[Jeroen]

Originally Posted by Sutripta

Dual rotor helicopters - what sort of noise does it make?

Think classic Royal Enfield thump, but airborne.

The Youtube video don't do it justice

https://youtu.be/V1EYPy67qOU

Rijen, where my office is located, is next to an air force base which operate Chinooks. We see and hear them almost every day. They also come right across our home!

It really is a thumping noise!

[Sutripta]

So still a chopper!

Sutripta

[skanchan95]

The CH-47 is a very versatile and capable platform. Some were even modified to be used as a gunship in the Vietnam War by the US Army - sort of a helicopter version of the AC-130 Spectre!!! Couple of Window mounted miniguns, machine guns, grenade launchers, machine gun nests on the ramp and rocket pods on small stubby wings.

[skanchan95]

Single seat Rafale BS003 spotted. The Rafales are expected to land In India by July end.

[ads11]

Originally Posted by skanchan95

Single seat Rafale BS003 spotted. The Rafales are expected to land In India by July end.

Sweet, is the IAF going to do a ferry flight operation to bring them over? Or will it be done by the French?

Great photo to see the clean lines of the undercarriage, especially with the AIF roundels visible now under the wings.

[sagarpadaki]

Originally Posted by ads11

Sweet, is the IAF going to do a ferry flight operation to bring them over? Or will it be done by the French?

Great photo to see the clean lines of the undercarriage, especially with the AIF roundels visible now under the wings.

I think IAF may send a Globemaster to carry them home than a ferry flight

[ads11]

Originally Posted by sagarpadaki

I think IAF may send a Globemaster to carry them home than a ferry flight

Interesting. Are you sure? I'm not familiar with entire combat jets being moved in this manner. I know cargo aircraft are regularly used to ship large components like engines across but not this. Guess they'll disassemble and reassemble upon arrival. I figured they'd send a tanker and have them escorted back in a traditional ferry flight format. Maybe with a stop or two in friendly territory to give the pilots a break.

[AlphaKilo]

Stupid question to the experts (I am not familiar with new acquisitions or deliveries rather on flying these machines).:

- How are the mountings for the hardpoints delivered? (like the missile railings or bomb racks?) Along with the bird while first delivery happens or the operator can make some on their own later?
- Are they part of the purchase (like free accessories) or should they be bought seperately?
- The modifications for missiles and associated racks/rails, do they get certified by Dassault or just the Defence Airworthiness agency's go is enough?

[Gansan]

Originally Posted by skanchan95

Single seat Rafale BS003 spotted. The Rafales are expected to land In India by July end.

How many expected to be delivered? And what is that projection on the tail?

[AlphaKilo]

Originally Posted by Gansan

How many expected to be delivered? And what is that projection on the tail?

That's an RWR (radar warning receiver) part of the ECM (Electronic Counter Measure suite). In the first batch shall be the 4 that were planned to be delivered in May, mostly likely in fly away condition.

[skanchan95]

Originally Posted by sagarpadaki

I think IAF may send a Globemaster to carry them home than a ferry flight

Could be done, but I dont know if a Rafale(with its wings removed) can fit inside a C-17. But then it probably is not practical and economical to send C-17s everytime to get a single fighter. Although the possibility of sending a transport aircraft for ferry support is very much there.

An RAAF Legacy F/A-18A Hornet being unloaded from an RCAF C-17 in Canada where it will be re-assembled and fly with the RCAF.


A disassembled IAF Gnat were transported that way [on C-119 packets from UK to India and there is a very famous B/W picture of an otherwise complete Gnat (with its wings removed and kept by its side) in the cargo hold of an IAF C-119].

Originally Posted by ads11

Sweet, is the IAF going to do a ferry flight operation to bring them over? Or will it be done by the French?

All the Mirage 2000s were ferried in batches by IAF pilots with an IL-76 for support. The direct supply Jaguar IS/ITs were ferried by a mix of IAF pilots and BAe test pilots. The direct supply MiGs(except the Foxbats) were shipped in ships in knocked down kits which were assembled in India.

Like the Mirages, the Rafales too will mostly be flown in by IAF pilots who currently are being trained in France and will form the core of the two Rafale Sqdns - Nos. 17 & 108.

Originally Posted by Gansan

How many expected to be delivered?

Total of 36 are to be delivered - 28 single seat Rafale EHs & 8 dual seat DHs. Four are scheduled to be delivered in the first batch in July.

Originally Posted by Gansan

And what is that projection on the tail?

[Ricci]

Originally Posted by skanchan95

Like the Mirages, the Rafales too will mostly be flown in by IAF pilots who currently are being trained in France and will form the core of the two Rafale Sqdns - Nos. 17 & 108.
Total of 36 are to be delivered - 28 single seat Rafale EHs & 8 dual seat DHs. Four are scheduled to be delivered in the first batch in July.

No. 17 Squadron is at Ambala and No. 108 apparently at Pathankot. Usually the latest jets in squadron service have been at Lohegaon AFS, Pune , as it was with the MiG-29 and Su-30MKI , though for the Mirages it was Gwalior.
There go my hopes of seeing and sitting in a Rafale anytime soon. :(

[himanshugoswami]

I am really surprised that IAF is placing its most potent, cutting edge and expensive warbirds on forward air bases. They may have hardened shelters and all, but given their proximity to the border, reaction time in case of an air raid or a missile strike will be very less. Given that the Rafale is twin engine, spool up time will also be relatively longer.

I'm sure the IAF brass knows what they are doing, but from a layman's perspective, it just seems to make more sense basing these at a base like bareiley or even converting Hindon into a fighter base.

Both are close enough to the border to have the Rafales enter the theater quickly, yet are far enough to five IAF enough reaction time for effective countermeasures in case of a strike.

Also, the Rafales are not being used as an interceptor by the IAF, so all in all, it buggers belief as to why Ambala and Udhampur.

[skanchan95]

Originally Posted by Ricci

No. 17 Squadron is at Ambala and No. 108 apparently at Pathankot. Usually the latest jets in squadron service have been at Lohegaon AFS, Pune , as it was with the MiG-29 and Su-30MKI , though for the Mirages it was Gwalior.
There go my hopes of seeing and sitting in a Rafale anytime soon. :(

Pathankot or Hasimara? I read 101 Sqdn will be based in Hasimara( a former base of MiG-27s in the east).

[Ricci]

Originally Posted by skanchan95

Pathankot or Hasimara? I read 101 Sqdn will be based in Hasimara( a former base of MiG-27s in the east).

It's 108 sqd not 101, the one that's been reinstated to get the Rafales, right? Haven't tallied with BR but wikipidia shows Pathankot.

Originally Posted by himanshugoswami

I am really surprised that IAF is placing its most potent, cutting edge and expensive warbirds on forward air bases. Given that the Rafale is twin engine, spool up time will also be relatively longer.

That's likely not much of a factor. Twin engine planes can start up and taxi on one engine, while spooling up the other engine by the time they reach the runway threshold. Unless your jet is sitting ready on the ORP situated right by the threshold, a single engine isn't going to give much of a headstart.

Yes, usually new jets are better off based deep inland where the IAF can get familiar with them with less tapping (electronics/signals gathers, radar tracks for guessing kinematic performance) from neighbours.