what you have written i suggest you should go for THAR Di 4x4 purely because your requirement is utility and not lifestyle. THAR Di is cheaper, lot cheaper to repair if things go wrong. Gives fantastic mileage.

If you need a vehicle for self drive, for city use and need basic comfort cost being no bar go for CRDe. Please be clear in terms of your requirement - Utility or lifestyle.

[DHABHAR.BEHRAM]

Originally Posted by vinod_nookala

Dhabhar sir, I feel there is lot more potential to this product as a brand. So preserve your laughs & kisses. You may need more than you think.

Dear Vinod - Of course, there is much more to this brand than is seen on the road today. We both know that what is there on the road is just the first step. Therefore, you are absolutely correct.

So, go ahead and finally put our dream Thar, the real Thar in production. Sell it in the market out there and delight customers, that and only that will make me really happy and I will be proud of you. My best wishes are with you.

Also, kisses come from the heart, although they don't cost anything, they are priceless and although they are supposed to be forever, make that vehicle so good that eventually even I will run out of kisses to give them! What more can I ask for! Amen!

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

[DrvSafe]

Originally Posted by tsk1979

LOL. Do you believe anybody in the Mahindra top management would be aware what's a MM550 or MM540.
They only know Jeep, bolero, scorpio, XUV

For those who want 7 seater tractor = Jeep
For those who want 7 seater tractor with AC = Bolero
For those who want 7 seater SUV = scorpio
For those who want 7 seater SUV with price more than 12L = XUV.

MM540,550,800,900,Thar,DI,BI,LI,CJB all = Jeep

tsk1979, Hilarious, but true.
But it may be all same for them, but at-least from consumer pov, shouldn't the engineers/designers set up a decent interior. What is the point of shelling out the amount and doing so much mods, rather they can just sell the chassis along with steering, make shift chairs etc like trucks do, and we can set up the entire interior and still save some bucks.

[DHABHAR.BEHRAM]

Originally Posted by DrvSafe

tsk1979, Hilarious, but true.
But it may be all same for them, but at-least from consumer pov, shouldn't the engineers/designers set up a decent interior. What is the point of shelling out the amount and doing so much mods, rather they can just sell the chassis along with steering, make shift chairs etc like trucks do, and we can set up the entire interior and still save some bucks.

Dear Drvsafe - this is my first reply to your post, so without intending to repeat what has been beaten to death on this forum, let me just say that the Thar interiors are the way they are so that a compulsory requirement called CMVR could be met in the shortest possible time with the minimum possible investment (read as - "next to nothing"), so the "business case" made sense. We could have given the best to you out there but then the vehicle would have seen light of day (if somebody did not kill it first) sometime in "late 2015" or thereabouts, by which time the market would have disappeared. . That was something, which I did not allow to happen under any circumstances (some tried, but failed miserably, HaHaHa!), and I have no hesitancy in saying so on this open forum.

That said, this vehicle is "essentially meant for" and "lends itself perfectly to" the needs of a "typical customer" who "likes to tinker around". You can see that most of the TeamBHPians who have bought it have tinkered with it. One of these days, I am also going to buy it and I will also tinker with it as it has never been tinkered with before. Also, the company is in the business of "making money" by "selling vehicles", not parts. I hope I have been able to give some sort of an answer to your query.

Fact - today at Rs.8,35,000/- on road in Maharashtra (my friend bought a red one last week), it has a 6 months waiting period. It certainly does not have the best interiors but even at this price, which I feel is more, it is making perfect sense to many customers out there! I am not justifying anything, I am just stating the fact. I wanted success in the marketplace, I knew exactly what to do. I did it and I got what I wanted. Show me one other Indian vehicle which was made by spending next to nothing money and which has got 6 months waiting period in the marketplace out there, in the year 2012!

So guys, it's all about "Walk the talk and convert that talk into action". I am very happy to read Vinod's comments that this vehicle has been taken seriously now. If done correctly, it will certainly see new levels of success never seen before. Let's see!

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

[DrvSafe]

Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM

Dear Drvsafe - this is my first reply to your post, so without intending to repeat what has been beaten to death on this forum, let me just say that the Thar interiors are the way they are so that a compulsory requirement called CMVR could be met in the shortest possible time with the minimum possible investment (read as - "next to nothing"), so the "business case" made sense. We could have given the best to you out there but then the vehicle would have seen light of day (if somebody did not kill it first) sometime in "late 2015" or thereabouts, by which time the market would have disappeared. . That was something, which I did not allow to happen under any circumstances (some tried, but failed miserably, HaHaHa!), and I have no hesitancy in saying so on this open forum.

That said, this vehicle is "essentially meant for" and "lends itself perfectly to" the needs of a "typical customer" who "likes to tinker around". You can see that most of the TeamBHPians who have bought it have tinkered with it. One of these days, I am also going to buy it and I will also tinker with it as it has never been tinkered with before. Also, the company is in the business of "making money" by "selling vehicles", not parts. I hope I have been able to give some sort of an answer to your query....

Sir, my rank shows "newbie" in Team-BHP and I really am one even when it comes to 4-wheeler scene. Thanks for letting me know the details and the "next to nothing" design investment, and I must say it is really a good option taking the facts that you have mentioned into consideration. Anyways, now I have points to tell other guys whom I have heard complaining about Thar interiors. I was also amazed to know about the waiting period, that speaks about the demand out there for the machine. As vinod said, this product really has the potential to grow and lets see how that unfolds.

Kind Regards

[DirtyDan]

Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM

You can see that most of the TeamBHPians who have bought it have tinkered with it. One of these days, I am also going to buy it and I will also tinker with it as it has never been tinkered with before.

B.D. there is a little blurring of purpose here on this DI thread as to whether you are going to tinker with CRDe or DI. Either way or both, I want a copy and a cup of whatever broth you are brewing. You may well have your next career mapped out for you by tinkering thus.

[DHABHAR.BEHRAM]

Originally Posted by DirtyDan

B.D. there is a little blurring of purpose here on this DI thread as to whether you are going to tinker with CRDe or DI. Either way or both, I want a copy and a cup of whatever broth you are brewing. You may well have your next career mapped out for you by tinkering thus.

Dear Ken - yeah, you are right in asking whether it will be a CRDe or a DI. Well, it's like comparing apples and oranges. The two products are poles apart as regards what they are expected to deliver and the customer base they cater to. One is a workhorse, the other is a gazelle! The earlier people understand this, the better it will be for everybody. Obviously, for the speeds at which I love to drive my cars, the snapshot handling that I want and the sheer distance I cover in one day, it has to be an engine + chassis tuned CRDe.

Obviously my value addition lies in the cup of whatever broth I am brewing. The result was MH01V521, strategically demonstrated for all to see, which decimated everything in its path by having an unfair advantage. But then, life's unfair so I guess it's OK.

I had given enough hints of what made MH01V521 what it was, but if you think I will disclose the complete contents of the brew which made MH01V521 what it was, that too in an open forum, you've got to be kidding! .

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

[DirtyDan]

Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM

I had given enough hints of what made MH01V521 what it was, but if you think I will disclose the complete contents of the brew which made MH01V521 what it was, that too in an open forum, you've got to be kidding! .

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

I will assume that it wasn't an mSparrow that you dropped into it.