[catchkumar]

Hi All,

In my constant search for a CJ5 / Kaiser / AMC Jeep, i have bumped into this which i feel fits my budget & also my requirement for a CJ5.

Though the engine is swapped for a Bolero one am fine with it.
Here a call for help & the purpose of this thread -

1. Can somebody tell me if this is an original CJ5 / Kaiser from the pics, if not can somebody tell me how i can find out.
2. This is a 1975 model AMC Jeep however the fender is not extended & from the fender it seems to be a pre 1972.
3. I hate the color of the Jeep & have decided to change if i buy.
4. The price quoted is 3.5 L. Is it the right price else what is the best i can offer?

Looking forward to all the help the forum to help me decide & take the right path.
PS - The Jeep is currently in Hyderabad.
As per the owner the RC doesn't say CJ5 but it says American Motor Corporation Kaizer Jeep.

Here are the parrot green pics

[jeepster]

please check body & chassis carefully.

if engine is changed the GB will be changed as well.

is the chassis original?

in Hyderabad some people can convert a 540 in cj5 which looks very original.

mostly this vehicles are jugad , means the chassis , body & RC come from different vehicles.
they are mated & the numbers form RC are stamped on engine & chassis., making it in one jeep.

a original CJ5 in 3.5L seems doubtful to me.

[Jaggu]

Never go by the looks. Find someone reliable from Hyderabad to check in person first. Price seems to be just ok.

[Timson]

Hi Kumar,

The body looks like its an M38A1, namely the engine hood, battery box on the cowl and windshield frame. Radiator guard is from a CJ-5.

Check if has been converted from LHD to RHD.
Do not go buy the RC book info, a lot happens over a period of time.
Price seems to be reasonable for an original.

Chengappa.

[trammway]

For me its looks like a replica jeep. But need to confirm after getting more pictures on the dash board, engine bay, under body pictures.

[catchkumar]

Originally Posted by jeepster

please check body & chassis carefully.
if engine is changed the GB will be changed as well.
is the chassis original?
a original CJ5 in 3.5L seems doubtful to me.

Originally Posted by Jaggu

Never go by the looks. Find someone reliable from Hyderabad to check in person first. Price seems to be just ok.

Originally Posted by Timson

Hi Kumar,

The body looks like its an M38A1, namely the engine hood, battery box on the cowl and windshield frame. Radiator guard is from a CJ-5.
Check if has been converted from LHD to RHD.
Price seems to be reasonable for an original.
Chengappa.

Originally Posted by trammway

For me its looks like a replica jeep. But need to confirm after getting more pictures on the dash board, engine bay, under body pictures.

Hi Jeepster / Jaggu / Timson & Shiva.

Thank you all.
From what i gathered from the owner - he bought the jeep over 2 years ago & did all the work. He claims its an original short chasis & not a converted one i.e. from long to short.
The owner is not much aware of the technicalities & it currently is a 2WD the owner is not even aware if its the shaft which is missing or if the GB is a 2WD only. All he knew was that the engine came from a bolero guess the gearbox too.

The body looks original as Timson says :-)
Owner is not aware if its a LHD to RHD convert.
I will ask the owner for more pictures & post it here.

In the mean time can somebody help me how to identify if its this Jeep is an original - what should i be looking out for ?

Under body - What to check ?
Engine Bay - What are the things i need to verify against.

From the initial pictures i received i have one which partly shows the dashboard & here it is ---

Am planning to go to Hyderabad & have sent a PM to Fazal sir to help me in identifying the originality of the Jeep if there is any help / references i can get it will be very helpful.

Thanks a lot to all of you again :-)

Regards,
Kumar

[trammway]

Originally Posted by catchkumar

Hi Jeepster / Jaggu / Timson & Shiva.

Thank you all.
From what i gathered from the owner - he bought the jeep over 2 years ago & did all the work. He claims its an original short chasis & not a converted one i.e. from long to short.
The owner is not much aware of the technicalities & it currently is a 2WD the owner is not even aware if its the shaft which is missing or if the GB is a 2WD only. All he knew was that the engine came from a bolero guess the gearbox too.

The body looks original as Timson says :-)
Owner is not aware if its a LHD to RHD convert.
I will ask the owner for more pictures & post it here.

