[navin]

johy,

first I am jealous. You live in a beautiful part of India. My wife and I have often toyed with the idea of travelling there (isn't it near Darjeeling)? Too bad you dont get good ICE there.

Sony too make a 2ch. amp that is ok for sub use. It is called the 552 and retails for 3K. JBL subs offer more definition than Pio subs but try and listen to the Pio 306C in a 1.25 cu. ft. sealed box. It is good VFM and you can get it for 3K (add 1K for the box). I have not heard the 245 (is it the F or the C) and see if you can get a SVC version you dont need a DVC sub.

For what it's worth the Pio products (6100/6200/D510) priced by Hydra are without Bill and Warranty. JBL and Blau are with Bill and Warranty.

[johy]

Thanks a lot, Navin. Yes, Siliguri is near Darjeeling. Darjeeling is not as pretty as it used to be, but still there are lot of pretty spots all around. You should come by, especially to Sikkim - it is really beautiful.

I am making a note of the Pio 306C and I am sure I can get the 552 amp in town - this would suit my budget as well (I tend to eye Sony with a healthy dose of suspicion) . Believe it or not, but I think folks here only have heard of the ported box..I asked in a few places and they said:

1) In hatches, we fix the sub in the MDF tray (difficult to attain good sound this way, right?).
2) We have boxes with those holes for the hawa to come out; don't know of any other variety.

Cheers!

[navin]

if you are getting a ported box made please make sure your box has a prot and not a hole. a port is a tube tuned to a particular frequency. Pio supplies box and part details with their subwoofers.

if you want to install a woofer in an MDF tray you shold get teh Free Air version. These installs are boomier than sealed box or ported boxes and maybe even tubes.

[nura]

Originally Posted by navin

Lets say you have a 25K budget for amp, sub, damping and RCA wires. damping the front doors (4K) and 2 pair of RCA (2K) wire will run you 6K so you have 19k left.

13K would get you a nice amp and 6K would get you a 10" sub that you can install IB or you can get a tube.

Now the wiring....
connect the sub and the 4" and tweeter to the amp and run the rears of the HU.

a) the 4" are probably less sensitive than the 6x9 and could use an amp to bring their level up. also you can HPF the amp at say 100hz and save your 4" from the bass.

b) this will allow you some chance of moving your soundstage to the front. if you connect the 6x9 to the amp and the 4" to the HU your 6x9 will drown out the 4" completely.

Connecting all speakers to 2 chs. of the amp will rob you of a fader and also stree your amp. Actually you tweeter will not stress the amp to much as it is only in cicuit above 5K or so. It is the 6x9 and 4" which will be in parallel that will stress the amp (the amp will see 2 ohms across most of the audible range). connecting the tweeter in series to a 4" is something I would not advise (the reasons are too varied to detail for now).

hope this helps. the gurus will chip is later.

I have been reading through the posts on TBHP and have come to the conclusion that almost all the ICE installed in my Santro is badly chosen.
I learnt that the HU should have 3 preouts. Mine has only 2.
The car should have 2 or 3 way component speakers in front. I have a pair of 4” coaxials at knee-level in the dash and a pair of tweeters on top of the dash.
I have a pair of 6” x 9” oval coaxials at the back. These ovals do produce some decent music, including a fair amount of bass but they become audible only when I turn up the HU’s volume control a fair bit. By this time the front speakers get so loud and harsh that I have to fade them out.
I was thinking of adding a sub and an amp and Navin you were very kind to give me some wonderful suggestions.
What I fear, though, is that if I amp the front speakers and the sub and let the rear ovals be driven by the HU, the ovals are going to be almost inaudible. And the ovals are the best speakers I have.
So do you think it might be a better idea to forget about buying a sub and just get a 4-channel amp to drive the fronts and rears?
In which case, should I choose the JBL cs60.4 or the recently launched Blaupunkt GTA 4 Special amp?
My daughter graduates from law school next year and I plan to give her the Santro then and buy a new car for myself. She can bang the old vehicle about for a year (hasn’t learned to drive yet) and then get herself a new set of wheels and of course a TBHP membership before that.
With your help, I hope to have better ICE for my new car. In fact I will request you to help me choose a better car for my ICE.

[navin]

Originally Posted by nura

I learnt that the HU should have 3 preouts. Mine has only 2.
The car should have 2 or 3 way component speakers in front.
I have a pair of 6” x 9” oval coaxials at the back.
So do you think it might be a better idea to forget about buying a sub and just get a 4-channel amp to drive the fronts and rears?
In which case, should I choose the JBL cs60.4 or the recently launched Blaupunkt GTA 4 Special amp?

An Hu with 3 preout is not a perquisite. It is only needed when wants to control the front, rear and subwoofer levels from the HU. 2 is also fine.

Now do the following.
Get a 4 ch. power amp and a sub. (budgets will deicde the model numbers)
For the front channels set the HPF to ON and set the freq to about 100-120Hz.
For the sub bridge 2 channels and set the LPF to ON. Set the freq to about 60-80Hz.
Let the HU drive the rear 6x9s they are very efficient esp if located on a MDF rear deck they need little power.

You can get either amp. It depends on your taste and budget. I have seen one install that had 2 JBL 75.4 and a 301.1 powering components, a pair of 6x9 on the MDF deck and a 12" bass tube in a Getz and then there is our favourite ICEer - LBM!

[low_bass_makker]

Originally Posted by navin

then there is our favourite ICEer - LBM!

Hmmm....Ya sir..but nowdays I am half ICEer which I used to be as I am waiting for the subs to arrive so that I can complete my install.....

