[ebonho]

Originally Posted by GTO

How was the general reliability of the Jongas? Were the mechanicals robust? Or was it high maintenance?

I remember as a kid in Jamshedpur, there was this Parsi family down the road from us, and the aunty used to drive an immaculately maintained ex-army Jonga (have no idea how they got it). It was a classic sight. A five foot nothing petite lady sitting in that monster and deftly driving it. I would so love to own one and drive it in Pune. Maybe a small nudge here and there while I'm at it ..... (kidding)

[Bump-Stop]

Originally Posted by peterjim13

Few questions to the experts here :
1. What are the differences between the Gypsy that is used by the Defense Forces and the ones available for civilian use.

Not much (as stated by GTO) but you do see heater attachments and dash side vents as standard on the gypsies ordered for the Army....you need to put in a request for these on a civilian gypsy.

[mustysekhon]

Originally Posted by peterjim13

Few questions to the experts here :

1. What are the differences between the Gypsy that is used by the Defense Forces and the ones available for civilian use.

Not much (as stated by GTO) but you do see heater attachments and dash side vents as standard on the gypsies ordered for the Army....you need to put in a request for these on a civilian gypsy.

Maruti does a consolidated batch run with a few vehicles in spare for the occasional civil administration, state governments etc and private orders. The specs are same as army. The aircraft dim lights in front, back and pintos hooks are add ons done by the army workshop.

[nkghai]

Originally Posted by GTO

Thar has already replaced the MM540 / MM550 which have been out of production since years .

How was the general reliability of the Jongas? Were the mechanicals robust? Or was it high maintenance?

A thread on the Jonga

Ok Since there is some interest here, let me first clarify that Jonga name is an acronym for a vehicle from Jabalpur Ordnance and Guncarriage Assembly .This Jonga is actually a Nissan. It was the Patrol 60 or P60 model introduced in 1960 and built by the Vehicle Factory Jabalpur (VFJ) under an exclusive license from Nissan.
It was designed half a century back, So there were no electronics in the vehicle. Pure Mechanical and a bit electrical which could also be summed up into lights, dynamo, coil spark plugs and rotary distributor.
Those were the time when tuning a carburettor was so much fun. I don't think we will ever see a mechanic now a days with hands on the carburettor screws and head tilted slightly to hear the sound of the exhaust to set the correct rpm which was an art.
The mechanicals were extremely robust and would continue till the part almost fell off. On a winding mountain hill ahead of Leh once my front wheel came off and went ahead of us and i could see my front left wheel only was going ahead of me. It took a second to realise that it was one of my wheels. The Jonga would go on and on till it would literally drop dead and was a true workhorse.
The electricals were where there was a bit of issue and the coil would always get overheated in summers, and that too could be taken care by a water dipped suttar cloth.
To sum up i would state that i have taken trips in no mans country with no roads where there would be no civilisation for hours together many a times in my jonga, sometimes driving for 16 hrs with me, another driver ,some jerrycans of fuel and running spares and it never let me down. A well maintained Jonga is a pleasure for any auto freak with its six cylinder engine sound like a human heartbeat which inspires confidence

[Parm]

"Major Saab, try our new Gypsy colour..."

"Neighbor's Envy Owner's Pride"!

[dhanushs]

Originally Posted by nkghai

... and maintained all four vehicles , the Willys Jeep, the Nissan Jonga , the Maruti Gypsy and the the Mahindra MM 540. A Jonga will beat all hands down.....

Hi,

Sorry for going OT, and not intending to start a debate, but, I've driven the Jonga, and all of the above. As you might know, there are multiple aspects/terrain in offroading. Which terrain would you be talking in which a Jonga can beat them all.

For eg: A gypsy is light in weight, hence in mucky slush it doesnt get bogged down. It floats and crosses. Whereas a 540 which is little heavier and has better chassis + suspension flex performs better when you go over rocks, and in slush where you have proper hard ground underneath. The willys with its SWB is much more flexible than both of the above, but topples easier..... see? The three vehicles I've mentioned above outperforms each in its own home ground.

Just power and torque doesnt make a vehicle a good offroader. Weight, FAW, RAW, turning radius, Wheel base, tyres, suspesion set up etc etc..

So, I was just wondering what makes the Jonga better than all of the Gypsy, 540, SWB jeep.

[Bump-Stop]

Originally Posted by nkghai

Ok Since there is some interest here, let me first clarify that Jonga name is an acronym for a vehicle from Jabalpur Ordnance and Guncarriage Assembly .This Jonga is actually a Nissan. It was the Patrol 60 or P60 model introduced in 1960 and built by the Vehicle Factory Jabalpur (VFJ) under an exclusive license from Nissan.
It was designed half a century back, So there were no electronics in the vehicle. Pure Mechanical and a bit electrical which could also be summed up into lights, dynamo, coil spark plugs and rotary distributor.
Those were the time when tuning a carburettor was so much fun. I don't think we will ever see a mechanic now a days with hands on the carburettor screws and head tilted slightly to hear the sound of the exhaust to set the correct rpm which was an art.
The mechanicals were extremely robust and would continue till the part almost fell off. On a winding mountain hill ahead of Leh once my front wheel came off and went ahead of us and i could see my front left wheel only was going ahead of me. It took a second to realise that it was one of my wheels. The Jonga would go on and on till it would literally drop dead and was a true workhorse.
The electricals were where there was a bit of issue and the coil would always get overheated in summers, and that too could be taken care by a water dipped suttar cloth.
To sum up i would state that i have taken trips in no mans country with no roads where there would be no civilisation for hours together many a times in my jonga, sometimes driving for 16 hrs with me, another driver ,some jerrycans of fuel and running spares and it never let me down. A well maintained Jonga is a pleasure for any auto freak with its six cylinder engine sound like a human heartbeat which inspires confidence

I may be incorrect but have heard (rumours maybe?)of repetitive rear axle breakdown problems on Jongas......I may be incorrect but can anyone shed any light if this is true?

