[ebonho]

Originally Posted by eyesice

Hello guys,


I have been riding a hybrid - Montra Trance Pro for about 6 months now. The bike is running on stock 700 x 35c tires. Can I upgrade this to 700 x 25c ( or even 700 x 28c ) tires on the same frame?


1. Do I need to change the rims or can I keep the existing ones as is?
2. What tires and tube would you recommend?
3. Will I get a significant lower rolling resistance ( I can go faster ) from a 35c to say 28c? What are the disadvantages? More prone to punctures? Is there any recalibration of brakes required?


Newbie alert. Hence so many queries!e

I'm.pretty sure the current rims can take 32s. Which is plenty thin for a hybrid. Which the Trance Pro is.

There are sportier and quicker flat bar road bikes like the brilliant Cannondale Quick, that can takes 28s. I personally think 28 is too thin for the Trance Pro.

The thinking worldwide is to actually go fatter for better rolling and long distance comfort, not just punctures. Most Roubaix roadies now run 28s. Even for compensation 25s are replacing 23s.

38 and 42 are the more rugged hybrids. And not all35s fit the rim the same.it all depends on the tyre profile, tread, and sidewall. As well as the rim.

The Schwalbe Marathon is a good tyre.

Cheers, Doc

[graaja]

Originally Posted by eyesice

1. Do I need to change the rims or can I keep the existing ones as is?
2. What tires and tube would you recommend?
3. Will I get a significant lower rolling resistance ( I can go faster ) from a 35c to say 28c? What are the disadvantages? More prone to punctures? Is there any recalibration of brakes required?

Rolling resistance actually depends on not just the tire width, but also on the tire pressure. Check out this very informative FAQ from Schwalbe.

https://www.schwalbetires.com/tech_i...ing_resistance

As it is explained in this article, with narrower tires, you have to run them at a higher pressure to reduce tire flex. This will reduce rolling resistance, but will affect the comfort. Whereas you can get the same low rolling resistance at a lower pressure with wider tires which will give you comfort. So, you have to select the tire width based on your usage and roads you ride. If you are going to use this for commute, where comfort matters more than acceleration, then it is better to stay with wider tires - at least 28. Also, if you happen to ride on rougher roads where lower tire pressure will increase comfort, stick to wider tires.

Tire width does not directly affect how prone the tires are to puncture (other than increasing the probability of hitting sharp objects). That depends on the tire construction. Tires like Schwalbe Marathon Plus and Gator Skins are known to be puncture resistant. But they sacrifice a little on weight and rolling resistance. If you use the bike for commuting, I would suggest you go with these tires as they will give you a lot of peace of mind - especially, the Marathon Plus has a very good reputation of being bullet proof.

There is no recalibration of brakes required on tire size change. When you upsize, you will have to take care that the tire does not rub with the brake calipers, but in your case as you are downsizing, it is not an issue.

Whether the tires will fit the rims depends on the rim width. You will have to find out the rim width in your cycle. Check out the below tire vs. rim width chart.

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tire-sizing.html#width

[eyesice]

Originally Posted by ebonho

I'm.pretty sure the current rims can take 32s. Which is plenty thin for a hybrid. Which the Trance Pro is. I personally think 28 is too thin for the Trance Pro.

38 and 42 are the more rugged hybrids. And not all35s fit the rim the same.it all depends on the tyre profile, tread, and sidewall. As well as the rim.

The Schwalbe Marathon is a good tyre.

Thank you! Maybe I should just stick with the 35s for now. My main objective was to see how much I can squeeze out of my current bike to go faster with the same effort .

Originally Posted by graaja

Rolling resistance actually depends on not just the tire width, but also on the tire pressure.


https://www.schwalbetires.com/tech_i...ing_resistance

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tire-sizing.html#width

Thanks raaja sir. This information is gold. I have bookmarked it. I have about half a KM of rough patches near my home and good roads after that. From what I understand, tyre pressure is a major factor that determines rolling resistance. And I am not quite sure on whether I would be gaining much by downsizing to 32c. Maybe I should hold my "pressure" to get a roadie till my wife gives the green flag

[anandpadhye]

Originally Posted by im_srini

So, my other question is, can I run 28 mm at the front & 25 mm at the rear ? The question is more from a cycling-community-mores perspective than a technical-feasibility perspective ( I already know it's possible ).