[nura]

Originally Posted by navin

An Hu with 3 preout is not a perquisite. It is only needed when wants to control the front, rear and subwoofer levels from the HU. 2 is also fine.

Now do the following.
Get a 4 ch. power amp and a sub. (budgets will deicde the model numbers)
For the front channels set the HPF to ON and set the freq to about 100-120Hz.
For the sub bridge 2 channels and set the LPF to ON. Set the freq to about 60-80Hz.
Let the HU drive the rear 6x9s they are very efficient esp if located on a MDF rear deck they need little power.

You can get either amp. It depends on your taste and budget. I have seen one install that had 2 JBL 75.4 and a 301.1 powering components, a pair of 6x9 on the MDF deck and a 12" bass tube in a Getz and then there is our favourite ICEer - LBM!

Thanks a ton, Navin. I will follow your suggestions and get back. I guess If I'm putting in a sub, the JBL 75.4 should be a decent enough amp? My installer is all praise for the Helix Deep Blue 10S 10" sub in a factory fitted sealed box. Has anyone at TBHP heard it?

[arunjp]

Hi all ,
Please help me to select a HU for the following configuration:
fronts: 6.5" comps(JBL CS2165c)
rears: 6.5" co-axials(JBL CS2165)
speaker amp:JBL GTO 75.4
sub woofer: JBL GT4-12 12" subdriver
sub amp:JBL CS 300.1
My BUDGET for HU:10 K(expandable upto 11K including bill and warranty)
Vehicle:Scorpio CRDE 8-SEATER
Brand preference:Pioneer or Panasonic with bill and warranty
Requirements:there should be 3 pre-outs and MP-3compatibility
Please tell the brand name and price

[Sam Kapasi]

I suggest a Pioneer 6850 or 6950. Best for your use.

Panasonic 7730 is also pretty good.

But in the case of the pioneer, you will have singing cats and foot tapping dogs playing with dolphins on your screen too. And money left over to buy your lady love a large bunch of roses and some chocolates and a decent outfit too!

You will then have sex and music. Now to get you drugs..

[deepakv]

Hi once again guys..i got super confused at Milan subway today when i went to pick up speakers :(
Im confused between the JBL GTO937 (2.8k, grey), Sony Xplod XS-GT6938X (3k, 2yr wtty), and the Pioneer TS-A6991S (3k, grey). As mentioned, im gonna use my friends Pio 6850 HU, and though i can give a listen to the 3 speakers there, im afraid with the traffic and the different environment i will not be able to judge properly. I was told the JBLs are "china-wala", whatever that means. I was asked to go in for some Kicker model for about 4.5k but i doubt that will be noticeably better.
Plan to get the setup done next (good) friday.
Feedback/tips/suggestions?

[JPL]

Looking forward to Sam's reply on this..lol.

Originally Posted by deepakv

Hi once again guys..i got super confused at Milan subway today when i went to pick up speakers :(
I was told the JBLs are "china-wala", whatever that means.
Feedback/tips/suggestions?

[WoodenKnight]

One tip/advice: never compromise for a few hundred bucks. You will remember that you have and whenever you listen, you will think, "only if i hadn't".

I strongly recommend staying away from anything you cannot get a bill and warranty (B&W) for. This means the chinese (read fake) JBL speakers too.

Sony is fine if you're not really into quality of music for they produce a fair sound for non-discerning ears. I'm using original JBL GTO937 at the moment and so far I'm satisfied for the price I paid for them -- they're not what I would call awesome but they're great and I recommend them in this budget range.

I have neither heard Pioneer speakers nor come across opinion about them that I trust so I will stay quiet about them. Ditto about Kicker but I've been trying to find out more about them (considering their ES4.2 components for the front of my car) and the general consensus that I seem to be coming across about their products is that they're nice.

Also, the environment might be different in your friend's setup, but it will be equally different for all and you're looking for speakers that sound good, not those that play a certain song or sound a certain way... so whichever sound better are the ones for you.

Summary? Don't buy grey and listen to the speakers to select the best ones.

[Sam Kapasi]

Oh, my reply?
No, I don't have anything bad or funny to say.

Deepak, everything today is made in China. Apple ka iPod bhi china-wala hai. Sony, Microsoft, HP, Nikon... the list is endless. China offeres fantastic manufacturing facilities with controlled labour costs. Furniture, clothes, electronics, crockery stationery, china has won the manufacturing war.
And if it's not china, then it's thailand,malaysia, korea or taiwan. And there you have the entire world of consumer electronics. What can you do about it?

There was a time companies would get apologetic about this, but not anymore. I think we are all past that, "Made-in kidhar ka hai?"
You just cannot buy a Pioneer/Sony made in Japan or a JBL made in the USA anymore. (Not unless you buy super high end limited edition stuff). JBL, for example has over 13 facilities, only one in California and yet, most of the wooden speakers are made in Mexico. And most car speakers come from china. Some tubes come from Turkey. And so on.

A lot of JBL SKU's are made in China, there is a huge JBL factory there. So, what is there to disagree?

As far as the dealer telling you that JBL is china wala and kicker is better, I am sure if you use your head a bit you'll know very well, what he is doing here.

Use your ears amigo.

[determinus]

Originally Posted by nura

With your help, I hope to have better ICE for my new car. In fact I will request you to help me choose a better car for my ICE.

Nice! Navin at times mentions here that one of the (main) reasons why he chose Skoda was for the build quality of the doors and panels -- for his ICE setup!!

[navin]

Originally Posted by nura

Helix Deep Blue 10S 10" sub in a factory fitted sealed box. Has anyone at TBHP heard it?

I have heard Helix (maybe not this particular model) a few years back in Esssen Germany. I did not know they were here.