Mahindra Thar revealed at Autoexpo 2010

offroad_maniac · 17th February 2010, 19:40

Fighting over engines? What difference will it make now? In a simple way, Thar has a engine having nice spces w.r.t BHP & Torque. So that will be enough. Any how Mahindra has already decided not to use SFA in front. So this argument will lead to nowhere.. Lets just ask about what can we do with existing Thar.

If you have seen IFS Striker in person, you will see that it has more GC than Thar & even though it uses Sandgrips on IFS it has nice clearence with front fenders, that does not look possible with Thar though.

Just see below pic. So is M&M going to give us some options for increasing the lift?

SPIKE ARRESTOR · 17th February 2010, 19:49

@Milecruncher you have added another twist in the tale,the engine mentioned in the above link is some other animal which even i am not aware of (XDP3 with 2523cc)

. Incidentally MDI3200 is of a similar swept volume range, if you mean Storm was developed from MDI3200 then i can guarantee it is incorrect.
Spike

MileCruncher · 17th February 2010, 19:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPIKE ARRESTOR

@Milecruncher you have added another twist in the tale,the engine mentioned in the above link is some other animal which even i am not aware of (XDP3 with 2523cc)

. Incidentally MDI3200 is of a similar swept volume range, if you mean Storm was developed from MDI3200 then i can guarantee it is incorrect.
Spike

So in Lawyer lingo, I'm taking it as correct that the Storm engine was developed on the XD3P with 2498cc. Especially since you have not denied that. Correct me if I'm wrong.

SPIKE ARRESTOR · 17th February 2010, 20:10

@Milecruncher the pictures are there for you, its for you to decide, i have had my say, nothing more to that

Spike

Sutripta · 17th February 2010, 21:19

@ Spike. Does M&M have ANY engine officially derived from the XD's. I was under the impression that M&M license from Peugot covered manufacturing only, and to Peugot's exact design. No modifications allowed. No such problems with the B275. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Regards
Sutripta

star_aqua · 17th February 2010, 21:35

Spike, Are these so called NEF engines and technology are developed in house by M&M or is it sourced from a vendor(Engine manufacturer like FIAT, FORD etc)? I mean the basic engine block.

headers · 17th February 2010, 22:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by ex670c

Then again the THAR has Leaf Springs at the back, how-come this does not affect cruising ability?

Arka, I was meaning the front suspension dept

Now, you know very well the effects of an independent suspension versus a leaf spring suspension and when we talk road & track performance, obviously one has the advantage over the other. So lets leave it there!

Quote:

Originally Posted by vinod_nookala

I don't know what is what here...but at the end of this thread i will be a authority on engine technology

You have confused between engines. Bolero CRde engine is also M eagle and belongs to NE family

M&M has been denying Bolero CRde has anything to do with XD3p. 2498cc is the bone of contention

A lot of components are from the same parts bin, so the confusion.

Quote:

Originally Posted by star_aqua

Spike, Are these so called NEF engines and technology are developed in house by M&M or is it sourced from a vendor(Engine manufacturer like FIAT, FORD etc)? I mean the basic engine block.

I'm sure M&M have developed the engine with the help of an engine specialist with restrictions on what level one can tinker the parameters without affecting copyright violations.

AVL of Austria is one such Engine Tech Partner

I'm not sure whether M&M have used them though!

Sutripta · 17th February 2010, 22:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by headers

....
AVL of Austria is one such Engine Tech Partner

I'm not sure whether M&M have used them though!

Wasn't AVL involved in both the mHawk and the (Tata) 2.2 DICOR?

Sutripta

Cyrus43 · 17th February 2010, 23:16

Yes. They were. Both 2.2s have been designed by them.

MileCruncher · 17th February 2010, 23:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPIKE ARRESTOR

@Milecruncher the pictures are there for you, its for you to decide, i have had my say, nothing more to that

Spike

Saar, I'll rephrase my question: Is Bolero CRDe part of the NEF?

P.s: I'm not a lawyer but an engineer like you albeit much smaller

Cyrus43 · 17th February 2010, 23:47

The Bolero CRDe is a Part of NEF.

Sutripta · 18th February 2010, 00:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cyrus43

Yes. They were. Both 2.2s have been designed by them.

Would love to see the two blocks side by side!
But till such times, could we have the experts comments on the two. And some facts/ figures like dist. between bore centres, deck height etc. And also weights. (I believe one of the most important figures in the specs set out by M&M to AVL was weight, or rather its reduction.)