In the mean time can somebody help me how to identify if its this Jeep is an original - what should i be looking out for ?

Under body - What to check ?
Engine Bay - What are the things i need to verify against.

From the initial pictures i received i have one which partly shows the dashboard & here it is ---

Am planning to go to Hyderabad & have sent a PM to Fazal sir to help me in identifying the originality of the Jeep if there is any help / references i can get it will be very helpful.

Thanks a lot to all of you again :-)

Regards,
Kumar

The CJ5 was produced between 1954 and 1983 by Kaiser, American Motors and Chrysler, ultimately selling 603,303 units. Willys was sold to Kaiser in 1953. During its lifetime 11 versions of the Jeep CJ5 were sold.

Engine Changes: AMC V8 or I6 - The Hurricane F4 and GM V6 were discontinued in the years after AMC purchased Kaiser. When AMC acquired the Kaiser Jeep Corp in 1971 they made many changes to the Jeep line starting in 1972

The JEEP letters on the side body doesn't match to the original specs of 1975 CJ5. The JEEP letters after 1972 was stamped with upper and lower alphabets where in the previous versions had all capital as shown in your Jeep's body.

CJ5 were all LHD, the jeep in question is RHD and dash board looks very much replica.

The Kaiser viper motors were placed outside the windshield with a box to protect the wiper from rain/season. In the jeep shown in your post got the CJ3B style one.

The jeep may be original SWB, that doesn't mean it is a CJ5. Normally the Hyderabad tinkers take CJ3B chassis and deploy a replica CJ5 body to the chassis.

What I have learned from internet is that the CJ5 later models were equipped with Dana 20 transfer case. (the under body pictures may reveal this details if the 4wd gearbox is still made available in the jeep)

Post 1972 the CJ5 should have suspended pedals like what is seen on Mahindra Classic. In any case jeep shown on the picture is converted to right hand drive so even if these are available they could be taken from some Mahindra Stable.

Most of these information could be validated with picture reference from this url here: Identify a Jeep - 72-75 AMC CJ-5

All the very best, If it is not a original Jeep why take the risk ?

[fazalaliadil]

Originally Posted by catchkumar

Am planning to go to Hyderabad & have sent a PM to Fazal sir to help me in identifying the originality of the Jeep

Dear Kumar,
I remember your last Jeep bought in Bangalore was from Hyderabad. You have double reasons to be smart this time.

All the body panels can be done in a day, the fender extensions, bumpers, winch plate, divided windshield, front grille and foot boards are a shouting 'HYDERABAD FABRICATION'.

Now, as you can see the steering, seats, roll bars, snorkel, tubular pipe bumpers, all are not CJ5 standard fitments. Neither is the engine and the gearbox, and in all probability the front and rear diffs. too are from MM540.
Also the handbrake lever was not in between the seats on the original.

Just from these set of photographs I cannot tell you about the rest of the originality. Whatever originality is there, will be on the chassis like number or shortened etc., possibly built on 3B chassis. Books are manipulated or Jeeps built as per the old book.

Hope you are not disappointed.
Regards,

[svsantosh]

Originally Posted by fazalaliadil

I remember your last Jeep bought in Bangalore was from Hyderabad. You have double reasons to be smart this time.

Actually he is smarter than most of us...!! KACHING And once again KACHING...!!

All the body panels can be done in a day, the fender extensions, bumpers, winch plate, divided windshield, front grille and foot boards are a shouting 'HYDERABAD FABRICATION'.

Yes sir, I feel the same, lets see...

[catchkumar]

Thanks Shiva & Fazal sir,

As mentioned by shiva i could see the diff. in the fender extensions & the Jeep Logo which doesn't match a 1975 Kaiser as per the book.
Fazal sir i completly agree with you on all the work which has gone into the Jeep - The Roll Bars, Bumpers, winch plate, split windshield & the foot boards.
I observed that the tubular bumpers look as though they are welded on to the original one.
I never observed the hand brake sir you seriously have an eye for detail.
I have asked the owner for the chassis number hope it somehow adds up to some amount of originality but that too could have been punched from the book of a scrapped 75 Jeep.