3mm is not a big deal in my opinion.

Originally Posted by graaja

Check out the below FAQ from Schwalbe.

https://www.schwalbetires.com/tech_i...ation_pressure

Unless you have very low body weight, you need 100 to 110psi pressure on the tires even for 700x25C tires.

Incidentally, on one of the outings, my Metrix front tyre got punctured (3 punctures, so I think it was a pinch puncture case). I had a spare tube but with Schrader valve while Metrix rims (Syncros) take Presta valve! We just could not patch the punctures and now the spare tube in incompatible. Finally, decided to try his spare tube (he rides Triban 540 on 25mm tyres). It worked and we could proceed with the ride.


It took me a few days to source 38mm tube with presta valve (majority shops in Pune only stock schrader valve versions for any sizes >35mm. 38c with Presta is a little rare combination as it turns out). Finally, found one at Giant shop but have been too lazy to change, so It's been 200km now that I am riding Metrix 10 with 38mm front tyre running on 25mm inner tube No issues faced so far!

Originally Posted by ebonho

Ive treated myself to a CAAD 8 too now

What price did you get? And which shop?

Originally Posted by eyesice

Hello guys,


I have been riding a hybrid - Montra Trance Pro for about 6 months now. The bike is running on stock 700 x 35c tires. Can I upgrade this to 700 x 25c ( or even 700 x 28c ) tires on the same frame?


1. Do I need to change the rims or can I keep the existing ones as is?
2. What tires and tube would you recommend?

As I described my experience above, check if your current rims take Presta valve or Schrader and make sure you are able to source the right tube.

Originally Posted by eyesice

Thank you! Maybe I should just stick with the 35s for now. My main objective was to see how much I can squeeze out of my current bike to go faster with the same effort .

My B'Twin Ultra 700 runs on 25c tyres (Shimano RS11 wheels front and rear). The rear wheel has 20 spokes and front wheel has 16.
In contrast, my Scott Metrix 10 runs on 38c tyres (Syncros - Scott's own brand - wheels front and rear) and both front and rear wheels have 32 spokes. Also, Syncros are tubeless ready so supposedly stronger and heavier than RS11's. So I think a road bike like Ultra 700 is faster than a Hybrid like Metrix - not just because of the tyre width, but also because of lesser number of spokes and lighter wheels.

And I think the RS11 spokes are also aerodynamic in shape (I will take a closer look and post a pic) while the Syncros ones are standard.

Cheers!

[amitoj]

Originally Posted by ebonho

Half the tension on the longer brevets is phone and lights management!!!
Cheers, Doc

Hehe. I hear ya. I call it "range anxiety". A term I have borrowed from Tesla owners

I have a small top tube bag in which I keep an Anker portable battery (two actually, because of the brevet mantra, "Two is one, one is none") and my phone is mounted on a Quad Lock mount, which is the best phone mount I have ever used. Very sturdy and easy to move from one bike to another. Anyway, so with the phone on the handlebar, and a battery in the top tube bag charging it, my phone's battery stays at 100% for a 200km ride.

Originally Posted by ninjatalli

Btw it's been a long time since I did a brevet; but I found doing it on hybrids much better than on a roadbike.

A hybrid with bar ends provides as many different hand positions as a road bike. Also, a hybrid usually has more climbing gears than a road bike, which comes in very handy when you are trying to cross that little hill near the end.

Bike Update: I had bought Cannondale CAADX in December last year, and I used that bike for a few 200KM brevets and one 400KM brevet. However, I found that bike lacking a few features that I didn't know I will need at that time. Besides, when the rim cracked, I decided to return it for a full refund.

