Why 4x4 only in top end variants of SUVs

n.devdath · 8th October 2010, 19:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by amitk26

I have pictures of a bullet proof Safari 4X4 which came for service at concord. It was for use of some high ranking defense official.

There were no Army markings and the vehicle was perfect for blending in the normal traffic.

Which variant?

Pl post the pictures since I have a few doubts on the same. Even the CoAS and Air Chief Marshal's vehicles have defense protocol ids.
I m sure Parm would concur.

AWD · 8th October 2010, 19:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by HappyWheels

When did Safari NOT come with the 4x4 in the EX? EX is the mid variant.

And as RKB mentioned, the base variant was also available on order in 4x4. So the argument that "only top end" does not hold true for the Safari.

Regular Safari EX is about a lakh Rs more than the LX variant, add to this EX 4X4 & that's another lakh. So, the figure mounts to ~2L or more, which is the point I was making in my previous post. Aren't we talking about "Why no 4x4 in base variants"!

No idea about made ot order 4x4 in Lx, never seen one, not on Tata website too. So, I can't believe. Maybe previously it was being offered but again no confirmation.

Quote:

Originally Posted by IronWolf

Even the Essential features fail. Case in point - Scorpio 4WD: Electronic Transfer Case.

All I want is a 4x4 option in the base variant, now if top end variant comes with Electronic transfer case, I won't mind the same in my base model, if the company is ready to provide!

amitk26 · 8th October 2010, 19:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by n.devdath

Which variant?

Pl post the pictures since I have a few doubts on the same. Even the CoAS and Air Chief Marshal's vehicles have defense protocol ids.
I m sure Parm would concur.

Tan and black interiors so should be GX or VX, pearl white color. All the window glasses were bullet proof and non-openable. Glass thickness was more then 1 inch. And door was atleast 4 times heavy then normal safari door.

I have picture in my phone and I am unable to see any marking on that usually for Army vehicle of this year number should be 10 ^

HappyWheels · 8th October 2010, 20:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by AWD

... Aren't we talking about "Why no 4x4 in base variants"!...

For your benefit, the discussion is as the the title says "Why 4x4 only in top end variants of SUVs", not the other way around.

scorpio_fan · 8th October 2010, 23:29

Hmm, interesting topic under discussion. Me too dont understand why M&M and Tata cannot support 4X4 in lower variants. I see that tata is better here atleast the site says 4X4 is available from EX onwards. M&M only supports in vlx. If i want 4X4 and not need all those electronics there is no way. Even I feel there should be another variant between SLE and VLX which has few more features (like alloys, reverse camera etc without say cruise control, rain sensor etc) with say additional 40k or so.

Scorpio Fan

Mpower · 9th October 2010, 00:50

Its viewed as a luxury and not a necessity.

Same issue with A/T option on small cars. Its usually bundled with other stuff you dont need.

Parm · 9th October 2010, 01:05

Hey i heard some one was asking for a Tata Safari in white colour with UN on it, used by Indian Army?

yes its a 4x4 and with all the glittering chrome on it!

well here are four photos.(they are NOT photoshoped)

HappyWheels · 9th October 2010, 14:03

Looks like they are a couple of those white ones! And these are the new, as in, most recent variants, with the chrome and side indicators and all.

Thanks for the share, Parm.

the VTEC guy · 9th October 2010, 20:04

Today I visited a small Auto Expo organised by timesgroup in Pune. Visited the Tata motors stall (dealer stall) and checked a EX Safari. I asked for 4X4 in this trim dealer said NO. Only in top model. Then he shares a price list that does show 4X4 for all trims except the base LX. I tell the sales guy its the dealers who have stopped it and not the Company. He just smiles and deferes from commenting any further.
Isn't the customer need that should be driving the model profile rather than what a dealer prefers to sell.

tsk1979 · 11th January 2011, 14:23

A lot of members are reporting that Tata Safari 4x4, just like its Scorpio counterpart is now sold only in the VX variant. so my original query still stands.
Why no Safari or Scorpio 4x4 in lower variants, why only in top variants.
Remember a VX 4x4 in safari or a VLX 4x4 in Scorpio crosses 13L on the road in some regions!

