Pioneer 7950 + JBL Speakers = Poor Performance, Need Suggestion

kk28 · 27th August 2007, 09:22

Guys,

I have Pioneer 7950 Coupled with the JBL 210W rear speakers and JBL component speakers. i am not really convenced with the sound output

.

Earlier on my old car i had a sony 350S attached to a 210W cobra and xplod rear speakers. The performance was awesome

.

Compared to that pioneer gives a sluggish performance. I feel that that bass effect is not all that great. More over there is bit of jarring on high volumes.

Kindly give your valuable suggestion on improving the performance.

P.S: Pioneer is fiitted to Swift VDi.
Sony Was in Esteem.

Sam Kapasi · 27th August 2007, 11:57

Why I'm smiling is that you're automatically assuming it's the Pioneer's fault.

First things first. What is it that you think you are lacking?

I suspect it's the bass. In fact I suspect strongly that your speakers are out of phase. Check the positive and negative leads of all speakers. You may find your answer there.

DerAlte · 27th August 2007, 12:03

Hmmm... that's odd, to say the least - Cobra & xPlod with a Sony HU in Esteem better than a Pio 7950 with JBLs in a Swift! Normally this is a lemons versus apples comparison. Which JBL speaker models are you using? Your system must be really badly tuned.

@kk28, since you have not mentioned an amp, you must be driving the JBLs from the HU directly.

The jarring is quite likely due to the driving limitation of 7950: at the volume level you are playing, the HU is clipping. Since the JBLs can be driven really loud, perhaps an amplifier will solve the problem.

Difficult to understand what you mean by "sluggish". The bass response (7950 is not THAT bad, nor are the JBLs, in reproducing bass) is dependent on the settings on the 7950, so there can be some scope of improvement there.

What are the settings set in the HU right now?

Ajaybiz · 27th August 2007, 12:08

May be complete details of your setup will give some clues to our Audio gurus, i suspect that u r driving these spekers directly from HU.

finneyp · 27th August 2007, 12:10

First time I am hearing this!

Have heard Pio and JBL combination a lot of times and it sounded Awesome!

Dude, something is wrong with your installation, get it re-installed!

gigatech2006 · 27th August 2007, 15:13

I have Pioneer 2950MP and 'm facing the same situation now. I installed it in one of the shops in GP road, Chennai, and I was quite impressed by its performance. After about 2 months, the left front speaker stopped working, and complained abt the same during the regular service. The service guy removed the head unit, checked the system wiring and found that some wires have been disconnected (may be due to vibrations!?!?). He said that to prevent this thing from happening, they need to be soldered, and the same was done. Now all speakers are working, but I could clearly realize that the BASS is missing. Would this be a wiring (polarity) problem as Sam has already mentioned?? Just wondering as to how the technician could make an obvious error as the wires are bright red skinned for the positive.

Please let me know if this is a HU problem or polarity problem. I don't want to meddle with my car wiring very often :-(

Thanks in advance!

giga

panky12345 · 27th August 2007, 15:37

exactly as SAM mentioned, polarity mismatch, secondly adding an amplifier would be highly recommended. I have Pio + JBL combo (937 + 607); they scream!

barathan · 27th August 2007, 21:07

Hi All,

I am frequest visitor to this thread about ICE, you guys really rock. I have installed new Pioneer 6950 ICE and JBL GTO 937 for rear and JBL CS2104 Coaxial in front for my new Santro. My first impression on this output is really good. I think i need some more time to comment on its performance.

barathan · 27th August 2007, 21:09

Every component i bought is without B & W. every thing came to around 12.5K including Installation.

filcord · 27th August 2007, 21:34

I have the Pio 4950, with JBL CS60.4 driving JBL 637s front and 937s rear in the Baleno.
Awesome sound, even my son and wife complain the music is always on too loud.

Wimwian · 27th August 2007, 21:43

I had the same problem initially with the Pio 6950+JBL 60.4+ 607c+ 637 combo - in fact, the system sounded so horrible the first day I thought I had made a big mistake by going for JBLs and even considered changing the compos (they were extremely bright, bass was completely missing and sound was very tinny).

After some good advice from the gurus, I got the polarities checked and learnt how to tune the amp. The improvement in sound left me speechless... believe me, u have mindblowing equipment. Just needs some tuning.

Sam Kapasi · 27th August 2007, 21:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by gigatech2006

I Now all speakers are working, but I could clearly realize that the BASS is missing. Would this be a wiring (polarity) problem as Sam has already mentioned?? Just wondering as to how the technician could make an obvious error as the wires are bright red skinned for the positive.

