[Parm]

Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM

Dear all - thank you very much for all your comments. I have just returned from Delhi. I have lost my voice speaking to or rather shouting at people to make myself heard amidst all the music at the stall. I met some of you, which was wonderful. I will post my complete reply to all your queries tomorrow. For now, it's dinner time and off to bed.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

Dear Sir, thank you very much for talking my call from dubai. it was a pleasure talking to you and get to know the humble man who is bringing lots of dreams come true.

sleep well and take all the rest, you deserve it.

[Parm]

Originally Posted by fazalaliadil

Parm,
They may make cosmetic clones of Thar, but how will they match up to the technology? The chassis is a hybrid of Scorpio/ Bolero cross which cannot be procured in the market, likewise the engine and transmission.

Originally Posted by bigman

Doubt the dabwali brigade will take much notice, they are trapped in a cycle of building rubbish. Plus most these guys do not get out much, showed one such guy who makes these bling jeeps a photo of the Legend and he told me it was a USA Wrangler.
The dabwali customer is different from a Thar customer. He wants something with a Jeep tub but a Nissan or Toyota engine, 2wd and very good average. Torque etc are not areas which are important to them but average is.

Originally Posted by Torque-ative

Dilution sucks !!

I know,...apart from true jeepers,..a jeep out here means, some one who's out there crusing the strip to get chics. aargh !!

Just today driving back from the OTR in our battle scarred jeeps I saw a 540 clone with Himalayan Rally stickerred in a Font which I know is not bonafide.

These (clones) could for sure hurt some of the segment buyers loooking for a jeep, especially newbies,..who probably hav'nt been initiated into jeeping like I've ( along with hoards of other jeeprs have) been fortunate enough to be.

guys when i said clones of Thar, i did mean 2WD, Bling Bling, show offs, poor knock offs copies of wrangler, classic and other M&M jeeps!

of course Dabwali/Mayapuri cant match the performance of the true 4WD JEEPS in terms of engine, transmission and other mechanicals.

what i meant is that wannabees or 'me too' catagory of people will be the clients of these jeeps.

the true blue 4WD mud slugger will have no need to visit these places anymore once we have the THAR on the road, oops...off the road!

[offroad_maniac]

Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM

Dear all - thank you very much for all your comments. I have just returned from Delhi. I have lost my voice speaking to or rather shouting at people to make myself heard amidst all the music at the stall. I met some of you, which was wonderful. I will post my complete reply to all your queries tomorrow. For now, it's dinner time and off to bed.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

Sweet Dreams to you sir.. as you have made our day dreams turn into reality by making THAR. Thats Happy New Year !

Now back to dreaming about off-roading THAR!
Good Night.

[Samurai]

Originally Posted by SamtheLeo

@ Samurai : I got confirmation Thar is also available in Hard Top off the shelf so no need for any 3rd party

What???? Gulp, I mean... Ok, we shall await Behram's update on this. [note to self: breath deeply, that's the key]

Originally Posted by fazalaliadil

MM 550 DP 4WD, Gross vehicle weight: 2030 kg.

Hmm, but kerb weight is what matters here, which is lot lesser.

[Parm]

Originally Posted by Samurai

What???? Gulp, I mean... Ok, we shall await Behram's update on this. [note to self: breath deeply, that's the key]

Hmm, but kerb weight is what matters here, which is lot lesser.

surprises await all of us from Mr. Behram when he writes and discloses more stuff about Thar!

goodnight for today

[nitrous]

Originally Posted by headers

Nitrous, weight does matter. I get my theory from 2 decades of driving!

You're telling this to a guy with a 890 kg car (without lightening )
Its called 'preaching to the choir', bro.

With decent stripping, I'm sure we can bring kerb weight to 1.5 tons.
Don't expect it to be as practical as stock though.
PS: Don't bring personal weight into this discussion.

[indian21r]

@fazalaliadil

I Know it won't come at those prices but just hoping it would

good to see that tomorrow we might see lots of insights from the mahindra team itself. Interactive building of a product like Thar will surely start a new segment in the car industry. I would love to see more of this in the future

[headers]

Originally Posted by nitrous

You're telling this to a guy with a 890 kg car (without lightening )
Its called 'preaching to the choir', bro.

