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Old 19th November 2021, 17:35   #14251
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Default Re: Car Audio Advice from the Audio Gurus: Use "Search thread" before posting a new Q!

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Originally Posted by rohitsharma359 View Post
1. Should I go for monoblock or 4 channels amplifier.
2. Should I go for coaxial speakers for rear or should I consider components in the back as well
3. What are some good amps under the budget of 10k. Which brands should I go for.
4. What are some good speakers in 5-7k range for rear doors.
5. I travel a lot and always utilise the whole boot space. Should I consider adding a small woofer under the seat somewhere?
Am no guru at all. Just a music enthusiast.

1. 4 Channels. 2 bridged to supply to the subwoofer, and two for the front/prime pair of speakers. It frees up capacity on your HU to supply the other pair, thereby improving those too.

2. Depends on budget. Well placed components are usually better.

4. Consider how well the rear speakers match your front ones. At times a mismatch can amply deteriorate.

IMO, being able to audition your final shortlist in your car is a significant benefit, and worth paying a bit extra for.

A subwoofer and an amp would help the sound feel a lot fuller and complete. Setting up the system well with proper crossover settings and phase is important. Consider a 12" driver if budget and space allow. If your HU allows time alignment do set it up properly. Makes a significant difference in how coherent the different drivers/speakers sound as a unit.

Last edited by Poitive : 19th November 2021 at 17:43. Reason: Refinement, added pt. 4
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Old 18th December 2021, 11:51   #14252
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Originally Posted by Poitive View Post
Am no guru at all. Just a music enthusiast.

1. 4 Channels. 2 bridged to supply to the subwoofer, and two for the front/prime pair of speakers. It frees up capacity on your HU to supply the other pair, thereby improving those too.

I imagine this would be possible with an aftermarket HU with 3 pairs of RCA outputs/ speaker outputs where 1 pair of RCA is used for the front channel input, 1 pair of RCA for the bridged sub input, and speaker level output for the rear speakers.

How does one go about this in an OEM stereo (line out converter for 2 pairs of speaker output) or aftermarket stereo with only 2 pairs of RCA output/ speaker output?
Where does the the additional capacity to power the rear speakers come from if one pair of HU output is used for the front and one pair of used for the sub.

Last edited by rayjaycleoful : 18th December 2021 at 11:52.
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Old 18th December 2021, 15:52   #14253
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Where does the the additional capacity to power the rear speakers come from if one pair of HU output is used for the front and one pair of used for the sub.
I'm no expert and ones on the forum might be able to give better specific details, but it is roughly as follows:

Rear pair gets directly powered by the HU. With lesser load on the internal HU amp, it runs at a lower capacity, hence lower distortion in the signal it outputs.

For a system without sub-out:
Signal for front speakers (line out or via a converter from speaker out) connects to a 4 channel Amp input. This goes to both pairs of the Amp. One pair feeds front speakers, the other a/the sub(s).

For a system with sub out:
Signal for front speakers (line out or via a converter from speaker out) connects to one pair of inputs in a 4 channel Amp. The other pair of inputs is fed the sub-out from the HU.

In both cases, settings on the amp will allow you to set which frequencies are sent to which pair out of the amp. Lower for Sub, and higher for front. Proper settings on this and the HU (including how the cutoffs, roll off, and time alignment, if your unit has the settings) go a long way in producing good sound. A simple phase not being aligned properly will nullify a lot of good that can be achieved here.

Do make sure that line level is fed to the amp and not the speaker level output directly.

The overall idea is to load the amplifier section lesser to ensure a better SNR (signal to noise ratio) leading to cleaner signal and hence better sound.

Last edited by Poitive : 18th December 2021 at 16:10. Reason: Typos, refinement
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Old 24th December 2021, 13:36   #14254
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Hi,

I have a very basic query. I have JBL components in front and co-axials in back and a very basic HU with USB and AUX as notable features. The sound output is way too basic and maybe worse than a portable bluetooth speakers. I am planning to upgrade speakers only if they are damaged while retaining the HU.

My query is: Will the output be better if I add amplifier with the existing speakers (considering they aren't damaged)? Or changing just speakers to better ones will help?

My car is early 2012 swift VXI which didnt come with any OEM speakers/HU. I am not planning to keep the car for long and hence not intending to invest much now. (Maybe max 10k).

Goal is to achieve sound quality atleast as good as some decent portable bluetooth speaker.

TIA
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Old 24th December 2021, 14:00   #14255
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Just another question:

Was installing a Sony under seat sub (which has an inbuilt amp). The technician said it is better to connect the sub to the rear out of the HU instead of the front out. Is there a difference to which pair the sub is connected?

