Need Help in selecting Audio for Swift

navin · 11th October 2005, 15:03

I think it was the Phantom series.

Sam Kapasi · 11th October 2005, 15:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by mclaren1885

though they mislead u trust me they are really sweet...

This is true of ALL women....
Robert, if you saw me and recognised me, why in heaven's name didn't you come up to say hi!!??

navin · 11th October 2005, 15:22

I guess Robert was saying Hi to the girls, Sam! LOL

RobertClive · 11th October 2005, 17:58

Quote:

Robert, if you saw me and recognised me, why in heaven's name didn't you come up to say hi!!??

Oops..... Thats embarrasing. Should have met you.

RobertClive · 18th October 2005, 09:15

Every speakers I heard till now were too bright for me (except for the Velocity components. May be one of a kind. The same techician cannot reproduce it again). Also, except for blaupunkt speakers, all the other speakers I heard were driven by Pioneer HU. Would that be the reason for too bright sound.

Is it just me? Please tell me I am not alone.

Is there any way to dampen the sound a bit. I can't replace a Cap. Even if I could learn soldering, I wouldn't know where to solder. Something like a plugin before the signals reaches the tweeters would be good.

gunbir · 18th October 2005, 09:47

Did you hear the velocity comps in a car / showroom. And the others?

RobertClive · 18th October 2005, 09:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by gunbir

Did you hear the velocity comps in a car / showroom. And the others?

Good point. Velocity was in showroom. Others in Car

navin · 18th October 2005, 10:01

Robert,

A system must be taken as a whole. A good system is when the sum of parts performs better than any individual part.

Pio is known for bright sound. Now mate the Pio to a JBL for example and you may get a ear ache or if you prefer a bright sound you could be over the moon.

Bright is not bad, just bright. Just as Blue is not bad, just blue. Brightness has got a bad name in the audiophile press partly due to a degree of snobishness and partly due to the fact the most audiophile rags use western classical music as their samples and bright speakers can sound ethced esp with violin concertos for example. In addition to this systems that are overly bright can sound a bit fatiguing over long listening sessions. Most system reviewers listen to many hours of music in a day. To them brightness can sound irritating.

That said there are common combinations that you will find many people prefer. Some for example prefer the lushness of an Alpine+Infinity combo. I am one. In fact I find it a bit to lush so I attempt to tame it by modifying the crossover.

Now Infinity and JBL are both owned by the same management. I am using these 2 just as an example. I am sure, just like these 2 brands, there are other brands that also share the same management but target different market segments.

If you are feeling a little adventurous look at the review of 5010cs thread. It may offer you pointers on how to modify the sound of your speakers to your liking.

Equallisers are in general not very good. Most do more damage than good. THis is because while they can modify the frequency response to your liking they also modify the transient and phase response usually poorly. Ofcourse to every rule there are excepttions.

There are a few rare equallisers (usually parametric that work in the digital domain) that seem to do more good than harm but these are expensive.

In addition to this it is best there are as few components in the audio chain as possible. In cars this is even more important as you are working in a electrically noisy enviroment and the more the components the more the chances external electrical noises will mix with your music.

It is then best to consider the existing minimum components and replace a few of these to shape the sound to your taste.

RobertClive · 18th October 2005, 10:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by navin

Robert,
If you are feeling a little adventurous look at the review of 5010cs thread. It may offer you pointers on how to modify the sound of your speakers to your liking.

Yeah right.... Sounds very simple

...... There is no way I can do that. I don't have that kind of resource or background to do such a thing. I would prefer something less simpler.

gunbir · 18th October 2005, 10:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by RobertClive

Good point. Velocity was in showroom. Others in Car

I asked this cuz we have used the entire blau range and even the most expensive range. We did not find them to be laid back. While treble was not very harsh, upper mids were peaky, making prolonged listening a pain.

Thats what told me your listening impression was skewed by environment. In a car there is much reflectivity, surfaces are close, lots of glass. I suggest you listen to the blaus in a car before you make your final call...

Cheers

Vivekphadnis · 18th October 2005, 10:53

Which amps could RobertClive use then?

navin · 18th October 2005, 11:19

vivek, if i did not have an amp and had the budget i'd get the alpine 450. below that anything is a compromise.

robert, you said "less simpler". you want something more? just kidding. BTW I too found the Blau peaky/bright to my taste.

in any case insist on trying the speaker in your car before buying.

RobertClive · 28th October 2005, 15:59

Here I come again .................

FYI, I have still not finalized my setup.... But you know, thats quite bound to happen when you are a member of this forum.

Quick question: I am getting kenwood amp KAC-8452 (75Wx4) for 10,500 and Alpine MRV-F345 (75Wx4) for 14,500 both without bill. Is Alpine worth the extra 4K ? With that 4K, I can almost buy a sub, The requirement is to power front components and rear sub (8" x 2).

One more question: How different will two 8" sub sound from a single 8" sub apart from being loud.

navin · 28th October 2005, 16:04

Yes the Alpine is worth 4K extra only I might steal it. I intend to steal a F450 from gunbir soon! :-) just kidding!... get the Alipne!