With decent stripping, I'm sure we can bring kerb weight to 1.5 tons.

Now, what are to trying to imply?

1. Weight aids traction , or

2. Weight DOES NOT AID traction.

Your last statement indicates that you want to reduce weight and the previous post did otherwise.

BTW, how many offroads have you driven to understand this, my friend

[headers]

Originally Posted by nitrous

Its called 'preaching to the choir', bro.

With decent stripping, I'm sure we can bring kerb weight to 1.5 tons.
Don't expect it to be as practical as stock though.

Originally Posted by nitrous

+1.
Increased weight = Increased traction...right until a very high threshold point where grip starts tapering down.

DKG, where do you get your theory from?

A high threshold point - care to explain that, my friend.

[Parm]

please guys dont get personal in this thread, take it easy and lets stick to normal and easy discussions rather than arguments.

in some conditions weight helps in the tractions and in some situations, it doesnt.

different people might have different opinions according to their personal experiences and in situations they have been.

lets discuss how THAR will perform with its projected weight of 1.7 tons which can be put on diet if some people want it to shed its weight, again according to their own needs and requirments.

compared to THAR, which are the most common used 4WD in OTRs in terms of weight to power ratios?

PaRm.

[DirtyDan]

Hardtop?

Originally Posted by Samurai

What???? Gulp, I mean... Ok, we shall await Behram's update on this. [note to self: breath deeply, that's the key

Visibility for any passengers is a consideration for the addition of a hardtop. So is driver vision out the rear for backing up. My 2 rupees worth...

On this weight thing, let us not forget that too much weight may literally sink you. It depends a lot on what surface you are on, or in.

[Samurai]

Ken, the hardtop got to have glass on both side and rear. We are not asking for a coffin top here.

[offroad_maniac]

Originally Posted by Parm

surprises await all of us from Mr. Behram when he writes and discloses more stuff about Thar!

Waiting eagerly..


Would like to know the possibility of adding optional stuff like
LSD/ Lockers,
Gear Reduction T-Case,
Bolero FFRA,
Front Axle etc

& All the surprises....

(BTW, In Thar Site its mentioned as Borg-Warner Tcase, & in another link its mentioned as NGT530 Tcase?. ..I guess we will be getting BorgW here.)

[DKG]

Originally Posted by nitrous

DKG, where do you get your theory from?

You are right theoretically Nitrous. But in actual practice in terrains where you specifically require flotation all this weight becomes a dud as it will very efficiently cut deeply into the soft soil and ground your diffs.

Give me a choice of a light offroader with adequate gearing and power vs a heavy offroader I would still opt for the lighter vehicle.
Even on harder soil when driving on a slope sideways I am always more comfy and confident in a lighter vehicle.

BTW when I need weight I just ask pals to hang on. What do you do when you don't need the weight in a heavy offroader Nitrous? Dismantle some car?

Traction usually depends on three things, weight, footprint and friction.

Considering we would use our offroader in varying conditions, I can improve friction with tyre groove, increase footprint with broader tyres. But weight is a double edged sword. I would prefer it to be lighter so I have the necessary flotation when needed and can always add some weight in if needed or throw it out.

I am not convinced a heavier offroader is necessarily better in all situations offroad. Believe me I would prefer to replace some panels on my CJ3B with aluminium !

How I wish someone makes a CJ3B using aluminium alloys. Now that would be my dream offroader.

If ever I buy a Gurkha the first thing I would do is to lighten it. With those mechanicals and a lighter body it would be a delight.

[Samurai]

DKG, as you have rightly mentioned, weight can help or it can hinder depending on the situation. I think the question arose because your statement sounded like weight reduces traction, may be I mistook. Weight can make you sink deeper than the ability of available traction to pull you out, but won't decrease traction. So the tyres with nails (metaphor really) will supply the extra traction needed, I guess that is what you meant.

Originally Posted by offroad_maniac

(BTW, In Thar Site its mentioned as Borg-Warner Tcase, & in another link its mentioned as NGT530 Tcase?. ..I guess we will be getting BorgW here.)

I am not very technical, but isn't NGT530 a gearbox and not T-case?