It is obviously a case of polarity. Remember he needs to make that mistake only with ONE speaker for the bass to disappear.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wimwian

After some good advice from the gurus, I got the polarities checked and learnt how to tune the amp. The improvement in sound left me speechless... believe me, u have mindblowing equipment. Just needs some tuning.

100% correct. The best equipment in the world, when installed badly can sound like crap.

Quote:

Originally Posted by panky12345

exactly as SAM mentioned, polarity mismatch, secondly adding an amplifier would be highly recommended. I have Pio + JBL combo (937 + 607); they scream!

Panky, even though that doesn't sound like a compliment, lol, I know you mean that they have rocking sound.

The Yeti® says: Gimme more power baby and make it quick. Life's too short for anything else. Inject Nine inch nails into my head. Let me dance to David Guetta and think to Coldplay. Let me rock to Black Sabbath and Tool and cry to Radiohead.
Hurry up and make it hurt. I've only got another 40+change years to live if I don't die in an accident.

And if it's an accident, it had better be a big one. National news type accident. I don't want to die because I slipped in the bathroom.

Cheers! Hic!

jkdas · 27th August 2007, 22:10

first thing that came to my mind

Shoot the installer!

7950 is a good HU and most people play with its functions. Some prefer and use fader so that the rear does most of the work. If the polarity thing doesn't work, reset your HU and play the same CD (we are assuming that you have problem with different cds).

shrivz · 27th August 2007, 22:16

Hi kk,
here are my 2 cents:

Every car has different acoustics. The esteem has a big boot, while the swift doesn't. The boot of the esteem acts as a large enclosure for your speakers and gives better bass.
In short, to sum it up. You will get a different effect with the same equipment in different cars.

How are the JBL speakers installed in your swift?

Are they in a box? (If yes, how big is the box?)
Are they in the stock locations? (If yes, you cant expect much bass)
Or
Are they on a plank? (A thin plank will rattle at high volume levels.)

Do check the polarity on the speakers, as the others have mentioned. It is a very common thing for installers to ignore this very vital parameter. Wrong polarity will lead to Bass cancellation.

I assume you dont have an amp. If you do, try playing around with the gains (at sane volume levels, you dont want to end up blowing your speakers) and electronic crossover. (If equipped)

cheers!

shrivz · 27th August 2007, 22:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam Kapasi

The Yeti® says: Gimme more power baby and make it quick. Life's too short for anything else. Inject Nine inch nails into my head. Let me dance to David Guetta and think to Coldplay. Let me rock to Black Sabbath and Tool and cry to Radiohead.
Hurry up and make it hurt. I've only got another 40+change years to live if I don't die in an accident.

And if it's an accident, it had better be a big one. National news type accident. I don't want to die because I slipped in the bathroom.

Cheers! Hic!

Hail Yeti® .

27th August 2007, 09:22	#1
kk28 BHPian Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Mangalore Posts: 94 Thanked: 24 Times	Pioneer 7950 + JBL Speakers = Poor Performance, Need Suggestion Guys, I have Pioneer 7950 Coupled with the JBL 210W rear speakers and JBL component speakers. i am not really convenced with the sound output . Earlier on my old car i had a sony 350S attached to a 210W cobra and xplod rear speakers. The performance was awesome . Compared to that pioneer gives a sluggish performance. I feel that that bass effect is not all that great. More over there is bit of jarring on high volumes. Kindly give your valuable suggestion on improving the performance. P.S: Pioneer is fiitted to Swift VDi. Sony Was in Esteem.
	() Thanks

27th August 2007, 11:57	#2
Sam Kapasi Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Mumbai (but wat Posts: 6,997 Thanked: 2,378 Times View My Garage	Why I'm smiling is that you're automatically assuming it's the Pioneer's fault. First things first. What is it that you think you are lacking? I suspect it's the bass. In fact I suspect strongly that your speakers are out of phase. Check the positive and negative leads of all speakers. You may find your answer there.
	() Thanks

27th August 2007, 12:03	#3
DerAlte Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Bangalore Posts: 8,069 Thanked: 2,919 Times	Hmmm... that's odd, to say the least - Cobra & xPlod with a Sony HU in Esteem better than a Pio 7950 with JBLs in a Swift! Normally this is a lemons versus apples comparison. Which JBL speaker models are you using? Your system must be really badly tuned. @kk28, since you have not mentioned an amp, you must be driving the JBLs from the HU directly. The jarring is quite likely due to the driving limitation of 7950: at the volume level you are playing, the HU is clipping. Since the JBLs can be driven really loud, perhaps an amplifier will solve the problem. Difficult to understand what you mean by "sluggish". The bass response (7950 is not THAT bad, nor are the JBLs, in reproducing bass) is dependent on the settings on the 7950, so there can be some scope of improvement there. What are the settings set in the HU right now?
	() Thanks