He said, usually sub's are connected to rear out and not front. I insisted him to connect to front and he obliged and I get a decent bass (gets distorted at high volumes though, but I guess that is the draw back of under seat sub), but now I wonder if it would be any better if it was connected to the rear out. Any insights?
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Old 27th December 2021, 12:10   #14256
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Following are my current choices for the door speakers
  1. Components: JBL Stadium GTO600c (100W, 45Hz - 25kHz, 93dB, 2.5Ω) - ₹ 19,192.00
  2. Coxials: JBL Stadium GTO620 (75W, 45Hz - 23kHz, 95dB, 2.5Ω) - ₹ 14,392.00
Which of the following amplifier is good for the above?
  • Pioneer GM-D8704 (100W x 4 (4Ω), 150Wx 4 (2Ω), >95dB) - ₹ 17,151.20
  • Sony XM-GS4 4 Channel (70 W x 4 (4Ω),80W x 4 (2Ω), 93 dBA) - ₹ 15,500.00

Currently, I have a 350w 12" JBL sub, it's a 12-year-old sub and I don't know the model.
Which of the following amplifier is good for the sub?
  • Pioneer GM-D8701 (300W x 1 (4Ω), 500W x 1 (2Ω), >100dB) - ₹ 17,151.20
  • Sony XM-GS100 Mono Block (330 W x 1 (4Ω), 600W x 1 (2Ω), 65 dBA) - ₹ 15,500.00
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Old 6th January 2022, 21:45   #14257
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I need some help in making a choice. I was playing around with the audio setup of my SX4 and had a Blaupunkt active sub(GT8200) in my Celerio which was no longer of use since it was not in my hands any more. Hence I tried moving that sub into the SX4 to see how it fares in a sedan compared to performing decently in the hatchback. As expected, the insulation between boot and cabin has greatly damped the output of the sub and either the levels have to be raised to a high level that causes little distortion and rattle from the parcel tray due to the sub being 8 inch and by the time it reaches the drivers seat, I can only feel the low bass notes and none of the thump if the sub is kept in comfortable levels.

Hence, the ICE bug has bit me but I am really not sure I will keep this car for more than a few months from now. Hence, while I already have plans to replace the front speakers with components and an amp, I need to do something about the sub.

My options are:
  • Buy an under-seat sub - Again I see 8 inch units available and these are expensive and not sure how well the output would be
  • Buy a JBL CS 1200BSI passive subwoofer and a Mono amp and still keep it in the boot - Costs lesser than the underseat but not sure if this would be a better idea
Given both would come at similar costs not specific to a product, which would be a better approach? I am not sparing too much budget for this since this setup would not even be usable in a future car since I do not want to meddle with ICE in the prospective cars I am looking forward for. Hence I do not want to blow too much money into it.

Any advise appreciated. Thanks in advance.
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Old 6th January 2022, 22:06   #14258
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Default Re: Car Audio Advice from the Audio Gurus: Use "Search thread" before posting a new Q!

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Originally Posted by audioholic View Post
My options are:
Under-seat sub will be a space saver. If you want a passive sub: check my post here:
https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/car-e...ml#post5159256 (Car Audio Advice from the Audio Gurus: Use "Search thread" before posting a new Q!)

If the current sub is muted, then will there be a sufficient difference by getting a larger passive sub in the boot ?
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Old 6th January 2022, 22:30   #14259
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Originally Posted by condor View Post
Under-seat sub will be a space saver. If you want a passive sub: check my post here:
If the current sub is muted, then will there be a sufficient difference by getting a larger passive sub in the boot ?
Space isnt a concern in any way. The expectation from a larger sub is that it wont distort like this one when the levels are turned higher to make the sound reach the cabin well. Along with that I need to work on damping some of the plastic panels around the rear seat and boot. The current sub has to work really hard to be heard well in the cabin whereas its sounding awesome within the boot But there are lot of threads/outside write ups that involve adding a huge sub in the boot as the most common approach. However I dont see the same popularity with underseat.

Hence the decision between an underseat sub and a bigger sub at the boot got confusing for me since I havent experienced an underseat till date. With the bigger sub I at least have the confidence that it can produce enough sound comfortably to be heard inside the cabin and outside the car too if required.
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Old 9th January 2022, 20:43   #14260
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Update: Sorted out the setup in my SX4. Had ripped off half the cabin and no pictures of the WIP since I did it alone. Details of the changes:
  • JBL Stage 2604 Components in the front
  • JBL Coax speakers at the rear
  • Infinity Primus 6004 four channel amp - Brought this since it was a class D amp and was available for a good discount on amazon. Use it to power only the front components
  • Blaupunkt 8200 active sub woofer in the rear
  • RCA cables were sourced from Amazon Basics for the sub and Bluerigger, and are of very good quality but on the other hand are very thick and these four cables together are thicker than the floor wiring harness of the car itself.
  • Amp and sub power wiring was done by myself getting all the components separately and forming a custom harness all the way from the battery of the car to the cabin, one for the amp underseat and another power cable all the way till the boot for the sub. Each had its grounding separately in the nearest stub that could be found
  • Damping was done by Bitumen sheet for non weight sensitive places like bits of the floor and boot + STP Damping sheets for weight sensitive places like the doors
I am not sure how to describe the setup but it sounds exactly the way I wanted it and replaces JBL coax at the front. These speakers along with the stock tweeters had totally swallowed the mids and hardly any bass was available. Now I have a very balanced sound at all levels and no distortion or vibrations from anywhere.