2 8" subs will only really be about 3-6db louder than 1 8" sub. however the significant difference i found was that 1 8" sub was not doing anything in my car and 2 8" made a noticeable difference. Ideally I owuld have prefered a 12" in a box but limitationsof space had me selecting 2 smaller subs i could tuck into the sides of the car.

mclaren1885 · 28th October 2005, 16:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by navin

Yes the Alpine is worth 4K extra only I might steal it. I intend to steal a F450 from gunbir soon! :-) just kidding!... get the Alipne!

hhmm.. i too would say stick to the alpine..they are the best of the lot u have here...thank god !!!when i read the 1st half of the sentence i was worried about my amp

... hehe just kidding navin..btw navin how about a surprise in store for u soon..

11th October 2005, 15:03	#76
navin Team-BHP Support Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Mumbai Posts: 25,174 Thanked: 9,264 Times	I think it was the Phantom series.
	() Thanks

11th October 2005, 15:22	#78
navin Team-BHP Support Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Mumbai Posts: 25,174 Thanked: 9,264 Times	I guess Robert was saying Hi to the girls, Sam! LOL
	() Thanks

18th October 2005, 09:15	#80
RobertClive BHPian Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 54 Thanked: 0 Times	Every speakers I heard till now were too bright for me (except for the Velocity components. May be one of a kind. The same techician cannot reproduce it again). Also, except for blaupunkt speakers, all the other speakers I heard were driven by Pioneer HU. Would that be the reason for too bright sound. Is it just me? Please tell me I am not alone. Is there any way to dampen the sound a bit. I can't replace a Cap. Even if I could learn soldering, I wouldn't know where to solder. Something like a plugin before the signals reaches the tweeters would be good.
	() Thanks

18th October 2005, 09:47	#81
gunbir Senior - BHPian Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: New Delhi Posts: 2,465 Thanked: 32 Times	Did you hear the velocity comps in a car / showroom. And the others?
	() Thanks

18th October 2005, 10:01	#83
navin Team-BHP Support Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Mumbai Posts: 25,174 Thanked: 9,264 Times	Robert, A system must be taken as a whole. A good system is when the sum of parts performs better than any individual part. Pio is known for bright sound. Now mate the Pio to a JBL for example and you may get a ear ache or if you prefer a bright sound you could be over the moon. Bright is not bad, just bright. Just as Blue is not bad, just blue. Brightness has got a bad name in the audiophile press partly due to a degree of snobishness and partly due to the fact the most audiophile rags use western classical music as their samples and bright speakers can sound ethced esp with violin concertos for example. In addition to this systems that are overly bright can sound a bit fatiguing over long listening sessions. Most system reviewers listen to many hours of music in a day. To them brightness can sound irritating. That said there are common combinations that you will find many people prefer. Some for example prefer the lushness of an Alpine+Infinity combo. I am one. In fact I find it a bit to lush so I attempt to tame it by modifying the crossover. Now Infinity and JBL are both owned by the same management. I am using these 2 just as an example. I am sure, just like these 2 brands, there are other brands that also share the same management but target different market segments. If you are feeling a little adventurous look at the review of 5010cs thread. It may offer you pointers on how to modify the sound of your speakers to your liking. Equallisers are in general not very good. Most do more damage than good. THis is because while they can modify the frequency response to your liking they also modify the transient and phase response usually poorly. Ofcourse to every rule there are excepttions. There are a few rare equallisers (usually parametric that work in the digital domain) that seem to do more good than harm but these are expensive. In addition to this it is best there are as few components in the audio chain as possible. In cars this is even more important as you are working in a electrically noisy enviroment and the more the components the more the chances external electrical noises will mix with your music. It is then best to consider the existing minimum components and replace a few of these to shape the sound to your taste.
	() Thanks

18th October 2005, 10:53	#86
Vivekphadnis BHPian Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 690 Thanked: 2 Times	Which amps could RobertClive use then?
	() Thanks

18th October 2005, 11:19	#87
navin Team-BHP Support Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Mumbai Posts: 25,174 Thanked: 9,264 Times	vivek, if i did not have an amp and had the budget i'd get the alpine 450. below that anything is a compromise. robert, you said "less simpler". you want something more? just kidding. BTW I too found the Blau peaky/bright to my taste. in any case insist on trying the speaker in your car before buying. Last edited by navin : 18th October 2005 at 11:21.
	() Thanks

28th October 2005, 15:59	#88
RobertClive BHPian Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 54 Thanked: 0 Times	Here I come again ................. FYI, I have still not finalized my setup.... But you know, thats quite bound to happen when you are a member of this forum. Quick question: I am getting kenwood amp KAC-8452 (75Wx4) for 10,500 and Alpine MRV-F345 (75Wx4) for 14,500 both without bill. Is Alpine worth the extra 4K ? With that 4K, I can almost buy a sub, The requirement is to power front components and rear sub (8" x 2). One more question: How different will two 8" sub sound from a single 8" sub apart from being loud. Last edited by RobertClive : 28th October 2005 at 16:00.
	() Thanks

28th October 2005, 16:04	#89
navin Team-BHP Support Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Mumbai Posts: 25,174 Thanked: 9,264 Times	Yes the Alpine is worth 4K extra only I might steal it. I intend to steal a F450 from gunbir soon! :-) just kidding!... get the Alipne! 2 8" subs will only really be about 3-6db louder than 1 8" sub. however the significant difference i found was that 1 8" sub was not doing anything in my car and 2 8" made a noticeable difference. Ideally I owuld have prefered a 12" in a box but limitationsof space had me selecting 2 smaller subs i could tuck into the sides of the car.
	() Thanks

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