After a lot of research, finally got myself a Specialized Diverge Comp E5


I've ridden it for a few miles. Liking it so far. Some other bikes I had considered were the Breezer Doppler Team and Masi Speciale Randonneur. However, due to lack of availability, I could not even try them out. They were both touring bikes disguised as randonneuring bikes anyway.

[graaja]

Originally Posted by eyesice

... Maybe I should hold my "pressure" to get a roadie till my wife gives the green flag

Yes. That is a good idea From 35 to 32, you will not gain much to justify the cost. Keep riding the current bike and get a road bike when you can.

Originally Posted by amitoj

After a lot of research, finally got myself a Specialized Diverge Comp E5...

That is a well spec'ed bike and also looks awesome! Congratulations and wishing you thousands of miles on the new bike.

[Sudipto-S-Team]

Originally Posted by amitoj

Anyway, so with the phone on the handlebar, and a battery in the top tube bag charging it, my phone's battery stays at 100% for a 200km ride.

I am curious to know how you handle the heating up issue. Does the exposed to the sun phone not get hot? Is it an issue to worry about? I always keep my phone in the pocket for this reason. Would love your feedback.

[ebonho]

A 35 to 32 swap needn't cost anything extra if you are doing it at the time of scheduled tyre change anyways.

In fact, I'm looking for a reasonable priced puncture resistant tyre after a couple of recent monsoon puncture washouts. And will try 32s on my current rims to see if they seat properly. I can tell you that 35 (or 38 or 32) are just numbers.

I've seen bikes with 35s that look much fatter than what my 35s look like. And 38s look really fatter. So a 32 won't necessarily be a small change. Especially when it's due anyways.

Just my 2 paise.

Any good puncture resistant hybrid tyres that are not as expensive as the Schwalbe Marathon (normal green guard one) which cost 3600 for a pair?

P.S. Amitoj, never needed any Powerbank support on my 200. Plugged my phone in towards the end of my 300. And for the 400, I was carrying three. Two 10,000 Ah slimline ones for front light and phone (though a slimmer n lighter 5,000 Ah one would have sufficed for the phone easy). And one small 2,500 Ah one in my saddlebag for my rear light (never needed it).

Even my front light I plugged in only at 3 a.m. just as a precaution at a tea break Cox we were riding in a proton of 3 that grew to 6 eventually as we caught faster guys begining to fade, and on a deserted highway stretch I did not want to be at the back of the peloton and have the lights go out. With exhaustion you can neither shout note hear, and if you need to stop to plug the lights in, its going to be a long grind solo.till you catch the group or they realise you have fallen off.

Cheers, Doc

[amitoj]

Originally Posted by graaja

That is a well spec'ed bike and also looks awesome! Congratulations and wishing you thousands of miles on the new bike.

Thanks! It seemed to be the best value for money bike. Plus, one of the local bike shops had it in my size. I was actually able to test ride this bike for 10 miles before I decided to buy it. It's rare that a bike shop will stock a bike in my size (61cms)

Originally Posted by Sudipto-S-Team

I am curious to know how you handle the heating up issue. Does the exposed to the sun phone not get hot? Is it an issue to worry about? I always keep my phone in the pocket for this reason. Would love your feedback.

I am yet to face this issue while riding. My phone has shut down due to heat a few times when I have been sitting on the terrace, but never while riding. Maybe the wind helps keep the phone cool?

Originally Posted by ebonho

P.S. Amitoj, never needed any Powerbank support on my 200.

How do you use it for navigation? I keep my phone's screen on all the time while riding. Without the power bank, it wont last even 50K. Most of the brevets that start near Boston have tons of turns. The 400K that I did last month had more than 4 pages of cue sheets.

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by amitoj

How do you use it for navigation? I keep my phone's screen on all the time while riding. Without the power bank, it wont last even 50K. Most of the brevets that start near Boston have tons of turns. The 400K that I did last month had more than 4 pages of cue sheets.