27th August 2007, 12:08	#4
Ajaybiz BANNED Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 1,440 Thanked: 320 Times View My Garage	May be complete details of your setup will give some clues to our Audio gurus, i suspect that u r driving these spekers directly from HU.
	() Thanks

27th August 2007, 12:10	#5
finneyp Senior - BHPian Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 2,716 Thanked: 319 Times View My Garage	First time I am hearing this! Have heard Pio and JBL combination a lot of times and it sounded Awesome! Dude, something is wrong with your installation, get it re-installed!
	() Thanks

27th August 2007, 15:13	#6
gigatech2006 BHPian Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: B'lore/Chennai Posts: 163 Thanked: 149 Times View My Garage	I have Pioneer 2950MP and 'm facing the same situation now. I installed it in one of the shops in GP road, Chennai, and I was quite impressed by its performance. After about 2 months, the left front speaker stopped working, and complained abt the same during the regular service. The service guy removed the head unit, checked the system wiring and found that some wires have been disconnected (may be due to vibrations!?!?). He said that to prevent this thing from happening, they need to be soldered, and the same was done. Now all speakers are working, but I could clearly realize that the BASS is missing. Would this be a wiring (polarity) problem as Sam has already mentioned?? Just wondering as to how the technician could make an obvious error as the wires are bright red skinned for the positive. Please let me know if this is a HU problem or polarity problem. I don't want to meddle with my car wiring very often :-( Thanks in advance! giga
	() Thanks

27th August 2007, 15:37	#7
panky12345 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: New Delhi Posts: 2,697 Thanked: 171 Times	exactly as SAM mentioned, polarity mismatch, secondly adding an amplifier would be highly recommended. I have Pio + JBL combo (937 + 607); they scream!
	() Thanks

27th August 2007, 21:07	#8
barathan Newbie Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Seattle Posts: 20 Thanked: 0 Times	Hi All, I am frequest visitor to this thread about ICE, you guys really rock. I have installed new Pioneer 6950 ICE and JBL GTO 937 for rear and JBL CS2104 Coaxial in front for my new Santro. My first impression on this output is really good. I think i need some more time to comment on its performance.
	() Thanks

27th August 2007, 21:09	#9
barathan Newbie Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Seattle Posts: 20 Thanked: 0 Times	Every component i bought is without B & W. every thing came to around 12.5K including Installation.
	() Thanks

27th August 2007, 21:34	#10
filcord BHPian Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: goa Posts: 996 Thanked: 67 Times	I have the Pio 4950, with JBL CS60.4 driving JBL 637s front and 937s rear in the Baleno. Awesome sound, even my son and wife complain the music is always on too loud.
	() Thanks

27th August 2007, 21:43	#11
Wimwian BHPian Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Mumbai Posts: 191 Thanked: 5 Times View My Garage	I had the same problem initially with the Pio 6950+JBL 60.4+ 607c+ 637 combo - in fact, the system sounded so horrible the first day I thought I had made a big mistake by going for JBLs and even considered changing the compos (they were extremely bright, bass was completely missing and sound was very tinny). After some good advice from the gurus, I got the polarities checked and learnt how to tune the amp. The improvement in sound left me speechless... believe me, u have mindblowing equipment. Just needs some tuning.
	() Thanks

27th August 2007, 22:10	#13
jkdas Senior - BHPian Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Thiruvananthapu Posts: 9,687 Thanked: 1,492 Times View My Garage	first thing that came to my mind Shoot the installer! 7950 is a good HU and most people play with its functions. Some prefer and use fader so that the rear does most of the work. If the polarity thing doesn't work, reset your HU and play the same CD (we are assuming that you have problem with different cds).
	() Thanks

27th August 2007, 22:16	#14
shrivz BHPian Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Pune, MH12 Posts: 604 Thanked: 96 Times View My Garage	Hi kk, here are my 2 cents: Every car has different acoustics. The esteem has a big boot, while the swift doesn't. The boot of the esteem acts as a large enclosure for your speakers and gives better bass. In short, to sum it up. You will get a different effect with the same equipment in different cars. How are the JBL speakers installed in your swift? Are they in a box? (If yes, how big is the box?) Are they in the stock locations? (If yes, you cant expect much bass) Or Are they on a plank? (A thin plank will rattle at high volume levels.) Do check the polarity on the speakers, as the others have mentioned. It is a very common thing for installers to ignore this very vital parameter. Wrong polarity will lead to Bass cancellation. I assume you dont have an amp. If you do, try playing around with the gains (at sane volume levels, you dont want to end up blowing your speakers) and electronic crossover. (If equipped) cheers!
	() Thanks