Post by a recent buyer of GX 4x2
https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-...ml#post2205559 (My journey to a TATA Safari – Making my own road!)

shankar.balan · 11th January 2011, 14:46

I have had a discussion with some Senior people at M&M on this subject.
I have not received a solution yet from any of them.

I have however received email acknowledging my queries and indeed admitting that these were reasonable. But I think they are still functioning in an extremely production led and dealer driven environment. They are still "disconnected" from the end-consumer in that sense.

Hence I do not yet see any light at the end of the tunnel.

I shall therefore keep my 2WD Scorpio and use it happily until such time as it continues to give me good service OR until M&M offers me a 4WD Scorpio in the colour of my choice, in the trim level of my choice and which incorporates the essential safety features that I am keen to have; i.e; ABS, Airbags and EBD.

Till such time as this comes to pass, I guess that one has to remain patient.

In the meantime in case any other good manufacturer lands up with a reliable product conforming to what I want, then as a consumer, I shall have absolutely NO hesitation in moving away from brand Mahindra to something else.

If this happens it will break a long standing loyalty of 30 odd years.

I submit here that M&M as a company, needs to learn to appreciate the value of their loyal end-consumer base and do something concrete for them instead of focussing on the cosmetic fiddle-faddle and rubbishy bling zing that their design team seems to be deeply enamoured of.

alpha1 · 11th January 2011, 16:29

It is just a way of making more margins.

A person who really wants 4x4 will go for it, no matter whatever extra crap you throw at him = which makes the model top end.

The seller can thus make higher margin by selling you useless stuff which you would never want given a choice.

tsk1979 · 11th January 2011, 16:51

I checked with Customer Care, and its indeed true.
Tata Safari 4x4 and Scorpio 4x4 are now being offered only in the Top End.
So currently, as of today, there is no 4x4 SUV in India which meets BS-IV norms and costs less than 10L

AVR · 11th January 2011, 16:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by tsk1979

I checked with Customer Care, and its indeed true.
Tata Safari 4x4 and Scorpio 4x4 are now being offered only in the Top End.
So currently, as of today, there is no 4x4 SUV in India which meets BS-IV norms and costs less than 10L

That's bad news. Was shunting between a new Thar or a Safari 4x4 and keeping the other existing one with me (Already have a Safari and a 540). Surely not looking to spend on the VX 4x4.

Could it be driven by the rumored launch of a newer version "Merlin" in the next few months? They probably may offer 4x4 in the lower variants of that version?

tsk1979 · 11th January 2011, 17:01

Nope, from what I could infer, from now on if you want to buy a 4x4 Safari, be prepared to shell out big money for the VX version.

8th October 2010, 23:29	#50
scorpio_fan BHPian Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Bangalore Posts: 186 Thanked: 242 Times View My Garage	Hmm, interesting topic under discussion. Me too dont understand why M&M and Tata cannot support 4X4 in lower variants. I see that tata is better here atleast the site says 4X4 is available from EX onwards. M&M only supports in vlx. If i want 4X4 and not need all those electronics there is no way. Even I feel there should be another variant between SLE and VLX which has few more features (like alloys, reverse camera etc without say cruise control, rain sensor etc) with say additional 40k or so. Scorpio Fan
	() Thanks

9th October 2010, 00:50	#51
Mpower Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 10,409 Thanked: 1,730 Times View My Garage	Its viewed as a luxury and not a necessity. Same issue with A/T option on small cars. Its usually bundled with other stuff you dont need.
	() Thanks

9th October 2010, 01:05	#52
Parm Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: in a Toyota! Posts: 2,753 Thanked: 890 Times	Hey i heard some one was asking for a Tata Safari in white colour with UN on it, used by Indian Army? yes its a 4x4 and with all the glittering chrome on it! well here are four photos.(they are NOT photoshoped) Attached Thumbnails
	() Thanks