Wow 61 cm means you must be as tall as my son. 6'3.5". I'm a 54 in Cannondale and a 56 in Specialized. Most others like Trek, Merida and Giant too. Though the Bianchis probably also run large like the Dale frames.

I don't use my phone for navigation neither do I have a fancy Garmin. I map out my route on Mapmyride which helps with the gradients etc. and then take a blown up printout with my annotations scribbled on it from CP to CP (distance, planned time, etc) and waypoint to waypoint, making sure I concentrate on all the important turns and junctions.

This printout along with the cue sheet is what I carry. The map gets laminated or put in a plastic filer and slipped into my jersey back pocket (along with my spare reading glasses - I'm 47). The cue sheet important data is already on the map, and it goes into my frame bag for reference if needed. Rarely if ever. Along with Brevet card, debit card, pen, money, air pressure gauge, zip ties, and Fast n Up tablets.

The jersey pockets have cube bite sized egg, potato, cheese sandwiches wrapped in foil. Shorts pockets have rajgiri laddoos on one side (sweet) and salted peanuts on the other. A packet of dates in.my jersey pockets also as an extra complex carb fix.

The phone n its power bank stay in the frame bag in a ziplock bag. With the Strava running in the background (dark screen). GPD is on for maximum accuracy. But all other apps do not work in the background. And phone is kept on silent. At stops, i manually stop my Strava if I take my phone out for a photo or to check my WhatsApp (the BRM team has a BRM group for instructions set up). Plus at unmanned CPs we either need to get a ATM receipt or send a photo against a pre defined landmark on to the BRM group, with our bike.

Navigation is purely by roadsigns and asking people. Along with the prior route instructions. The confusion is usually getting out of the city, which we guys usually do a recce of in the week leading up to the brevet. Getting out is the easy part because of the bunched start. Getting back in is the difficult one as we straggle in usually alone or in small groups.

Cheers, Doc

P.S. Lesson learned .... the cause of my washed out weekend 200 and training ride today morning ....

[graaja]

Originally Posted by ebonho

A 35 to 32 swap needn't cost anything extra if you are doing it at the time of scheduled tyre change anyways.

In fact, I'm looking for a reasonable priced puncture resistant tyre after a couple of recent monsoon puncture washouts.

Agree with you on the cost. There will not be any considerable cost difference between a 35 and a 32 when the present tires are worn out. My comment was under the assumption that the OP wanted to change the existing tires that have some life left in them.

Why don't you check out the Marathon Plus?

Recently, I changed the tires on my road bike from Continental Gransport Race to Schwalbe Marathon Plus. Had a couple of punctures in the Gransport tires which was making it very unpredictable in long training sessions. The Marathon Plus tires are 2x the weight of the Gransports, but as I am not very much interested in outright acceleration, and just need peace of mind, went for them.

Many of my cycling buddies have Marathon Plus and swear by their puncture resistance. Had to spend 6K for a pair after some discounts. But I think this is worth the peace of mind.

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by graaja

Agree with you on the cost. There will not be any considerable cost difference between a 35 and a 32 when the present tires are worn out. My comment was under the assumption that the OP wanted to change the existing tires that have some life left in them.

Why don't you check out the Marathon Plus?

Recently, I changed the tires on my road bike from Continental Gransport Race to Schwalbe Marathon Plus. Had a couple of punctures in the Gransport tires which was making it very unpredictable in long training sessions. The Marathon Plus tires are 2x the weight of the Gransports, but as I am not very much interested in outright acceleration, and just need peace of mind, went for them.

Many of my cycling buddies have Marathon Plus and swear by their puncture resistance. Had to spend 6K for a pair after some discounts. But I think this is worth the peace of mind.

Bro I picked up my ACT on OLX for 5k. And have built it up piece by piece. A barely used but neglected bike (left out in the rain, broken spokes, cracked sidewalls, rusted nuts, bolts, spoke nipples, brake noodles, drive train, but structurally sound and nearly brand new). An IT guys whim toy purchase ....

This is how I first saw her at his Hinjavadi flat ...