As explained previously, there was some issue with the sub and I assumed this was the sub getting overwhelmed in order to fill up the cabin with Bass. Turns out, the distortion/resonance was caused by the parcel tray and third brake light on the tray. These would vibrate badly and feel as if the sub was distorted. I got driven around for a while and stripped out the third brake light and things got better drastically. Once I damped the parcel tray and the brake light itself, the annoying vibrations were gone and what was left was deep bass although not so loud. Then I cranked up the gain on the sub and though the bass filled the cabin well, there was no side effect.

So I dropped plans of changing the sub to a bigger one or an underseat sub since this is pretty satisfying for the time being. Overall, almost a weeks effort in rigging up the whole setup spending a few hours every day.
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Old 13th January 2022, 11:08   #14261
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Poitive View Post
For a system without sub-out:
Signal for front speakers (line out or via a converter from speaker out) connects to a 4 channel Amp input. This goes to both pairs of the Amp. One pair feeds front speakers, the other a/the sub(s).

So are you saying in this case that HUs the front speaker channel (2 channel) is spliced into 4 channel to feed the amp input?

Since the HUs other 2 channels are used to drive rear speakers.
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Old 13th January 2022, 11:31   #14262
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Originally Posted by rayjaycleoful View Post
So are you saying in this case that HUs the front speaker channel (2 channel) is spliced into 4 channel to feed the amp input?

Since the HUs other 2 channels are used to drive rear speakers.
For my Celerio which did not come with pre-outs, when the sub-woofer was installed, we had to take line level outputs from the rear speakers which was fed to the sub to provide signal to it. This wont affect the performance of the rear speakers since the amplifier for the sub wont sap power from the rear outputs but just use it as a signal. Even if you have pre-outs only for front and rear, you could still split the rear pre-out and feed it to another amp for the sub itself. Wont do any harm. And these days, there is no need of line level converters since most of the amps available in the market take both line and low level inputs so that avoids another component in the signal chain.

Last edited by audioholic : 13th January 2022 at 11:33.
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Old 22nd January 2022, 15:51   #14263
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Hello navin, a4anurag, Bass&Trouble and other TBHP audiophile experts,

Need advise on finalizing to upgrade speakers on my Jeep Compass Sport variant that comes with 4 speakers.
I want to upgrade the stock speakers with speakers that have clarity (vocals and other string instruments) in output and decent mid bass (not loud though). Also, I don't like the ringing sound that pierces the ears. I am not planning to add amp or sub-woofer at the moment. Ofcourse, I plan to damp all 4 doors.

I have shortlisted as below based on reviews on the internet.

1. Morel Maximo Ultra 602 components on the front and Morel Maximo 6C coaxials on the rear
2. JL C1 650 comp on the front and JL C1 650x co-axial on the rear

I understand that JL C1 come with Aluminum tweeters and am not sure if they sound too bright / harsh when compared to Morel's Silk dome tweeters. Unfortunately, I am unable to audition neither of them in Bangalore.

Appreciate your advise. Thanks...!!!
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Old 22nd January 2022, 18:24   #14264
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I understand that JL C1 come with Aluminum tweeters and am not sure if they sound too bright / harsh when compared to Morel's Silk dome tweeters. Unfortunately, I am unable to audition neither of them in Bangalore.
Mate,
Some general points:

1.Typically, aluminium tweeters would sound sharper than silk dome tweeters.
2. Some might find silk domes dull.
3. Consider what you usually hear music on. What one are used to often affects what one likes (our ears/brains adapt)
4. Whatever you get, allow it to play for a few hours before forming an opinion - for burn in, and also to get adapted to it.

PS: I personally rarely enjoy metal tweeters. Am quite sensitive to higher frequencies.
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Old 22nd January 2022, 21:01   #14265
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Originally Posted by Poitive View Post
Mate,
Some general points:

1.Typically, aluminium tweeters would sound sharper than silk dome tweeters.
2. Some might find silk domes dull.

PS: I personally rarely enjoy metal tweeters. Am quite sensitive to higher frequencies.
Thanks for responding. I agree with you on metal tweeters sounding sharp in general. However, I read that well designed metal tweeters are far superior than silk tweeters, not sure how JL audio is placed in this area. There aren't enough JL speakers review at tbhp forum as well.
I cannot decide without hearing them personally.
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