9th October 2010, 14:03	#53
HappyWheels Senior - BHPian Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Bangalore Posts: 4,106 Thanked: 537 Times	Looks like they are a couple of those white ones! And these are the new, as in, most recent variants, with the chrome and side indicators and all. Thanks for the share, Parm.
	() Thanks

9th October 2010, 20:04	#54
the VTEC guy BHPian Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Pune Posts: 564 Thanked: 140 Times View My Garage	Today I visited a small Auto Expo organised by timesgroup in Pune. Visited the Tata motors stall (dealer stall) and checked a EX Safari. I asked for 4X4 in this trim dealer said NO. Only in top model. Then he shares a price list that does show 4X4 for all trims except the base LX. I tell the sales guy its the dealers who have stopped it and not the Company. He just smiles and deferes from commenting any further. Isn't the customer need that should be driving the model profile rather than what a dealer prefers to sell.
	() Thanks

11th January 2011, 14:23	#55
tsk1979 Team-BHP Support Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 23,717 Thanked: 22,825 Times View My Garage	Re: Why 4x4 only in top end variants of SUVs A lot of members are reporting that Tata Safari 4x4, just like its Scorpio counterpart is now sold only in the VX variant. so my original query still stands. Why no Safari or Scorpio 4x4 in lower variants, why only in top variants. Remember a VX 4x4 in safari or a VLX 4x4 in Scorpio crosses 13L on the road in some regions! Post by a recent buyer of GX 4x2 https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-...ml#post2205559 (My journey to a TATA Safari – Making my own road!)
	() Thanks

11th January 2011, 14:46	#56
shankar.balan BANNED Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Bangalore Posts: 11,368 Thanked: 23,150 Times View My Garage Infractions: 0/2 (8)	Re: Why 4x4 only in top end variants of SUVs I have had a discussion with some Senior people at M&M on this subject. I have not received a solution yet from any of them. I have however received email acknowledging my queries and indeed admitting that these were reasonable. But I think they are still functioning in an extremely production led and dealer driven environment. They are still "disconnected" from the end-consumer in that sense. Hence I do not yet see any light at the end of the tunnel. I shall therefore keep my 2WD Scorpio and use it happily until such time as it continues to give me good service OR until M&M offers me a 4WD Scorpio in the colour of my choice, in the trim level of my choice and which incorporates the essential safety features that I am keen to have; i.e; ABS, Airbags and EBD. Till such time as this comes to pass, I guess that one has to remain patient. In the meantime in case any other good manufacturer lands up with a reliable product conforming to what I want, then as a consumer, I shall have absolutely NO hesitation in moving away from brand Mahindra to something else. If this happens it will break a long standing loyalty of 30 odd years. I submit here that M&M as a company, needs to learn to appreciate the value of their loyal end-consumer base and do something concrete for them instead of focussing on the cosmetic fiddle-faddle and rubbishy bling zing that their design team seems to be deeply enamoured of.
	() Thanks

11th January 2011, 16:29	#57
alpha1 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: LandOfNoWinters Posts: 2,093 Thanked: 2,604 Times	Re: Why 4x4 only in top end variants of SUVs It is just a way of making more margins. A person who really wants 4x4 will go for it, no matter whatever extra crap you throw at him = which makes the model top end. The seller can thus make higher margin by selling you useless stuff which you would never want given a choice.
	() Thanks

11th January 2011, 16:51	#58
tsk1979 Team-BHP Support Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 23,717 Thanked: 22,825 Times View My Garage	Re: Why 4x4 only in top end variants of SUVs I checked with Customer Care, and its indeed true. Tata Safari 4x4 and Scorpio 4x4 are now being offered only in the Top End. So currently, as of today, there is no 4x4 SUV in India which meets BS-IV norms and costs less than 10L
	() Thanks

11th January 2011, 17:01	#60
tsk1979 Team-BHP Support Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 23,717 Thanked: 22,825 Times View My Garage	Re: Why 4x4 only in top end variants of SUVs Nope, from what I could infer, from now on if you want to buy a 4x4 Safari, be prepared to shell out big money for the VX version.
	() Thanks