[akshay4587]

As an Owner of a 4X2 Scorpio SLE and a Mahindra Thar Crde.
I can say that the Scorpio is leagues ahead of the thar,be it engine refinement,outright performance;pulling power and fuel efficiency.
The only place where thar scores is the off roading ability and the oomph factor.

I have driven Thar and Scorpio over similar terrain;the thar has the added advantage of going to 4L in case of stop and go situations on steep inclines.

Scorpio's engine does struggle a bit in H ratio when in stop and go situations;but this is an issue with all modern common rail engines,but once in the torque band it pulls very well.

[desertfox]

By no means is Scorpio 4WD mHawk the perfect vehicle but in the 12 to 15 lakh bracket serves the purpose rather well.

It has a low angle of approach and plenty of useless plastic all around but you do go over all kind of terrain in a fair bit of comfort not luxury for sure.

[iceman7]

Your thread couldn't have come at a better time.

I just came back from a 10 day trip to Spiti Valley. We hired a local Tata Sumo from Manali and went on the trip. On the first day I was disappointed that we weren't given an Innova. But 2 days into the trip, and I was thanking my stars for being inside the Sumo. My respect towards the mighty Tata Sumo has increased 10 fold after this trip. It silently conquered the Spiti roads where everyone else failed.

[SnakemanJohny]

A Gypsy owner like 'codelust', I have often considered the Scorpio 4WD for an upgrade. Having been used to the "Willys" and the Jonga earlier in life, MG410W's & MG413W's total lack of comforts and frills did not bother me, but I always wanted something a little larger with more power. And the MG's tiny engines are very low on torque. And in spite of being a petrolhead and lover of mechanical-shift 4x4s, I was ready to compromise, for more power and grunt.

Though the Scorpio is comfortable (and luxurious by my standards) over smooth roads, I have found it to bounce and roll heavily on broken and rocky roads in hills and plains -- the Bolero seems more steady on similar surfaces. Never got to test its 4WD grunt though.

But 'ringoism's thread on Scorpio 4x4, plus another on the troublesome Slave Cylinder, made me decide against Scorpio ever ! I should stay satisfied with the 5-door metal Gypsies I have adapted for daily use with a wimpy AC and forward facing second-row seats, never mind that they lack even such basics as a trip-meter !

[SS-Traveller]

Strange that, after the initial posts, the OP has decided to go silent regarding the issues on the hospital-owned Scorpio he drove.

Was this another of those threads that aims to bash a car model based on limited experience of driving a perhaps-faulty car?

The only good news that came out of this thread seems to be BD's veiled promise of a secret vehicle from Tata Motors, that might be a dream replacement for us poor Scorpio owners who can't afford a Fortuner (or better) to replace our ageing Scorps.

Till that secret vehicle is revealed, I guess I'll stick to my current 4x4 with all its quirks, faults, unreliability et al.

[DirtyDan]

Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM

Dear Eric - lovely photographs, excellent information, completely true and every single thing that you have pointed out is known for a long time, so thanks!

Dear all - in view of very good alternate available now, I hope target customers will take their own correct decisions on the product to buy. .

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

Originally Posted by SS-Traveller

Strange that, after the initial posts, the OP has decided to go silent regarding the issues on the hospital-owned Scorpio he drove.

Was this another of those threads that aims to bash a car model based on limited experience of driving a perhaps-faulty car?

The only good news that came out of this thread seems to be BD's veiled promise of a secret vehicle from Tata Motors, that might be a dream replacement for us poor Scorpio owners who can't afford a Fortuner (or better) to replace our ageing Scorps.

Till that secret vehicle is revealed, I guess I'll stick to my current 4x4 with all its quirks, faults, unreliability et al.

It seems that B.D. disagrees with you, SS-Traveller. I don't think B.D. dumps on the Scorpio based on his experience of one car. He also speaks of a "very good alternative now available". This is stated in the present tense...it could mean the 4x4 Duster..or, who knows? But it does not address or hint at a future entry from Tata. I wish B.D. was in a position to tell us more. You should also know that "Ringoism" has extensive first hand experience in the auto industry. I wish you good luck with your Scorpio.

Anybody know anything about Renault's 4x4 Duster? Good, bad? All I know is that it is monocoque, 'ay?

[rrsteer]

Originally Posted by SS-Traveller

Was this another of those threads that aims to bash a car model based on limited experience of driving a perhaps-faulty car?

I am sorry, but it is harsh and unfair to label this thread as 'another of those threads that aims to bash a car model'. It is very easy to think like that but this thread is definitely not on 'bashing'.

I'd also like to bring out a small difference on how we evaluate a vehicle. Living continuously with a vehicle on a rough terrain is very different from evaluating a vehicle based on jaunts from the plains to Leh.

I had earlier taken my Safari to Leh and I felt supreme about its abilities. But one month of my stay in Dalhousie and I knew that Safari was not the vehicle to keep in the hills.

[Parm]

Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM;3486866
[B

Dear all[/b] - in view of very good alternate available now, I hope target customers will take their own correct decisions on the product to buy. .