Well.. now my heart wants the Jeep for the love of its body style & my head says no for it not being an original & am not sure how much of digging into this jeep might reveal the roots & would it take my decision from amber to green well the parrot green is calling but am left with a 100 thoughts now & my hunger for a CJ5 is growing by the day.

Fazal sir any help in giving me some direction to own an original CJ5 (i don't mind a diesel mill) will help me a TON.

Thanks to all again.
Am going to be back with the chassis number, more pictures of the engine bay & the under body request all to kindly help me make the right decision.

Last but not the least - I can get this Jeep for 2.8L so hoping for some kind of luck to strike & hoping again that the Jeep still has some originality to come.

Well what am i still praying here for ?
That its a pre 1972 original Cj5 Jeep with an RC book of 1975.
If this happens by some stroke of luck what next & how do i find that my hope & prayers are true.

[catchkumar]

While the confusion over the first Jeep continues i came across this jeep a bit earlier than the parrot green & this in henna green color.

Shiva & Santosh had given a NO NO to this 1 however after learning a bit on identifying an original (i.e. in terms of body style) i want to give this a second thought.

Note - Please don't go by the color combination. Of course this 1 too has the typical Hyderabad stamping - Foot Guards, Roll cage plastic like fender add-ons in silver color
Here are the details & pictures -
The only thing is the body style confers to a 1967 model CJ5 & again the owner claims its not a convert from long to short.

KAISER JEEP Model 1967,
Isuzu G1 Engine,
Power Brake,
Power Steering,
Micke Wheel tyres with 4 X 4. -- what is Micke wheel tyres ?
Price Quoted - 3.5 Lakhs

[madhkris]

@ Kumar: You can find some useful info on CJ-5 here: http://www.jeeptech.com/models/cj-5.htm

[svsantosh]

Originally Posted by madhkris

@ Kumar: You can find some useful info on CJ-5 here: http://www.jeeptech.com/models/cj-5.htm

Madhu - You can find more info here... catchkumar

I am not kidding, this kumar in his mad quest to get a CJ5 knows more than the above link. What he needs is a clean example to blow his cash.

[Kandisa]

Is the 1st green jeep done up by the famed Bharat garage folks by any chance? It resembles a lot to their creations which were highlighted by DKG long time back. And seems like few imported accessories have gone into the jeep including teh wrangler mirrors, corner guards etc. Why don't you get the jeep checked by some experienced offroader around you? If the mechanical conditions look good and reliable, i think it is a good buy in that kind of a price.

Originally Posted by catchkumar

...Isuzu G1 Engine,...

This is one of the best and common diesel Isuzu engines available here. Check what gearbox has been used.

...Micke Wheel tyres with 4 X 4. -- what is Micke wheel tyres ?..

Looks like the wheel/rims are from Mickey Thompson, again an imported stuff. Tyres are substandard though compared to a jeep.

[catchkumar]

Thanks Madhu - You wouldn't believe i have over 50 MB of data related to CJ5 now including some pictures & details of Tuxedo park packages & Renegade :-)

LOL Santosh :-) for sure am not going to blow away the cash hahaha.

I have 1 more CJ5 in the pipeline - am awaiting pictures now from the owner.
Found another 1 for 5 L & its a complete NO No coz of the Gandhi Notes.

By the way did you all know that there was a 1961-1965 – 62hp Perkins 192 cc diesel available for the CJ & also a Jeep with steering mounted gear shift like our old fiat cars.
The renegades even came with Limited slip differential.
I even found that there is a M38a1 in hyderabad up for sale in mint condition including the petrol engine gear box etc. etc. - Quoted 20 Lakhs

The hunt continues.. while i have asked the owner of parrot green to check if he can find the data plate & for more pictures to find if its an original pre 72.

The henna green - i haven't received any more info than what i have hence the wait but for sure there will be a lot more updates on this thread & hopefully a good ownership experience report :-)

In the mean time a call for help to all our Hyderabad Jeepers to help me find a good CJ5, it will mean a lot to me guys.

Thanks Kandisa for the info on G1 engines that surely helps.
Wish i could get these jeeps checked out from someone in Hyderabad curse me for lack of contacts & am in Bangalore finding it tough to take any vacation from office :-(

Thanks & Regards,
Kumar