A nice project bike. That I worked and learned on by mysel mainly. And cleaned and lubed and fettled and replaced piece by piece. Till she was brand new and shiny. And customized as I went along and put the miles on her.

But yeah, some sort of 3 mm puncture protection or Kevlar (K-guaed) would definitely add peace of mind.

Saw some Vittoria Rubinos on BOTS for 1100. The Schwalbe Marathon is 1800. There seems a lot more choice for 700-23 or 25c road tyres than for the 35c hybrid tyres. Lots of decent branded stuff in the 500-1000 buck range. Like the Schwalbe Luganos.

Cheers, Doc

[ninjatalli]

Originally Posted by ebonho

Bro I picked up my ACT on OLX for 5k.

Awesome - exactly the kind of deal I keep looking out for on OLX Years ago, I got my Cannondale Quick 5 in such a deal only. A year old bike, hardly used and kept in a box, with visible rusting for a steal deal of around 12k-15k (if I remember correctly)

A few upgrades and proper upkeeping, the bike flawlessly worked for me wonderfully for the next 2+ years till it was stolen.

Saw some Vittoria Rubinos on BOTS for 1100. The Schwalbe Marathon is 1800. There seems a lot more choice for 700-23 or 25c road tyres than for the 35c hybrid tyres. Lots of decent branded stuff in the 500-1000 buck range. Like the Schwalbe Luganos.

Cheers, Doc

No no no - everyone runs to Marathon & M+ - these are very heavy tires. Schwalbe also has lighter tires but with similar anti-puncture material like the Durano & D+. Been running on them for nearly 2 years without much issues.

Luganos last I remember was a crappy one; Rubinos has mixed (but generally positive) opinions.

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by ninjatalli

Awesome - exactly the kind of deal I keep looking out for on OLX Years ago, I got my Cannondale Quick 5 in such a deal only. A year old bike, hardly used and kept in a box, with visible rusting for a steal deal of around 12k-15k (if I remember correctly)

A few upgrades and proper upkeeping, the bike flawlessly worked for me wonderfully for the next 2+ years till it was stolen.



No no no - everyone runs to Marathon & M+ - these are very heavy tires. Schwalbe also has lighter tires but with similar anti-puncture material like the Durano & D+. Been running on them for nearly 2 years without much issues.

Luganos last I remember was a crappy one; Rubinos has mixed (but generally positive) opinions.

Thanks buddy. A man after my own thrifty heart!

Please let me know if you see a good deal on 32 or 35c tyres. I can have them shipped or picked up from.Mumbai.

Or suggestions please. I'll check in shops here. Kendas in general have a very poor rep. A friend with a Mistral who racks up serious miles swears by his Michelin's.

Cheers, Doc

[graaja]

Originally Posted by ninjatalli

No no no - everyone runs to Marathon & M+ - these are very heavy tires. Schwalbe also has lighter tires but with similar anti-puncture material like the Durano & D+. Been running on them for nearly 2 years without much issues.

I had duranos on the Scott speedster. Had only one puncture in about 5000 km of usage. And that puncture happened during a 200 Brevet.

Then I had Continental GP 4000 II, which were fast tires, but again they failed me in a criterium with a puncture and had to abort.

Then I had Continental Gransport in my Scott Solace and had to abort a triathlon training session due to a puncture.

Maybe I am just unlucky that I attract punctures during events. That is why I decided to compromise on the weight and speed which can give me peace of mind in events.

But I agree that tire selection is purely a subjective matter and depends on many factors like degree of preference for speed, reliability, cost etc.

Originally Posted by ebonho

Bro I picked up my ACT on OLX for 5k. And have built it up piece by piece. A barely used but neglected bike (left out in the rain, broken spokes, cracked sidewalls, rusted nuts, bolts, spoke nipples, brake noodles, drive train, but structurally sound and nearly brand new). An IT guys whim toy purchase ....

That is awesome! Building something from scratch gives that satisfaction that cannot be matched by something bought