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

A very good alternate vehicle available now, points to Storme only and no other vehicle, this is what I make out from BD.

It's better mechanicals over the Safari, makes it an alternate to Scorpio but TATA needs to put some steam into the marketing of the product.

I am sure "Singham Returns", where a lot of TATA vehicles are used, will give a boost the sales of these vehicles (Storme and Xenon). These vehicles are used extensively in the movie.

[SS-Traveller]

Originally Posted by DirtyDan

It seems that B.D. disagrees with you, SS-Traveller. I don't think B.D. dumps on the Scorpio based on his experience of one car.

Aren't forums about disagreements as much as agreements? I don't even remotely pretend to know as much about ANY car as he does! But I am entitled to my opinions based on my experiences, as much as I am entitled to express them on an open forum in polite language. And BD dumping on the Scorpio?

Originally Posted by DirtyDan

...stated in the present tense...it could mean the 4x4 Duster..or, who knows? But it does not address or hint at a future entry from Tata. I wish B.D. was in a position to tell us more.

BD does. But we don't deserve to be told at this point in time.

Originally Posted by DirtyDan

You should also know that "Ringoism" has extensive first hand experience in the auto industry.

Faux hoodscoop? 40-45 km/h in 4L? The original Turbo2.6 was never offered in a 4x4 variant? I also needed a response to...

Originally Posted by SS-Traveller

...vehicle needs some attention as far as its engine, ABS system, suspension and 4wd shift mechanism are concerned.

...which hasn't come after a week of waiting. Perhaps you could ask him offline, to respond here?

[DirtyDan]

We who live in the big steep hills are often disappointed by CMRV imposed gear ratios. Not only do they make going uphill a chore, they make going up hill flat dangerous when vehicles with 3.73 diffs threaten to stall out in 1st gear on steep roads. Also, in the last couple of years the CMVR has let a number of light small motor delivery vans into production. These cannot climb hills well and are a safety hazard as normal vehicles have to pass them on dangerous winding mountain roads. The CMVR is mindless to the point of making one speculate how some vehicles get their okay. And, of course, there are restrictions the manufacturer imposes on himself in order to make a vehicle more exportable.

The differentials, axles and some transmissions in today's 4x4 vehicles are old designs, going back to 1950s and 1960s America and Japan in many cases. Up until now there was no reason to upgrade. These old wonderfully engineered gems work well. To a point. The point being smaller engines with computer ECUs trying to meet some arbitrary fuel average figure. What is needed is some innovative thinking. It seems to me there are probably simple cost-effective solutions out there that give both low end grunt and flat-lander high speed cruisability.

I wonder if you guys are familiar with Redmm340s beasty jeeps? He has not posted for some years now. One of them had two TCs and gave him lots of low end grunt coupled with his 2.6 Scorpio motor. If one man can get things like this done, why not international companies?

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/4x4-te...red-beast.html

[tsk1979]

Originally Posted by DirtyDan

We who live in the big steep hills are often disappointed by CMRV imposed gear ratios.

I think that is a misconception
CMVR rules + 1950s parts bin is an issue.
However, there are crdi vehicles which can climb hills with ease.
For example, the safari is bad, but the storme is quite capable at climbing hills. They even tweaked the reverse gear ratio.

[DirtyDan]

Originally Posted by tsk1979

I think that is a misconception
CMVR rules + 1950s parts bin is an issue.
However, there are crdi vehicles which can climb hills with ease.
For example, the safari is bad, but the storme is quite capable at climbing hills. They even tweaked the reverse gear ratio.

Well, it is a reality, not a misconception, that the newer gear ratios, 3:73, don't cut the curry here in the big hills, Whether manufacturers mmight be using this as a lame excuse not to innovate, to cry 'fuel average', is another matter.

I will take a look at the Storme now that you and Parm have brought it up.

[Kandisa]

Originally Posted by Parm

A very good alternate vehicle available now, points to Storme only and no other vehicle, this is what I make out from BD.

Yes if you directly interpret, the 'now' phrase refers to Storme only. However i would not lose the hope of an even more baseline 4wd. I wonder what that 'certain brown 4x4' is, which was referred to by BD recently.

It's better mechanicals over the Safari, makes it an alternate to Scorpio but TATA needs to put some steam into the marketing of the product..

And more importantly have a re-look at the prices also. Even if Storme appears superior, most of the people will end up in buying the Scorpio LX 4wd just because it falls in that lucrative price band.

Originally Posted by tsk1979

..For example, the safari is bad, but the storme is quite capable at climbing hills. They even tweaked the reverse gear ratio.

Good to know that.

[amit_mechengg]

There is a plant modified Storme 4x4 being tested continuously for offroading. I guess there are some upgrades coming up which B.D is mentioning.

[Parm]

Originally Posted by Kandisa

I wonder what that 'certain brown 4x4' is, which was referred to by BD recently.
.

Kandisa, let me help you with that "Certain Brown 4x4" vehicle..( Hint: its without the Female model).