Regards
Sutripta

SPIKE ARRESTOR · 18th February 2010, 09:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by MileCruncher

Saar, I'll rephrase my question: Is Bolero CRDe part of the NEF?

P.s: I'm not a lawyer but an engineer like you albeit much smaller

Bolero CRDe is from NEF family, infact one of the photos posted by me is of a VLX engine (see the compressor on the RHS), also the 2.2L Mhawk engine is not fully developed by AVL as suggested earlier, AVL was a partner along with M&M during this development. For those who think M&M doesn't have the competency to develop engines wait for some time, good news is just round the corner (0.9L CRDe is just one of them).

Spike

P.S. Neither I am a big engineer, i am a dilettante when compared to you guys over here. Saar, don't call me saar, i am of your age saar.. Mods sorry for using this slang.

MileCruncher · 18th February 2010, 09:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPIKE ARRESTOR

Bolero CRDe is from NEF family, infact one of the photos posted by me is of a VLX engine (see the compressor on the RHS),

So apart from the electricals/electronics, is there any major difference between the Storm, M-Eagle and the Thar engine?

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPIKE ARRESTOR

also the 2.2L Mhawk engine is not fully developed by AVL as suggested earlier, AVL was a partner along with M&M during this development. For those who think M&M doesn't have the competency to develop engines wait for some time, good news is just round the corner (0.9L CRDe is just one of them).

Spike

No one over here has doubts over the engine development capacity of M&M

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPIKE ARRESTOR

P.S. Neither I am a big engineer, i am a dilettante when compared to you guys over here. Saar, don't call me saar, i am of your age saar.. Mods sorry for using this slang.

Ok, no more name ....oops saar calling over here Spike

SamtheLeo · 18th February 2010, 10:11

Still no answer to questions???

1. When
2. How much
3. What all

17th February 2010, 19:40	#781
offroad_maniac BHPian Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Thane-Mumbai Posts: 462 Thanked: 46 Times	Fighting over engines? What difference will it make now? In a simple way, Thar has a engine having nice spces w.r.t BHP & Torque. So that will be enough. Any how Mahindra has already decided not to use SFA in front. So this argument will lead to nowhere.. Lets just ask about what can we do with existing Thar. If you have seen IFS Striker in person, you will see that it has more GC than Thar & even though it uses Sandgrips on IFS it has nice clearence with front fenders, that does not look possible with Thar though. Just see below pic. So is M&M going to give us some options for increasing the lift? Attached Thumbnails Attached Images
	() Thanks

17th February 2010, 19:49	#782
SPIKE ARRESTOR Senior - BHPian Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Germany Posts: 2,764 Thanked: 1,043 Times	@Milecruncher you have added another twist in the tale,the engine mentioned in the above link is some other animal which even i am not aware of (XDP3 with 2523cc). Incidentally MDI3200 is of a similar swept volume range, if you mean Storm was developed from MDI3200 then i can guarantee it is incorrect. Spike Last edited by SPIKE ARRESTOR : 17th February 2010 at 19:55.
	() Thanks

17th February 2010, 20:10	#784
SPIKE ARRESTOR Senior - BHPian Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Germany Posts: 2,764 Thanked: 1,043 Times	@Milecruncher the pictures are there for you, its for you to decide, i have had my say, nothing more to that Spike
	() Thanks

17th February 2010, 21:19	#785
Sutripta Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Calcutta Posts: 4,633 Thanked: 5,993 Times	@ Spike. Does M&M have ANY engine officially derived from the XD's. I was under the impression that M&M license from Peugot covered manufacturing only, and to Peugot's exact design. No modifications allowed. No such problems with the B275. Correct me if I'm wrong. Regards Sutripta
	() Thanks

17th February 2010, 21:35	#786
star_aqua BHPian Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: BLR Posts: 608 Thanked: 90 Times View My Garage	Spike, Are these so called NEF engines and technology are developed in house by M&M or is it sourced from a vendor(Engine manufacturer like FIAT, FORD etc)? I mean the basic engine block.
	() Thanks

17th February 2010, 23:16	#789
Cyrus43 BANNED Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: London Posts: 5,010 Thanked: 169 Times View My Garage	Yes. They were. Both 2.2s have been designed by them.
	() Thanks

17th February 2010, 23:47	#791
Cyrus43 BANNED Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: London Posts: 5,010 Thanked: 169 Times View My Garage	The Bolero CRDe is a Part of NEF.
	() Thanks

18th February 2010, 10:11	#795
SamtheLeo BHPian Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Gurgaon Posts: 447 Thanked: 4 Times	Still no answer to questions??? 1. When 2. How much 3. What all
	() Thanks

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