[nkghai]

Originally Posted by dhanushs

Hi,
So, I was just wondering what makes the Jonga better than all of the Gypsy, 540, SWB jeep.

Very pertinent question dhanushs.
First case is in the desert going cross country, where maximum driving happens in army . A Jonga will beat a gypsy IMO while going over dunes. The Gypsy will be second and then MM 540 IMO.
Second terrain which i have extensively driven is in high mountains and going to border areas crossing the Khardungla and Changla and such passes and in semi road conditions. The gypsy does have an issue because of rarified atmosphere and here Jonga would glide through. MM540 also does good service here. Initially we had the 999 cc (Zen) Engine in the Gypsy and was a total failure . Then came the 1.3 Ltr in the Gypsy Kings (present one) , first carburated and then with MPFI. The last one is very competent but still i feel Jongas were better here.
Even over rocky mountains in that area, when i was testing the the TATRA 6 by 6 with independent wheel suspension , a beauty of a vehicle and i would take it to wild areas for testing purposes my Jonga would follow me everywhere. In fact we drove 10000kms in all terrains and Jonga followed like a loyal soldier tugging along.
Now i have never mentioned comfort and suspension. Jonga and Gypsy are in two different leagues. Jonga is primitive. Steering, breaking and suspension wise, gypsy is way ahead. Turning radius also Jonga would be much higher than all others and Gear shifting is much smoother in a Gypsy
BTW all these four vehicles are in 500 kg class in the army to perform the same duty and the Jonga i feel is the beast here.
Also these are my views gained over 28 yrs of maintaining and test driving these vehicles for the forces and i do respect your opinion which may be contrary.Maybe i am smitten by the Jonga, as they say first love , similar to my Yezdi, which was my first love in Motorcycles.

Originally Posted by Bump-Stop

I may be incorrect but have heard (rumours maybe?)of repetitive rear axle breakdown problems on Jongas......I may be incorrect but can anyone shed any light if this is true?

Yes they were there but never alarming. The differential Sun and pinions would wear out very fast, but they gave sufficient warnings and that is why i call Jonga a beast. In 1996 a Jonga rear axle broke down and i went to recover in middle of night since we were not permitted to move in day time. Believe me i put it in 4 X4 and with front wheel drive only and got it back 24 kms cross country before morning.

[Bump-Stop]

Originally Posted by nkghai

Yes they were there but never alarming. The differential Sun and pinions would wear out very fast, but they gave sufficient warnings and that is why i call Jonga a beast. In 1996 a Jonga rear axle broke down and i went to recover in middle of night since we were not permitted to move in day time. Believe me i put it in 4 X4 and with front wheel drive only and got it back 24 kms cross country before morning.

Thanks for the clarification . Yes indeed, they were (and still are) awesome vehicles ☺. They don't make them Like that anymore. By the way did you know the later generations Nissan Patrols, coil sprung GU &GQ models ( never made it to Indian shores) continued the lineage of very competent off road and expedition vehicles.

[Parm]

540/550 have been too heavy and sometimes are an embarrassment to the driver and its passengers. (photo 2)

I wonder what happened to the Army trials of the test vehicles from Indian OEMs? (Photo 1)

[peterjim13]

Originally Posted by Parm

I wonder what happened to the Army trials of the test vehicles from Indian OEMs? (Photo 1)

That was a part of Indian Army's hunt for Light Specialist Vehicles. I do not think they were just for Indian OEMs. There was even Land Rover in the hunt.

The article here talks about reviving the same hunt with TATA LSV and Mahindra Axe :
Article

TATA LSV : Team-bhp Article

I have not heard of anything new on the same. Looks like Army is now focussing on far important priorities. And LSV will be a different category altogether.

[nkghai]

Originally Posted by sudev

I have not driven Jonga on off road trails and hence cannot comment on its capabilities directly but can only say if Jonga was indeed a good off roader the off road community would have restored many of them by now. I have not seen that happening though did read about few restorations.

Hi there.
Attaching some recent photographs of 1 Ton modification by SD OffRoaders received from a friend on face book.
Guess there are still some people who love the off roading capability of Jonga/ 1 Ton

[lifeoffroad]

Originally Posted by nkghai

Hi there.
Attaching some recent photographs of 1 Ton modification by SD OffRoaders received from a friend on face book.
Guess there are still some people who love the off roading capability of Jonga/ 1 Ton

This is simply amazing. It is one of the best 1 Ton Mods I have seen. Period.

Simple yet functional design.

Thanks,

L.o.R